5 Months Later, This 4-Bedroom Lincoln Square SFH Is Still Available: 2164 W. Leland

Last April, we chattered about this 4-bedroom single family home at 2164 W. Leland in Lincoln Square and wondered how “hot” the Lincoln Square market was.

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See our prior chatter here.

It was a good chatter about who are knifecatchers, what single family homes in Lincoln Square should cost, and the attributes of the house (which many of you liked).

We learned from the listing agent, Eric Rojas, that it has space pak cooling, a mudroom and it is not located on the El side of Leland.

Nearly 6 months later, the house is still available and has been reduced $24,100.

If you recall, this is considered “real” Lincoln Square as it’s just a block and a half to the shops and restaurants on Lincoln and also easy access to several brown line El stops.

The house has had updates including a custom kitchen with concrete counter tops and stainless steel appliances. (However, according to the 2008 listing- those updates had already been done by the time of that sale.)

The upstairs bathroom has a double vanity and skylights along with a claw foot tub.

Built on an oversized 37.5×123 lot, the house has a two car garage and space pak cooling.

The basement is finished and has a half bath and a recreation room and a bedroom.

Last April, the house was listed as a 3-bedroom and is now listed as a 4-bedroom.

There was an “office” in the basement in the prior listing, so I’m assuming that is now bedroom #4.

In April, some of you thought this house would sell quickly.

Has the market cooled in Lincoln Square?

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Eric Rojas at Prudential Rubloff still has the listing. See more pictures here.

2164 W. Leland: 3 bedrooms, 2 full and 2 half baths, 2 car garage, no square footage listed

  • Sold in August 1995 for $209,000
  • Sold in October 1997 for $264,500
  • Sold in August 2008 for $805,500
  • Originally listed in April 2011 for $799,000
  • Reduced
  • Currently listed for $774,900
  • Taxes of $7925
  • Space Pak Cooling
  • Bedroom #1: 12×15 (second floor)
  • Bedroom #2: 12×13 (second floor)
  • Bedroom #3: 11×12 (second floor)
  • Bedroom #4: 15×15 (lower level)
  • Recreation room: 15×27 (lower level)

284 Responses to “5 Months Later, This 4-Bedroom Lincoln Square SFH Is Still Available: 2164 W. Leland”

  1. When pricing properties, most people look at the amount of money put into a place and then price accordingly. People should think about the type of person buying a property. Is this the type of property that someone with a 200-250k sustainable income would buy? Of course not – so don’t rehab a place like this. This is a place someone with a 100-150k income would buy.

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  2. I’m surprised how many real estate agents are willing to stick with a property that is obviously overpriced for so long. Six months and only one price reduction?

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  3. Seems really overpriced.

    But I’m not the target buyer for an old 3 BR frame house for 3/4 million (in Lincoln Square, or anywhere else).

    $675k??

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  4. I am not sure the agents have much of a say. The seller choses the price. Also at this point they have done most of the marketing and cannot just walk away.
    IMHO what makes this place sit and sit is the unattractive exterior. The price is too high for what my husband calls the shed or garage construction. I think he has a point. This is not what a house is supposed to be made of.

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  5. To me anything over 600K is money wasted on this house.

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  6. Cute house; looks like a decently executed gut rehab within past decade. But current owners bought at tippy-top of housing bubble. Perhaps household is now headed to suburbs. If home is still occupied, then listing photos suggest that one child might be of school-age; perhaps two tuitions at Montessori School is just too much carrying-cost to live in Chicago with two kids in a single family house. Or perhaps a dual-income household has since faced realities of a single-income budget.

    Not enough buyers at this price point to absorb the glut of properties. Taxes seem really low here too.

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  7. Lincoln Square is a very cozy hood but I think this place is overpriced by at least 10% and as much as 25%.

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  8. way too expensive. I like Lincoln Sq just fine, but if a central Avondale rehab SFH a block or two from the Blue line at 400K is crazy, then this is crazy’s second cousin.

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  9. from the prior thread I said this might move at 725. I think at this point 699 is a better figure. School is an issue here.

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  10. So many homes, so many sellers, so few buyers…..clients today were telling me that homes in their Will county sudivisions have higher tax escrows than PI payments.

    TThrow in a few HAMP mods and we can postpone price discoveryfor up to. 40 years. At 2pc interest.

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  11. You can walk through the home with Eric in this YoChicago video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEhzmTCOwM4

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  12. by the way, M.C. Escher called and he wants his deck back – wtf is up with that thing, especially considering how much space they have/had?

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  13. “IMHO what makes this place sit and sit is the unattractive exterior. The price is too high for what my husband calls the shed or garage construction. I think he has a point. This is not what a house is supposed to be made of.”

    What in particular about it is poorly constructed?

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  14. I’d consider it at 500k, this still seems super high priced although I know some people here love lincoln square, its still not a green zone desireable area

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  15. The 1995 price, rehabbed 10 years later or not, tells you all nearly all you need to know about the real estate bubble. I can find similar properties up and down the california coast. Small rehabbed house in major city. Crappy schools, less than prime location on a less than prime lot. Bells and whistles and appreciation disguise the insane inflation of prices.

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  16. We prefer brick, steel, and cement. Now I understand why each time there is a tornado half of the city flies off : )

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  17. Let’s face it – the vast majority of people with kids are moving to the suburbs. They don’t have enough money to buy a decent sized place in a good school district and they don’t have enough money to send their kids to private school (if they live in a bad school district). Chicago schools are not going to improve. The writing is on the wall – it just remains to be seen how long people will continue to be in denial…

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  18. Surprised noone has brought up the recent cop attack in north center. If southside natives are willing to attack a cop who catches them breaking into a car imagine what they’d do to the locals…4200 n ravenswood area fwiw

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  19. absolute nonsense.

    I know just tons upon tons of people who are in Chicago by way of a job or college who detest the suburbs even more than I do (yes I know, they all aren’t the same), they simply don’t see the appeal, fancy schools or no.

    the only writing on the wall is gas will be $5 a gallon before you know it, then we’ll see how attractive the sprawling sidewalk-challenged exurbs are.

    “Let’s face it – the vast majority of people with kids are moving to the suburbs. “

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  20. Bob – it’s called “living in the city”. This crap is going to go on in any part of the city. This was an isolated incident. However, the city, itself IS much more dangerous than the burbs – but everyone already knows that.

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  21. Isolated incident? ugh no many cops have been attacked and/or killed on this year alone. and I know I wouldn’t want to drop 700+ large on a house near where this happened.

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  22. and without the help of that good samartian that cop might’ve well been killed. food for thought.

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  23. You are a complete and utter tool, whichever “clio” cylon-cronie you happen to be.

    not only do I have a child, my wife is from the burbs.

    next!

    “skeptic, I doubt you have children. If you do, then you are a selfish ass. Suburban schools are VASTLY superior to cps (and don’t give me the bs about a few select cps schools – it is doubtful that someones kid is going to get it – even more doubtful that they will do well).”

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  24. as the economy stays poor criminals on the streets are becoming increasingly more brazen & emboldened. I think this spells increasing trouble for RE valuations. HD you may well afterfall be able to get that SFH in north center at a price you can afford in a few years. the question is though by then will you still want it..

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  25. ” If southside natives are willing to attack a cop who catches them breaking into a car imagine what they’d do to the locals”

    Um, dude’s address was 4200 block of *NORTH* Kenmore. Will likely soon be a PO Box in Joliet.

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  26. Lots of the comments about this property are unfairly negative. We know that miumiu doesn’t like frame and siding, but it doesn’t mean that every property that is siding over frame is worthless. For what this is, it’s a decent property. Location is excellent other than the schools issue.

    I think that the sale price for this place should start with a 6 instead of a 7, but I think that someone will bite around $670k or so.

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  27. “as the economy stays poor criminals on the streets are becoming increasingly more brazen & emboldened”

    yeah either that or you’re just getting older, crankier and the access to all information has increased dramatically so you actually hear about these things now

    and if you look at the crime stats, homicides and all crimes are down and the economy raelly doesn’t have much to do with it because even during the boom days of the 90’s homicides were WAY up

    homicides per year in chicago
    1990: 851
    1991: 927
    1992: 943
    1993: 931
    1994: 929
    1995: 827
    1996: 789
    1997: 759
    1998: 704
    1999: 641
    2000: 628
    2001: 666
    2002: 647
    2003: 598
    2004: 448
    2005: 449
    2006: 467
    2007: 442
    2008: 510
    2009: 458
    2010: 435

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  28. Maybe its just that attacks & homicides on cops get far more press…still what are uptown junkies doing west over by ravenswood.

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  29. “access to all information has increased dramatically so you actually hear about these things now”

    Cop that was attacked was on Rahm’s security detail, so, yeah, in the old days would have never heard about it.

    Was wondering what all the “police activity” was Saturday night/Sunday morning.

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  30. Yes, I agree that its overpriced… I love the area but too far from the lake (for us personally) to justify this price. I would have thought it would be closer to $500K, then we would def be interested.

    There is a property in LS/Ravenswood (2104 W. Sunnyside) that is in a great location that I think would be a great investment for way less than this place. Put $100K into it (guessing) and you have a great home that is customized to your taste for under $500K.

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  31. “what are uptown junkies doing west over by ravenswood.”

    Coming by da mare’s house, to ask for a job.

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  32. “Coming by da mare’s house, to ask for a job.”

    he was there to give tips on racing in triathlons, and suggestions on how to stop the teachers union from striking

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  33. HD, did you happen to see this place. This would be a fun one to rehab. Only cons I see are proximity to Irving and no alley. It will be interesting to see what it looks like when it reappears, if at all…

    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/3942-N-Lowell-Ave-60641/home/13459089

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  34. “There is a property in LS/Ravenswood (2104 W. Sunnyside) that is in a great location that I think would be a great investment for way less than this place. Put $100K into it (guessing) and you have a great home that is customized to your taste for under $500K.”

    Short lot with no alley access. No garage, and no chance for one.

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  35. “HD, did you happen to see this place. This would be a fun one to rehab. Only cons I see are proximity to Irving and no alley. It will be interesting to see what it looks like when it reappears, if at all…”

    There was a big conversation on this one involving HD, clio, and westloopelo a week or two ago.

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  36. hey, if the price was $100K+ lower I don’t think people would be quite so brutal – but at the price listed, the criticism is IMO justified.

    “Lots of the comments about this property are unfairly negative. We know that miumiu doesn’t like frame and siding, but it doesn’t mean that every property that is siding over frame is worthless. For what this is, it’s a decent property. Location is excellent other than the schools issue.

    I think that the sale price for this place should start with a 6 instead of a 7, but I think that someone will bite around $670k or so.”

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  37. “Lots of the comments about this property are unfairly negative. We know that miumiu doesn’t like frame and siding, but it doesn’t mean that every property that is siding over frame is worthless. For what this is, it’s a decent property. Location is excellent other than the schools issue.

    I think that the sale price for this place should start with a 6 instead of a 7, but I think that someone will bite around $670k or so.”

    Yep

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  38. “Short lot with no alley access. No garage, and no chance for one.”

    Oh, missed that (major) detail. Hmmm, wonder what it would take to sell then…

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  39. again more proof that each “version” of clio is as bad as all the others.

    I am done with cribchatter as its not fun anymore with this jagoff posting here.

    later yall, and remember NW side trumps all hoods (even burban ones)!!!

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  40. formerroscoevillager on August 29th, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    best line my wife had for me: “you know, you might need to dial back the ‘I hate the suburbs’ rhetoric now that we bought a house out here. I want to have some friends”

    some Burban schools are superior to some CPS but only in some resepcts and not by simple geography. If you have access to a great CPS school that meets your needs it will be fine. If you don’t have that then you are probably looking for alternatives anyway. None of your decisions are likely to be driven by what the chatterati have posted here.

    “Fuck off…”

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  41. Competition at the “best” CPS schools is ridiculous (competition to get in and competition to do well) – you are taking the best and brightest from a LARGE pool and asking your kids to compete with them. Why not send them to a school with GREAT amentities, GREAT teachers and GREAT opportunities in the suburbs. There are many many school systems out in the burbs which are great. Again, if you don’t want to move for personal reasons, don’t = but don’t fucking tell me that you value your kid’s education over anything else, because you don’t…. let’s call a spade a spade.

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  42. So you’re saying, if your kids can’t compete in Chicago-style heat, run to the burbs.

    Check.

    “Competition at the “best” CPS schools is ridiculous (competition to get in and competition to do well) – you are taking the best and brightest from a LARGE pool and asking your kids to compete with them. “

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  43. “at least they aren’t forced into teaching “certain topics” in their kindergarten classes”

    Who’s fever dream is that?

    “later yall”

    Groove! Come back!

    The internet is a tool; no better or no worse than any other tool: an axe, a shovel or anything. The internet is as good or as bad as the man using it. Remember that.

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  44. bjorn, as with most comments about schools on here, I think you have over-generalized again. Many schools may be like that, but there are quite a few good schools where if students do not succeed, they do fail and teachers and administrators do push students to learn what is needed to survive in the world and in college.

    Clio, your statement is an oversimplification as well. Many suburban schools are better than many city schools, but there is also the number one public schcol in the state in the city. Higher ranked than some “dream” schools in the suburbs. While those schools may not be attendance area schools, if you are a couple of bright parents and you have a child that you encourage to do well, it isn’t too unlikely that they can get into a similar school. I also know many suburban schools you would not want to send your children to. Ever heard of Proviso East? I’d rather my kids live in the city!

    Talk about being sick of things…I am sick of the massive overgeneralizations!

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  45. “Competition at the “best” CPS schools is ridiculous (competition to get in and competition to do well) – you are taking the best and brightest from a LARGE pool and asking your kids to compete with them. Why not send them to a school with GREAT amentities, GREAT teachers and GREAT opportunities in the suburbs.”

    There isn’t competition in suburban schools? I went to a highly rated SUBURBAN high school, and there definitely was competition. A competitive school is going to be….COMPETITIVE. Wow, what an idea!

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  46. “I am done with cribchatter as its not fun anymore with this jagoff posting here.”

    Don’t do it. At least not from someone elses provocation. Do it cause you don’t have time, or the computer screen makes you eyes cross-eyed. But don’t give someone the satisfaction that they got to you and cleared you from a forum by getting under your skin. Lie and say you just bought an empty lot in the NW side and plan to build a house by yourself and won’t have time until you are done.

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  47. it’s quite clear that Clio interprets “people having more money” with “GREATNESS.”

    well, as a kid who went to St. Igantius, let me tell ya – plenty of rich kids are dumb as friggin stumps.

    our theory was the old trophy-wife syndrome, dude with money marries for looks not brains. makes for attractive, but not always very sharp, progeny.

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  48. OK – I think people understand the issues here, but, given the immaturity and lack of understanding displayed the majority who post, let me re-explain:

    1. The vast majority of people who read this site likely make between 70-150k, live and love the city and have 0-3 small children.

    2. This demographic is likely unable to afford a house/condo/townhouse more than 400-500k max – this is either going to buy a ridculously small place in a good CPS school district or an ok place in a bad CPS school district.

    OK – follow me so far?

    What are the alternatives?

    The most obvious one (and the one that Sabrina keeps bringing up) is moving to a suburb (a nicer one like PArk Ridge, Western Springs, LaGrange, nicer parts of evanston, glencoe, highland park, downers grove, naperville, oak park, river forest, etc etc etc) where you CAN buy a decent sized house and where the school system is decent.

    There are no valid arguments to this topic – there aren’t.

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  49. Fairly decent argument Clio, except that you said #1, live and love the city then suggest Western Springs, Lagrange, Downers Grove, Naperville…

    I’ll give you Park Ridge (maybe), Evanston, Oak Park, River Forest (although 400k there is difficult). However for many that “love” the city even these suburbs are low on the totem pole.

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  50. hey guess what clio I went to a precious suburban grade school in a very nice white bred suburb and the 3rd and 4th grade teachers were AWFUL tenure queens that couldn’t give a flying shit about anyone they were teaching, they were awful

    so even the supposed best schools in the state can still be bad due to a few bad apples

    i think if you can live in a good to decent CPS school where you don’t have to worry about your kid getting hit by a random drive by shooting, and if you as a parent have the time and energy to make them the best students possible by working with them, you and your kids will be fine.

    One thing bored housewives love to do is complain about the smallest things, so its no surpriise to hear these “horror stories” about their precious little timmy not getting straight A’s in K-8 because its always the teachers fault right?

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  51. “i think if you can live in a good to decent CPS school where you don’t have to worry about your kid getting hit by a random drive by shooting, and if you as a parent have the time and energy to make them the best students possible by working with them, you and your kids will be fine.”

    ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!! THIS IS THE DUMBEST STATEMENT EVER!!! You might as well say ” I think that if you can make a million dollars a year and have a hot wife and be really good looking and have a great family and are in great health that you should be fine” The criteria you outline are out of reach for 99% of the people out there.

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  52. Sonies, is again correct.

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  53. The alternatives/nuances to your simplistic, dumbed-down argument would be:

    Renting – which impacts property values as if I can’t afford a SFH in the alleged “green zone” perhaps I can afford a 2 or 3 flat due to cash flow.

    Not acting like CPS is just completely unfathomable – it took me oh, 15 minutes to fill out the form for the lottery/magnet schools. Right now, there are spots open in quite a few decent schools, but you’d only know that if you were on the prowl. It really isn’t as hard as you/others make it sound to a) get your kid in a better school than your local one, and b) to spend an extra 15 – 30 minutes a day in transit due to the school being a bit further away.

    look at my situation – am I sending my daughter to the crapola local? No. is it really gonna kill me to spend an extra 10 minutes in the am and pm to drop her and pick her up in Lake View? nope.

    “What are the alternatives?…

    There are no valid arguments to this topic – there aren’t.”

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  54. Clio doth protest too much, methinks.

    “ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!! THIS IS THE DUMBEST STATEMENT EVER!!! You might as well say ” I think that if you can make a million dollars a year and have a hot wife and be really good looking and have a great family and are in great health that you should be fine” The criteria you outline are out of reach for 99% of the people out there.”

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  55. I don’t like the idea of public schools even if I lived in the best suburban district, I would not choose a public school. Private, non-religious, schools make the most sense to me. I wonder what percentage of middle class and up families living in Chicago send their kids to private school.

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  56. … because Clio is most likely, as Groove points out, an aggregate of numerous suburban-shilling realtors.

    “What I can’t figure out is why this topic of clio’s is coming up “now”, as in 2011. Wasn’t this same dynamic always an issue, even in 2003? It’s not like only people living in 2011 have kids 1-3.”

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  57. skeptic,
    some people don’t have the freedom to drive to pick up/drop off kids, etc. Also, most people will have to drive more than 10-15 minutes each way out of their way for this (you are kidding yourself if you think the majority of people live this close to good schools – have you ever been in chicago traffic in the morning or afternoon?).

    Regardless, it doesn’t really matter to me (other than the fact that I find it completely amusing that people are still clinging to any shred of hope to avoid the inevitable move to the suburbs)!!

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  58. actually clio better move out of highland park, its unsafe! gangs of roving smash and grabbers are terrorizing soccer game parking lots!

    highlandpark.patch.com/articles/smash-and-grab-spree-hits-highland-park

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  59. It seems like clio prefers suburbs. Who the F cares? Others prefer City life and there are plenty of good public school options for those of us who do.

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  60. formerroscoevillager on August 29th, 2011 at 2:12 pm

    I went to a grade school that presently rates a “2” on greatschools.com, then went to Catholic for middle and half of high then the second half at a public (suburban) HS ranking a 10. I went to a big 10 college for a year then took a year off, took community college classes then went to a small liberal arts school, got a finance degree and now make the big bucks. ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE!

    Of course, I also traveled the world throughout, moved all over the country, and read a ton of books. I went to museums, camped under the stars, stayed in 5 star hotels and even became incredibly proficient at finding great hostels before the intertubez were able to help out. I’d say it is waaay more about life experience rather than the actual school you attend. Unless all you ever do is attend school, then it better be a good one.

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  61. Why does every thread seem to disintegrate into an argument between the same few posters?

    I wouldn’t mind so much if it weren’t always the same people and the same topics. It’s getting so boring and predictable. They should take it somewhere else. Or at least try to be a little more polite.

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  62. he’s just fun to pick on. what kind of ignoramus would post this:

    “some people don’t have the freedom to drive to pick up/drop off kids, etc. Also, most people will have to drive more than 10-15 minutes each way out of their way for this (you are kidding yourself if you think the majority of people live this close to good schools – have you ever been in chicago traffic in the morning or afternoon?). ”

    ever seen 290 backing up in rush hour? and maybe Clio can’t drive more than 5 mph as he/she is always on a cell phone, but 10 – 15 minutes will get you pretty danged far in Chicago by car if you’re not a rube.

    “It seems like clio prefers suburbs. Who the F cares? Others prefer City life and there are plenty of good public school options for those of us who do.”

    “It seems like clio prefers suburbs. Who the F cares? Others prefer City life and there are plenty of good public school options for those of us who do.”

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  63. you mean, like taking it to a website dedicated to suburban real estate?

    I’m willing to bet a kidney that Groove never (I sure don’t) goes trolling on suburban blogs.

    “I wouldn’t mind so much if it weren’t always the same people and the same topics. It’s getting so boring and predictable. They should take it somewhere else. Or at least try to be a little more polite.”

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  64. vlahos, not true at all – I hate the burbs – LOVE the city – but I am a little older and little more selfless than most here. I made these sacrifices for my kids. Do I like it in the suburbs – NOT…AT….ALL – I hate everything about them (from a personal standpoint) – but you make sacrifices. Also, I actually have the means to live wherever – most people don’t – so I don’t understand the thinking there. I want to smack them upside the head – they are dumber than the idiots who bought the 2/2s in the mid 2000s…..

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  65. Dan-Deuce:

    I’m doing my best to walk the walk. I agree with you.

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  66. “They should take it somewhere else. Or at least try to be a little more polite.”

    Untwist your panties, pick up your purse and move on, little girl….

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  67. OK, I post that and now I’m already going to break it:

    I didn’t realize that Oak Brook had a special relationship with Exeter.

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  68. clio is truly one of the greatest trolls the internets has ever seen

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  69. “I didn’t realize that Oak Brook had a special relationship with Exeter”

    OK – I give you credit for bringing up this valid point- but this has more to do with a terrible family dynamic (betwen me and my ex-wife and between me and my kids) than it has to do with oak brook/hinsdale schools. My ex-wife and kids are just like you guys – they don’t seem to understand simple points and, when you try to nicely correct them, they act like wild animals/brats!!

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  70. ever think that maybe, just maybe you are the one who is wrong?

    oh right, you’re a narcissist

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  71. I’m not wrong – look at the points I make – you can’t argue with them (I know you can argue with my style/language – but you really can’t argue with my points). Sorry – but if you listen to me, you will go far. Life isn’t that hard – but people make it into something that is impossible. Remember, just sacrifice a little for an overall better life – you will be happier.

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  72. I’m not against arguments, really. Just the mean-spirited kind. Disagree with me – fine. But do so respectfully.

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  73. “I don’t like the idea of public schools”

    Jenny, I’m curious. besides living close to work what do you like?

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  74. Dan#2 – uhhh please re-read everyone’s posts. ONe of the nastiest people on the internet is the beloved “groove”. Skeptic, sonies, valasko, JJJ, JMM, southbound, and Bob can also be incredibly vile and nasty. Seriously, re-read the posts.

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  75. Someone is hurting G’s feelings. I’m guessing it’s intentional.

    And it’s like no one remembers Stevo.

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  76. i remember steavo being smarter than cleo, but maybe I’m just sentimental.

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  77. $500K is too low. Its on a 37.5 Ft Lot with a side drive. Do you guys know how rare that is in Lincoln Square?!?!

    $650 – 675K in my opinion will sell it. $775 is a little rich for a Frame House probably classified to the assessors as a 1.5 Story.

    Not a bad place though. Nice finishes

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  78. oh, and ps: proving sonies’ point. Dan was addressing everyone.

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  79. FormerRoscoeVillager — “Unless all you ever do is attend school, then it better be a good one.”

    I couldn’t agree more! I’m a lurker, not a poster. I live in the city and where we send our kids to school is a fraction of what we consider our overall responsbility to educate our children. It’s important but so is every little thing we do in our household that encourages learning!

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  80. ok, I know feeding trolls is wrong.

    but clio, “I like it in the suburbs – NOT…AT….ALL – I hate everything about them (from a personal standpoint)”

    Then why live there and advocate suburban life? And worse, why try to sell it to others??

    Life is way too short to hate ANY part of your day. kids or no kids.

    Maybe this explains your confrontational mindset. you seem unhappy.

    Maybe a nice SFH in Bell or Blaine District would help you chill the F out!

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  81. CH, as for schools, I like socially liberal schools where kids get to choose when and how they want to learn. In the end, I believe the family and the child’s personality determine how well a kid will do in life, not the school. I hated K-12 and I would want to spare my kids. My biggest take away from K-12 was how to be manipulative.

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  82. “. . .but I am a little older and little more selfless than most here. I made these sacrifices for my kids.”

    Low to mid 40’s: not so august a station in life to be dropping the “I am a little older” knowledge.

    selfless =/= Lambo, oversized suburban spreads (how many light bulbs?).

    I’ve gathered that you don’t live with your kids. But I presume they live in Oak Brook, correct? In the Chicago area, at the very least, I’m sure. Just curious, what suburban Chicago school do they attend?

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  83. “$650 – 675K in my opinion will sell it. $775 is a little rich for a Frame House probably classified to the assessors as a 1.5 Story. ”

    It’s like skeptic(?) said–were it asking $675k, most here would like it pretty well. It’s just sort of a tweener–were it a bit larger, and just as nicely finished, $800+ would be totally plausible, but it *looks* smallish for $775.

    And, I think I asked last time w/o a response–What is the basement like?

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  84. “$650 – 675K in my opinion will sell it. $775 is a little rich for a Frame House probably classified to the assessors as a 1.5 Story. ”

    “It’s like skeptic(?) said–were it asking $675k, most here would like it pretty well. It’s just sort of a tweener–were it a bit larger, and just as nicely finished, $800+ would be totally plausible, but it *looks* smallish for $775.”

    I know it’s all ifs, ands and buts, but, if there were a good school, it would be sold easily and for not too much off current ask. It’s just a touch overpriced, but not that much. Needs a little something, school or more space. Or a wee price cut.

    “And, I think I asked last time w/o a response–What is the basement like?”

    There is a photo and floorplan, but you prob knew that. Looks basic-ish to me. Not at level of finishes of rest of house.

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  85. Long-time Listener, First-time Caller on August 29th, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    AMEN!!!!

    Why does every thread seem to disintegrate into an argument between the same few posters?

    I wouldn’t mind so much if it weren’t always the same people and the same topics. It’s getting so boring and predictable. They should take it somewhere else. Or at least try to be a little more polite.

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  86. “CH, as for schools, I like socially liberal schools where kids get to choose when and how they want to learn”

    are…..you…..kidding…..me?!!!!! kids don’t know what they need – you have to tell them. Good Lord – I hope to God you don’t have kids – they will grow up to be completely screwed up!!!!

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  87. anonny,

    kids grew up in L.A. w/mom. Daughter at chadwick school, son went to exeter but is now in college in CT. Bought in Oak Brook bc wanted them to have a world class education, but the ex-wife is completely unreasonable and didn’t want the kids with me.

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  88. “There is a photo and floorplan, but you prob knew that. Looks basic-ish to me. Not at level of finishes of rest of house.”

    I was looking at the floorplan–which has no attached pic for the basement–and just missed the pic of the couch and ottomans. That, then, is enough of an answer, and one more reason that it’s a touch high except for the person who thinks everything is *exactly* what they’d pick–whatever you feel about “sewage-level living”, were the basement here at ~80% of the finish level of the rest of the house, someone else would like it and would pay ~$725 for it.

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  89. 675K on a 37.5 Lot in LS. Thats what Im sticking with.

    Its Broker Owned which is why it hasn’t dropped in price. He/She is unwilling to part ways and lose money. And lose money they will on this place.

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  90. gringozecarioca on August 29th, 2011 at 3:40 pm

    I gotta agree with Groove. There is a whole new super-sleeze factor that never existed before. Makes me feel dirty with every link.

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  91. ze – re-read the posts – I am beginning to think that people are taking their frustrations about being losers out on me instead of addressing the issues which make them losers. Again, I am not calling anyone a loser – but the reactions to my posts are way out of line to what I post – there has to be something else going on. I gotta believe it is either unhappiness with your own place in life or jealousy – either way, get over it!!!

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  92. “and let’s face it Sonies, they are cookin’ the books on those lower crime stats, just like they do the CPI.”

    Not according to this:
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/21/america-serious-crime-rate-plunging

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  93. For $750K, this place is about 50% overpriced.

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  94. miu:

    The subhead on that is absurd. And, of course, the author is relying on the stats that are “numbers of interest”, according to sources.

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  95. “One thing bored housewives love to do is complain about the smallest things, so its no surpriise to hear these “horror stories” about their precious little timmy not getting straight A’s in K-8 because its always the teachers fault right?”

    Exactly. It is so much easier to blame the teachers that do ones job as parents. Always the path of least resistance.

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  96. Anyone who wants to see the basement can watch the video I linked above, from about 5:50 to 7:10:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEhzmTCOwM4

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  97. Bjornfree= marcus = Dan= Luigi

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  98. “…the only writing on the wall is gas will be $5 a gallon before you know it, then we’ll see how attractive the sprawling sidewalk-challenged exurbs are.”

    When gas went to 50 cents a gallon in 1974, the cheerleaders were saying the same thing.

    “Urbanists” say ‘move to the city’, but only care about the “GZ” and people like themselves. Don’t even mention the city areas west or Western or south of Congress! Meanwhile, real people live and work outside of Snarky hoods, and couldnt care less what they think.

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  99. BTW, back to the house for sale. Ask any 20-30 something yuppie urban woman, who is the decider in home buying and she will go ‘eww, yuck it looks old’ at the exterior. They want a virtual ‘stainless steel house’ shaped like a box, aka ‘McMansion’ for that kind of $$$.

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  100. “Anyone who wants to see the basement can watch the video I linked above, from about 5:50 to 7:10:”

    yes and at 7:30 in that video you can really tell that your neighbor could give two shits about the upkeep of their garage and probably the rest of their house

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  101. Can someone seriously tell me who the market for this house is?

    Has anyone here ever even met someone living in a

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  102. ah, forget it.

    This is what prices on unfathomable props looked liked before the bubble popped.

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  103. A McMansion in prime Lincoln Square costs well over a million. Many people like cute victorian houses. As Lunker, anon and DZ have pointed out is so true. This house in Coonley or Bell would have sold in an instant. This house a little larger, fancier and brick would have sold right here pretty quickly at ask.

    Plain and simple it is overpriced for what it is.

    I’m surprised because Eric R. usually seems to price things right and he certainly knows the neighborhood well. My theories:

    1. Seller just are not ready to bring so much money to the table or

    2. They are testing the market before they try to get the bank to agree to a short sale at a market price.

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  104. “Has anyone here ever even met someone living in a”

    … house like this, about this size, with about $800k into it, somewhere in the city of Chicago, more than a mile from the lake?

    Yes, yes I have.

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  105. Clio: “ze – re-read the posts – I am beginning to think that people are taking their frustrations about being losers out on me instead of addressing the issues which make them losers. Again, I am not calling anyone a loser – but the reactions to my posts are way out of line to what I post – there has to be something else going on. I gotta believe it is either unhappiness with your own place in life or jealousy – either way, get over it!!!

    Hahahahaha.

    Honest question: do you *ever* think you could be wrong? Look up the definition of narcissism, because you are the embodiment of it. The joy of that particular disease is that true narcissists will never get better. There is always someone else who is wrong. They all end up like Charlie Sheen in the end: everyone else finds it sad, but the tiger blood coarsing through their veins

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  106. keeps them from acknowledging their insanity. Also: bravo for calling your detractors losers and claiming to not call people losers in a single post. Sonies is right: best troll ever.

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  107. gringozecarioca on August 29th, 2011 at 6:17 pm

    Tft.. Narcissist, clio is not. Clio is the scumbaggeriest persona I have encountered. If anything, psychotic. Basically now it’s almost humorous the comparison to the Jon Lovitz ‘that’s the ticket’ character. You catch Clio in a lie and she just builds it into her persona and keeps running with it. I am just glad most everyone sees the bullshit. Anyone who doesn’t just deserves to have their drivers license taken away, they are that f’n dumb. Clio is just a simple divorcee, aging, angry at life, realtor, long shitty AmInvesco real estate, gettin hammered, and knows her kids hate her.
    But really, how many times did this sleezebag deny being involved as an agent? Could you imagine being this piece of shits kid…?

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  108. I’ve been in this home and can understand why it isn’t selling at that price. While it has very nice kitchens and bathrooms, they didn’t properly rehab the home in my opinion. The floors squeak and you feel like you’re walking uphill and downhill, and the trim has many layers of paint (so they must not have really gutted it). Also, when installing the SpacePak, they put 3 nozzles right next to each other in each room (likely to save money vs. spreading them out). The problem is, those jets push air at high velocity and if you put 3 next to each other, I bet it gets a bit windy. The family room and master bedroom are pretty small also. I don’t think our bed would fit.
    The deck is another problem. It is obviously high quality, but not very usable. I don’t think my grill would fit on the top section and it’s chopped into sections that force you into a layout. I’d rather have it be one level.
    There’s also a hole in the siding on the garage, which doesn’t scream 700 thousand dollar house.
    I will say, the basement had much higher ceiling height than I expected and the staircase off the kitchen is very nice. Plus, the location is great. That said, I can’t see dropping this much cash and having slopey floors. I get that it’s old and won’t be perfect, but there are nicer places in Lincoln Square and North Center is this range.

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  109. http://www.redfin.com/IL/Niles/6710-W-Forest-View-Ln-60714/home/13594159

    Sabrina’s said for a long time that there are ‘deals’ in the suburbs, but I’ve been so city focused that I’ve never bothered to look. And wow, there are a ton of deals above.

    Check out the property above. a 60’s ranch. I actually like 60’s ranches, the days of Mad Men, open floor plans and bi-level living on a nice plot of land (of course folk victorian is my fav and mid-century modern is my 2nd). Brick, sturdy, safe. My modern furniture would look great in this house with clean lines. Schools are decent in the area, next to forest preserves and recreational opportunities. good place for kids. $334,900!!! Taxes less than $6,000.

    Compare that to the dump above with $8,000 taxes, too close to albany park and the gangs for my tastes; congestion, city BS, not even close to the lake, 100 year old house. Schools are abysmal. Even in the 600’s (like everyone says this should cost) is a complete and utter joke, but the joke is on the seller trying to sell. This is a worker’s cottage rehabbed 100 years later into some weird luxury unit for $700k, someone actually paid in the $800’s for a worker’s cottage in Lincoln Square! Amazing, simply amazing the heights the bubble went.

    I never considered myself a suburban guy but I’d take the 1962 ranch in Niles over the 100 year old worker’s shanty in Lincoln Sq. any day.

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  110. The joke is on the seller trying to sell. In india they just developed a car that runs on compressed air. It’s no SUV for sure, but it runs on compressed air. Our days of reliance on oil will eventually wane as various amounts of other products replace fossil fuels. The suburbs will not become a desolate nightmare like some predict. people will not be flocking to teh city.

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  111. “Our days of reliance on oil will eventually wane as various amounts of other products replace fossil fuels.”

    HD- my guess will be nat gas. We have plenty of it to wean ourselves completely from OPEC. We also have the service stations in place to switch over. The big US oil companies are realizing this- which is why they’re investing heavily into nat gas now.

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  112. “Check out the property above. a 60’s ranch.”

    Is that really a ranch?

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  113. “I actually like 60’s ranches, the days of Mad Men,”
    “I never considered myself a suburban guy”

    If anything reps the burbs it’s ranches. I love them too, but they are sure hard to find within city limits. And the far NW side is not ‘urban’, but it is Chicago, so one won’t feel ‘guilty’.

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  114. ““Urbanists” say ‘move to the city’, but only care about the “GZ” and people like themselves. Don’t even mention the city areas west or Western or south of Congress!”

    This is somewhat true. Ask anyone currently living in the GZ if they would be willing to move to Portage Park or Jefferson Park so they could buy that SFH and most (but not all) would say “no.” That isn’t their image of “the city” either (much like anonny has never even BEEN to those neighborhoods and wouldn’t relate to those who choose to live there.)

    There are two different definitions of “the city.”

    I recently saw a statistic that something like 20% of all Chicagoans had never actually SEEN lake michigan.

    Stew over that one for awhile.

    A teacher in one of the south side high schools also said there was a large contingent of 17 year old students who had never been in the loop before. And they had lived in “the city” their whole lives.

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  115. Another name for a bi-level is a ‘raised ranch’ so yes this is a ranch. However, from the raised ranch evolved the ‘split level’ which is a god awful abomination that should all be torn down.

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  116. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-level_home#Raised_Ranch

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  117. And they’re like practically giving away homes in park ridge. Short sale cape cods for $250,000. Speaking of short sales, short sales are everywhere. Nice, large newer homes in the $500’s! $500’s in GZ gets you a two bedroom shack in LP if you’re lucky; and a rehabbed home slightly outside the green zone with no curb appeal if it was once a foreclosure. I’m not a suburban guy but wow, i seriously would feel like an idiot if I bought the house that is the subject of this thread for $800,000! Jeez.

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  118. http://www.redfin.com/IL/Park-Ridge/202-N-Chester-Ave-60068/home/13649435

    This home needs work but it’s close to the metra, close to downtown park ridge, and on an ‘oversized’ chicago lot as they call it. 6 months now on the market and they can’t give it away for $250,000. IN the green zone some dumb morons would pay $600,000 for this and finish out the basement and ‘live large’ watching tv underground. and then be like “cool, XXXXXXX bar is walking distance dude’ or if they had a family “blaine is close, man, so is dairy queen”

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  119. The problem with some of these homes, HD, is that they are NOT updated. I see this all the time (even in the city- to be honest.) People will NOT buy the older condo or SFH even if it’s cheap because they really want stainless steel, granite and cherry cabinets.

    They want the paint to be updated and the house to be modern with nice landscaping. They’ll pay $500k for that but not $250k for the same house without it.

    This is why the rehabbers are cleaning up (granted – in some cases- the houses the rehabbers buy are SO awful, and need SO much work, even I wouldn’t touch them.)

    Why didn’t anyone else buy that house on Oakley before that rehabber? That one actually DID have granite counter tops. So it needed some new carpet or paint or whatnot.

    People can’t look past those things.

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  120. “Another name for a bi-level is a ‘raised ranch’ so yes this is a ranch. However, from the raised ranch evolved the ’split level’ which is a god awful abomination that should all be torn down.”

    Not clear this is supported by your reference but will confess I’m not particularly knowledgeable (or really that interested). Just didn’t look like ranch or that much like raised ranch, but perhaps you’re right. I thought you were trying to force the mad men reference (not that any of the mad men lived in ranches, as far as I can recall).

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  121. “IN the green zone some dumb morons would pay $600,000 for this and finish out the basement and ‘live large’ watching tv underground. and then be like “cool, XXXXXXX bar is walking distance dude’ or if they had a family “blaine is close, man, so is dairy queen””

    Don’t worry I’ve been eating popcorn for awhile and the feature presentation is just getting started for the GZ SFH set. It’s where the backwards baseball cap wearing brau’s who think they are Vince Vaughn and the aging Trixies still think they’re 21 and talk like it and dress like it (Yes mid-30 something Trixies wearing the jogging pants that say “PINK” on your arse–stay classy) get financially slaughtered. Oh and where the fat RE owning pasty boomers realize they actually aren’t worth as much as they thought and just because their tax bill estimated their house at X just meant they were a schmoe to the taxman.

    And stop exaggerating HD the GZ house in question that goes for 650k looks like MLS 07831069. Hey brau, check out my bungalow brau! Its kind like Roseanne’s but we got Millie’s right over there and them Trixies are hoppin’!

    “Nothing apparent but sold “as is”” (lmfao) and the basement ain’t finished brau but thats because the previous owner knew to leave the basement unfinished as a blank canvas for a buyer of sophistication like me, brau! Just think of how many Golden Tee machines I could fit down there, brau! Its got a bath and a half, brau, too. I think I’m gonna wear two shirts so I can attend the closing with TWO popped collars, brau!

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  122. I was forcing the mad men reference, mad men was early 1960’s, and this ranch was 1962, don actually lived in a colonial, and then moved to the village; his first girlfriend lived in a cool loft in the village as a sign of things to come for the NYC.

    The bi-level is considered a ‘raised ranch’ due to the rear portion having a basement and upper level, neither of which is a real first or second floor. AT least in my limited opinion, but who knows, I’m just some guy posting random shit on teh internets.

    Regardless, this bi-level is an evolutionary foray into ‘modern’ and it was built in niles right down the block from a forest preserve nonetheless. This bi-level has far more character than some tract home in buffalo grove or plainfield, or even the vintage tiny worker’s cottage in lincoln square for $700 (or $600 like everyone thinks!).

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  123. 1904 West Fletcher:

    “Price:
    $649,000

    • Mortgage payments
    Est. payment:
    $3,816/mo
    Bedrooms: 4
    Bathrooms: 1 full, 1 partial
    Property type: Single-Family Home”

    ANd it’s JAhn school, terrible, absolutely terrible school.

    What a joke, yet these homes are all over the GZ. They’re like pigs being lead to slaghter, yet they don’t even know it yet

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  124. wait wait wait …wait wait wait – this whole thread, I have been saying how people with kids are going to be moving to the suburbs and everybody has been attacking me. All of a sudden, HD says the EXACT same thing, and everybody is quiet? What gives?

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  125. “What a joke”

    You forgot one of the best parts. It’s not being listed as a foreclosure but in the verbiage on the MLS for it “Nothing apparent but sold “as is”. I’d say quite a bit is apparent about this place. Or rather, the current owner of this place.

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  126. clio – first of all, it’s 8:45 at night, that’s why everyone is quiet.

    Secondly, you are right. They all will move to the suburbs.

    You see, I’ve been in the unique position (along with others here) of watching the bust in real time. Everyday I have homeowners come into my office from all over the metro area. I first watch the crappy south and west side areas go bust, then the exburbs, then the ‘fringe’ areas in the city, and especially 2/1’s in the fringe areas, now I’m watching the nicer suburbs go bust (there’s a house I could post here in a suburb (not park ridge) that i’m seriously considering in the next few months – and given that its been on the market a long time, there’s no hurry) and i’m amazed at the ‘deals’. I see short sales that won’t sell for the 1997 prices! Yes they need updates and most buyers can’t look past that – and that’s their loss. One home I’m looking at needs AC that’s why it’s been on the market for 400 days. Hell I could spend $15,000 ( on the high end!) and do HVAC with cash in the bank and buy up this home at a steal. But it’s nearly 2000 sq ft on a 175×60 foot lot less than an 8 minute walk from the metra, and it’s 20 minutes downtown, and a 6 minute walk to the office. Hahaha, I feel like I’ve seen the light clio, I really do. I feel like I’ve seen the light.

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  127. Bob, that’s one of the ugliest foursquares I’ve ever seen in my life. Nothing is apparently wrong except that it’s hideous.

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  128. “HD- my guess will be nat gas. We have plenty of it to wean ourselves completely from OPEC. We also have the service stations in place to switch over. The big US oil companies are realizing this- which is why they’re investing heavily into nat gas now.”

    In Utah people drive CNG Honda Civics there and they pay something like $1.00/gallon. Not sure on cost per mile but I’d bet its hybrid equivalent or even lower.

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  129. “Why didn’t anyone else buy that house on Oakley before that rehabber? That one actually DID have granite counter tops. So it needed some new carpet or paint or whatnot.”

    Speaking only for myself and only after a cursory walk-through of that Oakley house, it wasn’t the lack of updating. We’re OK with doing quite a bit of updating, but our budget is much lower than most people posting here.

    1. It smelled like mold. Zero tolerance policy for mold.

    2. Sure there were granite countertops, but the quality of the workmanship on everything in there was terrible. Nothing was square or plumb, the cabinet drawers were sticky, etc. When the stuff you can see is crap, you have to assume the same for the stuff you can’t see.

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  130. “Like HD is slowly realizing, so will most people with kids….its just a matter of time -”

    SLOWLY? How about a fucking catharsis? When I realized that old irving had shit for schools (Even private) and that the ‘best’ option was queen of all saints and the tuition wasn’t listed on the website (if you have to ask then you know it’s too much type of thing!); and then I the ‘deals’ and short sales in some of the suburbs (including many of clio’s posts) and I near instantaneously realized that I could actually save a TON of money NOT paying for private schools, and have a cheaper house, and keep the same commute, and not have to worry about some creepy dude going through the alleys trying to lure my children into their car (true story in my area a few weeks ago). I saw kids of all ages on their bikes riding around park ridge, dogs running across *real* lawns (not gator decks); families having real get togethers in their side yards or backyard. Amazing, like out of a john hugh’s movie, with a price tag of less than $2,000 a month. $2,000 a month gets shit in the city as far as SFH go in teh GZ and maybe an older 2/2; no way can you get a newer 2/2 in some three flat for that price, and then you’re stuck with 4 people in a 2/2 in lakeview where your kid roams the same streets at night as the juvenile delinquents, creepers and child abductors.

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  131. “Hahaha, I feel like I’ve seen the light clio, I really do. I feel like I’ve seen the light.”

    I’ve been saying for awhile that trying to raise a middle class family in city in a nice neighborhood in an SFH is a fool’s errand. Remember my salmon swimming upstream to get eaten by the grizzly analogy.

    If I ever have kids I’ll probably move to Wilmette. Unless my wife is some eastern euro broad who couldn’t live outside of the city then maybe try the LP thing (and give her an excuse to to ruin that rockin’ bod with kids).

    Once you’re above 30-33 the “cool” factor of a city address to impress the yokels back home wears off and practicality takes over. The mayor’s security detail was just attacked by a junkie from Uptown who didn’t know the new ‘mare was livin’ nearby and so they interfered with his occupation of expropriating property from cars, which he is probably pretty good at (I’ve had experts hit mine more than once, the best ones don’t even need to do any damage).

    City livin’ is for the childless, the wealthy, the alcoholics/addicts & creative classes. But it isn’t for a middle class family who wants a decent quality of life for their kids (Groove aside).

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  132. Oh and the other thing is HD the criminals know for property crime like robbing car stereos and breaking into garages they’re out in a day or three down at 26th & Cali.

    But try that shit up in Wilmette when you’re at the Skokie courthouse with much less overcrowding and a citizenry that doesn’t think highly of the inner city folk and word gets around quick that “huntin'” is fo da city.

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  133. I know some criminals. The word is a judge at County might give them two weeks but a judge at a suburban courthouse might give ‘em three months.

    Word on the street is cook county jail has _way worse_ conditions, but you’ll do far less time. And criminals value their time, too.

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  134. “Hahaha, I feel like I’ve seen the light clio, I really do. I feel like I’ve seen the light.”

    HD- you’re in a MUCH better mood now that you’ve seen the light. I’ve been trying to get people interested in the burbs for awhile (at least people of a certain income level who are thinking of having or have children.) And that’s kind of funny because I love Chicago and write a blog about its great neighborhoods, architecture etc. But it’s not workable for many- financially.

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  135. Sabrina,

    That’s why you should have a suburban home on here every now and then. I know you have before, but it’s been a while. You once posted a nice one in Ravinia, which is a great neighborhood in Highland Park.

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  136. Sabrina, some of these leafy suburbs (not the soulless suburbs) have great community parks, subsidized community centers, great schools, wealthy neighbors with families. Back in the days the wealthy had villas and estates to get AWAY from the masses; and even the ones who had to live in the city still had COMPOUNDS not a 25×125 plot of land where drunks were peeing in your alley. Rest assured if riff-raff finds its way into a leafy suburb, those cops ain’t got nothing better to do than to find the degenerates burglarizing garages. In Chicago they laugh at you if you call to report property crime.

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  137. By the way- Vince Vaughn is apparently putting his Palmolive penthouse on the market (per Crain’s)- so when it is actually listed we’ll be chattering about it.

    Alleged asking price of $24.7 million!

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  138. “That’s why you should have a suburban home on here every now and then. I know you have before, but it’s been a while. You once posted a nice one in Ravinia, which is a great neighborhood in Highland Park.”

    I have them every once in awhile but it’s REALLY hard to try and keep up with all those markets. There truly are a gazillion suburbs. We only mention a few on here – but has anyone seen the deals in Homewood Flossmoor lately? My gosh. Big spanish mediterraneans near the train for $550k or whatnot.

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  139. “Sabrina, some of these leafy suburbs (not the soulless suburbs) have great community parks, subsidized community centers, great schools, wealthy neighbors with families.”

    I agree HD. I have nothing against the inner ring of suburbs. In fact, I enjoy the architecture immensely in some of those towns. Just imagine living in Glencoe and having access to that great beach (with a lifeguard) all summer long with your family?

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  140. “wealthy neighbors”

    Oooh, that is exciting.

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  141. “By the way- Vince Vaughn is apparently putting his Palmolive penthouse on the market (per Crain’s)- so when it is actually listed we’ll be chattering about it.”

    The building could only handle one of us……

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  142. BE CAREFUL GUYS – DON’T TALK ABOUT THE SUBURBS, YOU MAY OFFEND “SKEPTIC”:

    “you mean, like taking it to a website dedicated to suburban real estate?
    I’m willing to bet a kidney that Groove never (I sure don’t) goes trolling on suburban blogs.”

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  143. “wealthy neighbors”
    Oooh, that is exciting.

    hd channeling e rojas waxing about bradley west of damen. things are getting weird.

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  144. JP$ on August 29th, 2011 at 3:51 pm
    For $750K, this place is about 50% overpriced.

    At $375 it would be a tear down. This isn’t a tear down. The lot alone I believe is worth 400K being its 37.5ft Width. You can toss up a 32 Wide McMansion.

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  145. “things are getting weird.”

    Well, to be fair, HD has always been covetous of living among hte wealthy/elite. He’s just decided they’re easier to find, and in higher concentrations, in oak brook.

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  146. “hd channeling e rojas waxing about bradley west of damen”

    Also, I drove by on a sunday afternoon and didn’t find the magical scene rojas promised (maybe everyone hides when the poors show up). Street did look v nice though.

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  147. ha, i drove down it too sat before last. it’s ok. i probably would like it more if i hadnt read his silliness.

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  148. OK FOLKS – THIS IS WHY U NEED TO MOVE TO THE BURBS – o/w your kids won’t understand math:

    JP$ on August 29th, 2011 at 3:51 pm
    For $750K, this place is about 50% overpriced.

    Lunker on August 29th, 2011 at 8:57 pm
    At $375 it would be a tear down

    OK – I KNOW THIS IS HARD – but when JP$ says the place is about 50% overpriced, he meant that it was worth 500k. If he had said 100% overpriced (which is double what it should be, that would mean 375k).

    Again, schooling is VERY important folks, – do your kids a favor and move to the suburbs!!!

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  149. This city vs suburb reminds me of what a friend told me about her research. Apparently she conducted some survey during her doctoral thesis in Sweden and one of the question was “Does size matter?”. Women who answered he survey had to choose a box initially to indicate if they have had more or less than 10 (or 20?) partners or something of the sort. Interestingly the answer divided pretty much perfectly among the 2 groups. Ones with more than 10 partners almost unanimously said it does and the others were somewhat more divided. It baffled her initially but then she realized majority of women with few partners were the ones that were married at a young age and most probably were deluding themselves. So I guess once we cannot afford living in the city, we start believing Schaumburg is as nice as London : )

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  150. great anecdote miumiu – and very true!!

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  151. “So I guess once we cannot afford living in the city, we start believing Schaumburg is as nice as London : )”

    You are an ethnic. You know you don’t feel comfortable around people like me (I will refer to us as “second real Americans”, after the native Americans–your opportunities for living happily are much more geographically constrained than mine. I recognize this and I don’t need to live among your group to feel happy or to complete me.

    Also do I need to lecture you on the difficulties of gathering accurate data on surveys such as your friend’s “research”?

    Your friend is doing a “doctoral thesis” on Swedish women’s perceptions on male genital size? When your overly educated friend can’t find gainful employment you should really do her a favor and clue her in why, and perhaps bring a Quiznos application along for that conversation.

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  152. boy,i think you hit the nail on the head there bob.

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  153. danny (lower case D) on August 30th, 2011 at 2:26 am

    Check out this place in Highland Park:

    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Highland-Park/2765-Roslyn-Ln-60035/home/14163289

    It’s a short sale for $275k, and is located a block from the Lake. And convenient to the Highwood Metra stop.

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  154. gringozecarioca on August 30th, 2011 at 3:10 am

    miu..if your friend can’t find employment. Please send her in my direction in order to help her do more studies.

    Bob,
    gas stations down here use NG, it is practically free, and i have spoken to people that have it and they tell me they do great mileage. Problem with NG in the US is the winters. Ya kinda need to build storage all summer or people will die. The mess a cold snap would cause, at chicago city gate, it would be a disaster.
    And I think I have repeatedly said I really enjoyed livin in the burbs of DC, just need a very short commute, or it’s too costly.

    I hope clio brings jokes today.. Cause i’m goin bye bye. One more link to an OP property and I’ll jump.
    Caught in a lie after denying it for months, and ridiculing those that made the assumption, no shame, now flaunting it. Funny, that my friends and I have ways of self-policing this shit, and we adhere to it. It’s just too sleazy for me to be in the same room with. Dan was better.

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  155. lol…Bob I hit a nerve there, didn’t I? What does ethnic mean? Some code word for non white? Again like James you have no idea about my ethnicity : )
    As for my friend: a) she is employed, b) is married to a high earning husband so no worries there.

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  156. One more thing, have you been to Schaumburg Bob? There are more Asians and Indians there than any GZ neighborhood I have been too…lol

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  157. I lived in Schaumburg before. The taverns were packed with young white people who…lets just say weren’t the most sophisticated. Schaumburg is no Dearborn, Michigan.

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  158. You know that Motorola is in Schaumburg. Guess where are most its employees from?

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  159. Based on all the snarking on schools in this thread, I suppose it’s safe to say that the “Nettlehorst era” is over?

    That school, located in a GZ nabe, was regarded as “underperforming” until the “urban pioneer” families in the LSC took it upon themselves to start the process of making it attractive for middle-class kids. The example was followed in other schools including some in more “downscale” neighborhoods as well.

    But lately all I see are references to “Jahn…oh scary scary move away” for example, rather than any reports of concerned parents and teachers working together to make it an attracive center for learning by kids from all backgrounds.

    And now apparently even the Catholic schools are not sacred, so to speak. A poster complained that there were “no” good schools in Portage Park (wow, talk about a sweeping generalization) and only QAS would be worthy of his/her precious offspring. What, you never heard of St. Pascals’s and other thriving NW side parochials?

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  160. Yeah good point MM. And guess what brought me to schaumburg for a time? :O

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  161. ChiTownGal: Don’t let idealism get in the way of cold, hard stats.

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  162. ‘A poster complained that there were “no” good schools in Portage Park (wow, talk about a sweeping generalization) and only QAS would be worthy of his/her precious offspring.’

    What I’ve learn from being in the city long enough (maybe too long), is that where people with kids end up living is largely a self fulfilling prophecy. If they feel the need for a ‘excellence’ in education, a yard, garage, space, all for a low price, then they should move out of the city. That’s why I embrace the suburbs, as it gives people with those kinds of expectations somewhere to go… away from me.

    I remember attending a LP community meeting and out of nowhere, a small group of vocal parents hammered in on the fact that Orchard (between Wrightwood and Fullerton) was nothing less than an expressway that put their kids who routinely played in the streets, at danger. They wanted speed bumps (which they got), police enforcement, one of those radar speed limit signs, and a cul de sac at Fullerton (which they didn’t get largely due to the fire departments input). Now in all the years I’ve walked/driven down that street, I have yet to see *any* child play stick ball in the street. After all that those folks ultimately moved, I imagine to Dupage county.

    You can bend and twist American style human nature all you want, but people like living around others with similar wants and needs… let them go. God bless the suburbs.

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  163. “Caught in a lie after denying it for months, and ridiculing those that made the assumption, no shame, now flaunting it.”

    Huh? ze, what are you talking about.? you must have got some bad stuff – sleep it off…..

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  164. poor Clio never followed her heart….moved to the burbs for her kids and her kids education, quel sacrifice!Probably married a guy who drove a nice pick up truck……the point is do what you love to do and teach your kids to do the same….teachers, schools even neighbourhoods… its all fluff…kids learn from their parents attitude. As i said if you are a parent do what you love to do and build in your kids the conviction to do what they love to do…city/suburbs who cares, argue all day the ony winners coca cola and mcdonalds while you sit, type eat and drink……get a life fatties!

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  165. “I remember attending a LP community meeting and out of nowhere, a small group of vocal parents hammered in on the fact that Orchard (between Wrightwood and Fullerton) was nothing less than an expressway that put their kids who routinely played in the streets, at danger. They wanted speed bumps (which they got), police enforcement, one of those radar speed limit signs, and a cul de sac at Fullerton (which they didn’t get largely due to the fire departments input). Now in all the years I’ve walked/driven down that street, I have yet to see *any* child play stick ball in the street.”

    I kinda doubt they were proposing that they wanted their kids to play *in* the street, as opposed to on the sidewalk or yards. Not clear it got to a point where they felt safe. But, safe or not, I will say that, just from streetview, it just doesn’t seem like a very hospitable street for playing with all houses fenced off.

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  166. Yep. Alas, the internet now allows the more vocal of these dweebs to show up within the City limits to pollute our cyberspace and to try (in vain) to make us conform to their desires.

    clio’s number is up – he/she/it is unethical (and not very bright to boot), it has nothing to do with the burbs per se, that’s just where this yokel is trying to make a buck.

    “What I’ve learn from being in the city long enough (maybe too long), is that where people with kids end up living is largely a self fulfilling prophecy. If they feel the need for a ‘excellence’ in education, a yard, garage, space, all for a low price, then they should move out of the city. That’s why I embrace the suburbs, as it gives people with those kinds of expectations somewhere to go… away from me. “

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  167. Case shiller back up again. Who sees a bottom in their rear view mirror?

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  168. ” just from streetview, it just doesn’t seem like a very hospitable street for playing with all houses fenced off.”

    That’s why they needed street availability, too!

    Anyone who spends any time in Chicago in a neighborhood with even slightly older kids knows that the paved surface of choice (near homes) for playing is the alley, not the street.

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  169. homedelete on August 30th, 2011 at 6:31 am
    ChiTownGal: Don’t let idealism get in the way of cold, hard stats.

    Anytime I see a number, any number , I know it must be true!

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  170. I actually really like that HP house and can see great potential withi what i’d do to it, but 10k a year in taxes on a 275k house, OUCH!

    under K already

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  171. “10k a year in taxes on a 275k house”

    The $10k in taxes is bc, at the last re-assessment, it was comparable to $500k homes. Now you have $100k in market value decline, prolly $50-75k in damage and $75-50k in REO discount. Most likely, at the next re-assessment, it will have a small drop in assessed value, in line with neighboring houses, and have about the same taxes anyway (as most homes in HP will have a lower assessed value).

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  172. “Anytime I see a number, any number , I know it must be true!”

    And when you just hear about a rumor of a number that may or may not exist, and even if it does is probably based on anecdote, rather than actual data, then what? Still believe it must be true, but only if it fits within your personal narrative of the subject being discussed?

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  173. This is an example of a place near the Glencoe metra stop, 2 miles south of Lake Cook Rd. It has 4 bedrooms, but looks kind of small overall. Taxes also don’t seem so high, but that could change.

    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Northfield/281-Latrobe-Ave-60093/home/12569391

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  174. yay 500k to live in the shittiest house in glenco did you see the neighbors of that house? no thanks

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  175. Yeah, pretty much would stink to be them. All this talk about the “cheap” places on the north shore which are not that great at all. You need to spend more than $750K in Glencoe, Wilmette, Winnetka to get something decent.

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  176. HD: “Rest assured if riff-raff finds its way into a leafy suburb, those cops ain’t got nothing better to do than to find the degenerates burglarizing garages. In Chicago they laugh at you if you call to report property crime.”

    There is a downside to a bunch of officers with too much time on their hands and no crime to handle. Those of you who grew up in small communities know what I’m talking about. Think “broken window” enforcement gone wild…

    Just like the dog argument, the car argument, the windows vs. mac argument, etc., etc., etc…all of this comes down to one simple principle: personal preference. You can praise the city all day long, but we all know there are downsides to living here, even in the best neighborhoods. You can praise the suburbs all you want, but if you don’t see their downside (even in the “city-like” burbs) you are fooling yourself.

    In the end, haters are going to hate. If you don’t conform to some dickhead’s notion of how to live life, you’ll get a virtual earful on the webz.

    “No! You are doing it wrong! Get a dog, an Audi, an Android phone, a Windows desktop, move to Evanston and have 2.5 kids. Do not deviate, you ignorant donkey!”

    The thing I find funny is how people are so GD sure that *their* way is superior that they are willing to yell at internet randoms. Talk about fooling yourself…

    Variety is the spice of life, folks. And to the suburban haters: thank your lucky stars for the GZ. If it didn’t exist, those annoying urbunites might get out of their cage and live next to you in the burbs. The horror…

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  177. clio on August 29th, 2011 at 9:23 pm
    OK FOLKS – THIS IS WHY U NEED TO MOVE TO THE BURBS – o/w your kids won’t understand math:
    JP$ on August 29th, 2011 at 3:51 pm
    For $750K, this place is about 50% overpriced.
    Lunker on August 29th, 2011 at 8:57 pm
    At $375 it would be a tear down
    OK – I KNOW THIS IS HARD – but when JP$ says the place is about 50% overpriced, he meant that it was worth 500k. If he had said 100% overpriced (which is double what it should be, that would mean 375k).
    Again, schooling is VERY important folks, – do your kids a favor and move to the suburbs!!!

    Yeah, thanks for catching that. My MBA is only from DePaul not Standford/Harvard etc. (where ever you went) LOL

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  178. sorry Lunker – I just couldn’t resist (to tell you the truth, I thought the same thing at first)!!!!

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  179. ‘I kinda doubt they were proposing that they wanted their kids to play *in* the street, as opposed to on the sidewalk or yards.’

    The moment ‘what about the children’ is thrown into a discussion it’s the start of a no-win situation, regardless of where the kids actually wanted to play (most likely in front of the TV). Same thing happened when a group of new to the hood/city ‘concerned’ parents started a petition trying to close the church soup kitchen at Geneva and Fullerton… operating for decades without issue.

    I just think a lot of GZ or even semi-GZ parents are fooling themselves into thinking that they’re cut out for harsh reality of city living, as is evident in the amount of cribs-in-bedroom pics you see here. If you have *any* doubt about doing the looooong haul here with your children, I think it’s best to do yourself (and your temporary city neighbors) a favor and lay down roots in the suburbs from day one. Kinda like all the gym memberships that are sold around the first of the year (there’s a reason Ballys heavily advertises over the holidays)… an almost guaranteed rate of failure.

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  180. “yay 500k to live in the shittiest house in glenco did you see the neighbors of that house? no thanksf”

    uhhhh – two seconds and half a brain and you would realize that the map is displaying a different address (okay, now THIS post is a little nasty, I agree – but still 100% correct)

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  181. The city with children is either an upper class or lower class experience. There are relativelt very few ‘middle class’ experiences and most of those belong to the progency of city workers. How many on cribchatter would ‘fit in’ in a neighborhood of firemen and city clerks? We all know the expensive alternatives or inexpensive alternatives.

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  182. HD: “The city with children is either an upper class or lower class experience. There are relativelt very few ‘middle class’ experiences and most of those belong to the progency of city workers. How many on cribchatter would ‘fit in’ in a neighborhood of firemen and city clerks? We all know the expensive alternatives or inexpensive alternatives.”

    Dunno…this strikes me as malarkey. Assuming for a moment that if you have kids then you *must* have a big back yard, a dog, a huge house and 2 SUVs, then you are probably right.

    But my personal assumptions about city living are that you simply don’t need most of those things. A reasonable 3 bed plus an office is plenty big for a 2 kid household in my book. I don’t want a dog, even one SUV or even a big back yard. A yard might be nice, but I’d rather have a nice big porch or roof deck (easier to care for with the advantages of outdoor space.

    I guess it is a matter of how you define your needs and how you set your expectations. I’ve never deluded myself into thinking I was going to get a suburban living experience in the city. For that matter, I’ve never deluded myself into thinking I was going to get an ultra-luxury condo living experience in the city. You do sacrifice some specific American ideals when you decide to live in the city, but if you don’t buy into those ideals in the first place, I’m not really sure how much you give up.

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  183. “A reasonable 3 bed plus an office is plenty big for a 2 kid household in my book.”

    This is so stupid – of COURSE a 3 bedroom plus office is plenty big – the issue is how much is that going to cost in a safe area of chicago??? You are talking well over 500k!!!! That reminds of that old show “The PJs” where the old lady says “I don’t need nobody and don’t need nobody’s help. Just give me my social security, disability, food stamps, medicare, medicaid, and I don’t need nobody!!”

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  184. Exactly clio. Exactly. Bizarro world where you and I agree so much lately. I like how she feels so superior over the burbs despite that most middle class people w/children choose not to live in the city.

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  185. what would you consider middle class HD? I would bet a large percentage of the Obama millionaires (250k/yr ppl) living in the city would consider themselves middle class.

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  186. clio: “This is so stupid – of COURSE a 3 bedroom plus office is plenty big – the issue is how much is that going to cost in a safe area of chicago??? You are talking well over 500k!!!! That reminds of that old show “The PJs” where the old lady says “I don’t need nobody and don’t need nobody’s help. Just give me my social security, disability, food stamps, medicare, medicaid, and I don’t need nobody!!””

    And? How are you disagreeing with anything I’m saying? I guess the question comes down to: what is “middle class”? If we are talking about people with better jobs than HD’s city workers example and there are two working adults in the household, they’ll be making well over 100k. In that case, affording a non-SFH in a safe neighborhood isn’t out of the question.

    Would clio live in that same neighborhood? I doubt it. It is also a question of how you define a good neighborhood. Clearly, not everyone can afford to live next to clio or find annony’s unicorn property. But those aren’t the only good places to live in the city, no matter what you may say.

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  187. Sonies: “what would you consider middle class HD? I would bet a large percentage of the Obama millionaires (250k/yr ppl) living in the city would consider themselves middle class.”

    This. I don’t even know what the middle class is anymore. Two city workers pulling in over 50K a piece is lower class? A couple making just over 100K a piece is upper class? The middle class window keeps shrinking…

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  188. TftinChi- again you are a bit delusional. A typical criibchatter couple with two kids making 125-150k will NOT be able to live a decent life in chicago (compared with the suburbs). 150k will afford you a 450-500k place (MAX) – even this would be a stretch given all of the other expenses. Where, pray tell, can you find a decent “3 bedroom plus office” house in a good school district with low maint. and reasonable taxes in the green zone? sure there are tons of places within the city limits that would be affordable for these people, but the typical poster/reader/user on this site would not want to live in those areas

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  189. clio: “sure there are tons of places within the city limits that would be affordable for these people, but the typical poster/reader/user on this site would not want to live in those areas”

    Go re-read my post and tell me where in it I said:

    1) poster/reader/user of this site have reasonable expectations.
    2) that my (or anyone’s) search should be limited to the GZ

    I didn’t say those things, so quit pretending I did.

    And keep up the name calling, pard. Who *wouldn’t* want to engage a person who calls them an idiot and delusional? I love being shit on by randoms. What a treat!

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  190. reread my post – I never called you an “idiot” and, I’m sorry, but you ARE delusional if you think a typical cribchatter couple with two kids making 125k could live a good life in the city. If you want to include atypical non-cribchatter couples with two kids, I can tell you that there are a lot of them making less than 20-50k living in chicago – but this is irrelevant to this blog/site.

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  191. Oh, and in response to this: “Where, pray tell, can you find a decent “3 bedroom plus office” house in a good school district with low maint. and reasonable taxes in the green zone?”

    I answer:
    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/1425-W-Byron-St-60613/unit-3W/home/39959125

    Is it in a perfect location? Nope. Is it the perfect place? Nope. But for a family willing to make a few compromises, live in the city and have a good school, it would work out very well.

    HD, the thing I don’t understand about your attitude on this is that you see a bloodbath coming for the backwards hat wearing, GZ living set but you don’t see that housing stock becoming more affordable? I can name several properties on my block alone that are inhabited by these folks and am relatively sure they are living there on borrowed time. As those folks are forced out, there will be opportunities. They can’t hand on forever.

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  192. clio: “reread my post – I never called you an “idiot””

    You must have a very short memory. Amazing as it is, I can remember more than a single post in the past. And I don’t even have one of them fancy photographic memories! Crazy, right?

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  193. You’re fighting against the trend here tftinchi – chicago has less people today than in 1920. People are leaving, and have been leaving for 50/60 years. And they move to the suburbs.

    Middle class expectations include a decent public school, 1,400 sq feet of space or more for a family of four, safe environment for children to play, and a relative lack of crime, affordable housing for a family (that’s vague yes but we can get into this later).

    Many city areas do not meet have these expectations. Hence, the Chicago area has expanded in Lake, McHenry, DuPage, Kane, Kendall & Will counties over the last 50 years.

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  194. TftinChi,
    nice place but the issue is that you could find much more suitable, safer, and better places in the suburbs for the money. Nobody can argue with that fact. For me, I would rather live in your subject property than anywhere in the suburbs – but I am single and don’t have children living with me…. this is not the demographic we are discussing.

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  195. tftinchi: bob makes fun of the backwards hat wearing chads. That was his comment. I’ve taken the position that the housing bubble was minor distraction in the long term trend of citizens leaving teh city for the suburbs.

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  196. The mortgage on your byron condo is $2,300 a month with taxes and assessments. Personally I find that to be a bit high for my tastes and I have one child, it’s out of the question for 2 kids, and I have a household income with two professional working parents.

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  197. ” Personally I find that to be a bit high for my tastes and I have one child, it’s out of the question for 2 kids, and I have a household income with two professional working parents.”

    Yeah, but you’re uber-ultra-conservative on your finances, HD. You’re a tiny, tiny step away from cash in teh matress and gold coins in a coffee can under the mulberry bush. $2300/mo on a ~$125k (dependable) salary ain’t too high.

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  198. YMMV of course, but I’m closer to HD on this.

    That $2300 is @35-38% of your monthly take-home ($62-6500?). And he’s got $1500 or so worth of day care, which for us was the big thing that blew up the budget.

    Not much room for savings, cars, vacation, emergencies etc.; not a budget I’d be dying to lock myself into. Plus you’ve put $80,000 and change into the condo, yuck.

    However I don’t see any of our suburbs offering a much better trade.

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  199. HD: “tftinchi: bob makes fun of the backwards hat wearing chads. That was his comment. I’ve taken the position that the housing bubble was minor distraction in the long term trend of citizens leaving teh city for the suburbs”

    Gah…sorry. For some reason I thought that was you. It all makes sense now.

    clio: “nice place but the issue is that you could find much more suitable, safer, and better places in the suburbs for the money. Nobody can argue with that fact.”

    And I’m not trying to argue that fact (well, maybe the safer bit, but that’s a someone minor point for me personally). What I’m arguing is that this condo would put you in the city. For some people, that is an acceptable tradeoff based on their personal choices, desires and priorities.

    Now you can go ahead and tell those people that their choices, desires and priorities are “wrong” and they are “stupid” for making them. But that’s my point: haters are going to hate. WTF do you care if someone else makes decisions you wouldn’t? This is about a personal subjective set of opinions about how to best live your life. Folks here try to make it about an objective set of facts, which is absurd IMO.

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  200. giardiniera: “That $2300 is @35-38% of your monthly take-home ($62-6500?). And he’s got $1500 or so worth of day care, which for us was the big thing that blew up the budget. ”

    We got lucky on that. My other works on off hours, so we only need a part time nanny. Saves us a ton. I honestly don’t know how people (suburbs or otherwise) can afford full time help. The cost is just crazy.

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  201. giardiniera: $1,500 daycare, $1,000 student loans, $800 food/target, $400 utilities, $2,300 mortgage and that’s $6,000 of the $7,000 take home on a $125,000 income. So maybe you have less student loans, that’s a couple extra hundred a week that becomes your car payment (unless you pay in cash, unlikely). I know I’m forgetting a few things like car insurance, life insurance, medical co-pays and deductibles (got whacked with that this year AND last); That’s why I think $1,600 is a reasonable mortgage for that sort of income, but then again, other peole living closer to the edge are willing to spend far more on their housing…at least for now, while they can get mortgages, but the market is running out of those people…

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  202. ” Monthly nut is less than 1k.”

    Only if another little old lady buys it. Fair market taxes are about $500/month for that (based on a house on that street with a v. similar assessed value).

    Plus, it’s got one bathroom and the washing machine is in the kitchen. A worthless property for the “typical cribchatter couple with two kids making 125k”.

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  203. That elmhurst home needs some help! Find something nicer in the high 200s or 300’s.

    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Park-Ridge/510-S-Crescent-Ave-60068/home/13638721

    The monthly nut on this even with the high taxes is less than $1,800 a month.

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  204. The price history of this property is the story of our times.

    If I paid $350k I would still feel it was a bit high.

    I hope this agent can talk some sense into the seller. The challenge is once you’re put so much money into a place, it’s hard to realize what you’ve lost.

    Time to thank the a**holes who broke the economy … you know, or behead them.

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  205. formerroscoevillager on August 30th, 2011 at 11:39 am

    HD, I don’t think that’s what anyone has in mind when they say “outdoor room” but could be really cool

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  206. Yeah that 1927 cabin w/fireplace is fat as hell

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  207. But it’s no sub-$1800/mo property, mid 2000s at best (before “reserves”/substitute condo assessments).

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  208. “Yeah, but you’re uber-ultra-conservative on your finances, HD. You’re a tiny, tiny step away from cash in teh matress and gold coins in a coffee can under the mulberry bush. $2300/mo on a ~$125k (dependable) salary ain’t too high.”

    I beg to differ. In fact, HD is living within hid means something most of us have to learn.

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  209. “But it’s no sub-$1800/mo property, mid 2000s at best (before “reserves”/substitute condo assessments).”

    Yeah, HD with the new math, making $695/mo taxes and a $1,391/mo mortgage (5/1) payment total less than $1800–and that’s before considering the $250+/mo that everyone here seems to pay for HO insurance.

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  210. clio on August 30th, 2011 at 10:00 am
    “A reasonable 3 bed plus an office is plenty big for a 2 kid household in my book.”
    This is so stupid – of COURSE a 3 bedroom plus office is plenty big – the issue is how much is that going to cost in a safe area of chicago??? You are talking well over 500k!!!! That reminds of that old show “The PJs” where the old lady says “I don’t need nobody and don’t need nobody’s help. Just give me my social security, disability, food stamps, medicare, medicaid, and I don’t need nobody!!”

    —–

    Nothing wrong with Jefferson Park, Beverly, Edison Park, Mt. Greenwood, Garfield Ridge, Edgebrook, Sauganash, Norwood Park etc. Good, safe neighborhoods. Just Sayin

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  211. clio on August 30th, 2011 at 10:34 am
    TftinChi- again you are a bit delusional. A typical criibchatter couple with two kids making 125-150k will NOT be able to live a decent life in chicago (compared with the suburbs). 150k will afford you a 450-500k place (MAX) – even this would be a stretch given all of the other expenses. Where, pray tell, can you find a decent “3 bedroom plus office” house in a good school district with low maint. and reasonable taxes in the green zone? sure there are tons of places within the city limits that would be affordable for these people, but the typical poster/reader/user on this site would not want to live in those areas

    ————————

    See my above post on neighborhoods

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  212. “I beg to differ. In fact, HD is living within hid means something most of us have to learn.”

    HD “invests” in laddered CDs, miu.

    And wants a larger than average house, that’s been mechanically updated in the last 20 years, not further than ~40 minute *public transit* commute from East Lakeview, for less than 20% of his GHHI.

    In other words, he wants something with a fairly high general demand for approximately replacement cost, with an implied lot value of sub-$25k. And he wants to wait the market out, until the market hits his number, and is unwilling to make price discovery bids to try to grab something available sooner bc he doesn’t want to annoy the “4” sales people who handle most props in *ONE* of his desireable areas.

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  213. anon: “Yeah, HD with the new math, making $695/mo taxes and a $1,391/mo mortgage (5/1) payment total less than $1800–and that’s before considering the $250+/mo that everyone here seems to pay for HO insurance.”

    And to take it a bit further: my linked property had 280/mo in assessments (including water and air cond). When comparing against SFH, how much do you tack on for maintenance? I have to figure at least 200/mo. (and that doesn’t count savings for the eventual roof replacement or whathaveyou).

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  214. ” assessments (including water”

    Metered water/sewer is practically free. Don’t think mine will hit $200/year, and that’s with some lawn/garden watering.

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  215. here clio, here’s a green zone map for you

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/29/Chicago_violent_crime_map_2006.png

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  216. Hey – that Crescent house I posted too was actually the wrong house, that crescent house was nice but out of the price range of $300’s I was referring to. According to teh cribchatter rule that property will go under contract in the next 48 hours, I didn’t mean to post that.

    I actually posted to another raised ranch (lots of those in the burbs) in the $300’s, I don’t want to look for it again, so you can feel free to look yourself. ‘

    Ps I don’t invest in laddered cd’s, my inlaws did, and they felt justified in doing so because they were retired and living off the interest. CD’s doing get jack nowadays but in the past they actually paid some interest. this is the days of the war on savers.

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  217. Yeah, that’s a pretty good summary of my situation. But given the abysmal state of the market, well, time is on my side and others feel the same too.

    “And wants a larger than average house, that’s been mechanically updated in the last 20 years, not further than ~40 minute *public transit* commute from East Lakeview, for less than 20% of his GHHI.

    In other words, he wants something with a fairly high general demand for approximately replacement cost, with an implied lot value of sub-$25k. And he wants to wait the market out, until the market hits his number, and is unwilling to make price discovery bids to try to grab something available sooner bc he doesn’t want to annoy the “4? sales people who handle most props in *ONE* of his desireable areas.”

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  218. Yeah, that’s a pretty good summary of my situation. But given the abysmal state of the market, well, time is on my side and others feel the same too.

    “And wants a larger than average house, that’s been mechanically updated in the last 20 years, not further than ~40 minute *public transit* commute from East Lakeview, for less than 20% of his GHHI.

    In other words, he wants something with a fairly high general demand for approximately replacement cost, with an implied lot value of sub-$25k. And he wants to wait the market out, until the market hits his number, and is unwilling to make price discovery bids to try to grab something available sooner bc he doesn’t want to annoy the “4? sales people who handle most props in *ONE* of his desireable areas.”

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  219. “Nothing wrong with Jefferson Park, Beverly, Edison Park, Mt. Greenwood, Garfield Ridge, Edgebrook, Sauganash, Norwood Park etc. Good, safe neighborhoods. Just Sayin”

    Exactly. But they aren’t Palatine or Oak Brook ; )

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  220. “Ps I don’t invest in laddered cd’s, my inlaws did, and they felt justified in doing so because they were retired and living off the interest. CD’s doing get jack nowadays but in the past they actually paid some interest. this is the days of the war on savers.”

    Ah, so it *is* cash in the mattress and gold coins under the mulberry bush (yeah, *I* know it’s not actually amulberry, but I don’t want anyone digging for your coins under teh right kind of plant).

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  221. ““Nothing wrong with Jefferson Park, Beverly, Edison Park, Mt. Greenwood, Garfield Ridge, Edgebrook, Sauganash, Norwood Park etc. Good, safe neighborhoods. Just Sayin”

    or canaryville, or garfield park, or albany park, or little village, or dunning, or humboldt park, or back of the yards, or brainard, or roseland, or pullman, or austin, etc…

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  222. http://maps.google.com/maps?q=keystone+and+avondale&hl=en&ll=41.951735,-87.728984&spn=0.008873,0.01929&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=38.638819,79.013672&vpsrc=0&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=41.951645,-87.728834&panoid=DXln8GgT0xc35f22p_aZsA&cbp=12,217.7,,0,-2

    This is my least favorite mulberry in the entire city.

    Regardless, they say that you should only invest money that you can afford to lose, and I don’t feel like I can afford to lose money….

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  223. Yep. All I’ve been saying is I find it funny why people are on a Chicago real estate blog bitching about the City and trying to pimp the burbs. We all know there are positives and negatives about the city, individual neighborhoods, the suburbs in general and specific ones.

    But the City is the City, and the burbs are the burbs.

    “What I’ve learn from being in the city long enough (maybe too long), is that where people with kids end up living is largely a self fulfilling prophecy. If they feel the need for a ‘excellence’ in education, a yard, garage, space, all for a low price, then they should move out of the city. That’s why I embrace the suburbs, as it gives people with those kinds of expectations somewhere to go… away from me. “

    Regarding the “But gas was a fortune in the 70s and it got cheaper!” yes, but that was due to OPEC cutting down supply to the western world – we hit Peak Oil in (depends who you ask) 2004 or 2005.

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  224. “or canaryville, or garfield park, or albany park, or little village, or dunning, or humboldt park, or back of the yards, or brainard, or roseland, or pullman, or austin, etc…”

    What do those areas have to do with the Sauganash, Norwood Park, Beverly, etc?

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  225. “‘or canaryville, or garfield park, or albany park, or little village, or dunning, or humboldt park, or back of the yards, or brainard, or roseland, or pullman, or austin, etc…’

    What do those areas have to do with the Sauganash, Norwood Park, Beverly, etc?”

    I’ve heard of just one of thoese areas, and that’s only because of “Shameless” on Showtime.

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  226. “What do those areas have to do with the Sauganash, Norwood Park, Beverly, etc?”

    They’re places in chicago tolive just like the places you mentioned.

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  227. “I’ve heard of just one of thoese areas, and that’s only because of “Shameless” on Showtime.”

    You’ve never heard of Pullman? You uneducated lout!

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  228. Bob 2 (Not Bob) on August 30th, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    “I’ve heard of just one of thoese areas, and that’s only because of “Shameless” on Showtime.”

    And the show version is nothing like the real hood.

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  229. did you guys know that the largest “maturity” date of CD’s is in October because of the 1987 market crash?

    did you also know that CD’s in october of 1987 paid around 9%?

    man you boomers have no idea how good you had it!

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  230. “You’ve never heard of Pullman? You uneducated lout!”

    Ah, a quick search indicates that I have heard of Pullman. I recall researching it a bit for a paper re: free speech in private settings (malls/universities/condo and homeowner associations; Pullman was a company town). I guess I forgot (or never internalized) that it was in IL.

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  231. So the consensus is – a family with the “typical” 2.5 kids needs lotsandlotsa space (and a price that reflects it), even if ecologically unwise, right?

    Whatever happened to the “less is more” or “downsizing” trend of the early 1990s? A “middle class” family can certainly fit into a condo or townhouse (I speak from experience) if they learn to discard/recycle “stuff” as it is no longer needed. That was part of the philosophy of the “attached single family” homes that sprung up in “green zone” areas over the last 20 years. It was thought that today’s young families were going to be mindful of their “footprints” and not buy housing with unnecessary space that eats up heating bills and necessitates more work for Mother (or whoever) on the weekend. Come on…how many of us really want to be standing on ladders and washing windows at the top of our “cathedral” ceilings on Saturday afternoon? And if Mom & Dad have resolved not to have that third child, why are the clothes and toys of the first two still hanging around, Toy Story-style, ten years after they were last used?

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  232. ChiTownGal a larger part of the philosophy of those early-mid 90s townhomes had to do with packing more people in the same amount of space.

    But I agree the SFH fanatics are like a cult on here.

    Me I’d be happy with a top floor space and a top floor deck. I have friends with a backyard for the few times a year I shoot off Indiana fireworks. And I don’t want to be that tool who lives next to some friends who needs a gas powered mower for his 700 sqft yard.

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  233. I don’t see anything wrong with a family of four wanting 1,500 sq ft and small backyard and a safe neighborhood to run around.

    And you wonder why city kids are obese. They can’t just run outside and play: they have no yard – only a gator deck. They can’t walk the streets: too many creepers and weirdos. Most GZ kids DON’T go to the local public school: how many total students do the 8 decent schools have combined? Bell is 1000 kids and that’s one of the biggest, the rest re all smaller, 10,000 kids tops?

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  234. HD: “They can’t walk the streets: too many creepers and weirdos.”

    That isn’t a function of city living. I know suburban parents that are freaked out about their kids playing in the neighborhood unattended. Hell, I know rural parents that say the same thing.

    I think the 24 hour news cycle keeps us more informed and afraid of the creepers that have always been in our midst. It isn’t as though child abductions started in the 90s even if most parents act that way.

    Today, it’s all play dates and constant supervision. In our day, it was: go outside and be home for supper at 5.

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  235. “Today, it’s all play dates and constant supervision. In our day, it was: go outside and be home for supper at 5.”

    That’s a function of city living. Creppers are all over the nW side of chicago. OIPA has e-mails all the time of ‘watch out for a creeper pedo trynig to lure children from their backyard’ every few weeks.

    I was just in the suburbs around dusk the other day and I saw kids running around playing everywhere. Parents I’m sure were nearby as they should be, but it seems idyllic and safe to me. I don’t see that in my neighborhood at all.

    Anyways my kid is going to know beter than to talk to strangers. Random kids try talking to me once in a while like “nice dog” or “hi there!” and I look at them and say “Don’t you know better than to talk to strangers? Didn’t your parents teach you that?” And then they run away. I’m just doing my part. It takes a community.

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  236. “And you wonder why city kids are obese.”

    I think alot of it has to do with the parents (perhaps the fathers, in particular). I try take my kid over to the park at least a few mornings a week before work (for 30 to 60 minutes), and we’re almost always the only parent/child out between 7 – 8:15 a.m. (if we see any others, it’s mom/kid, nanny/kid or grandmother/kid; I think I’ve had no more than 2 or 3 dad/kid sightings over the past few years during the pre-work hours). And when I do see dads with their little kids in the park/playground (on the weekends, or occassionally during post-work hours), half of them are on the phone/texting most of the time like teenagers.

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  237. “Random kids try talking to me once in a while like “nice dog” or “hi there!” and I look at them and say “Don’t you know better than to talk to strangers? Didn’t your parents teach you that?” And then they run away.”

    +

    “OIPA has e-mails all the time of ‘watch out for a creeper'”

    =

    ???

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  238. yeah too much MSNBC or faux news watching for HD lately. fvck I remember having a sweatshirt with my name on it as a kid thinking I was a celebrity then like a yr or two later society started freaking out about that.

    at daycare I used to run off and see how many bees I could stomp. and when the cicadas came I was a killing machine with some tennis rackets. the onus of cicada genocide lies on me, bobbo

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  239. anon(tfo), I’m not luring kids out of their backyard. We got an e-mail the other day of some really random weird 50’s year old guy who is stalking a teenager in the neighborhood and to keep a look out of him because there is a restraining order. They can’t let that kid out of the house because they’re afraid this creeper is going to abduct her and god only knows. How scary, I feel terrible. But that’s ‘city living!’ Vagrants break into garages all the time around here. Some resident is taking pictures of the heron or meth freaks as they break into garages and sell stuff.

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  240. Vlajos on August 30th, 2011 at 12:24 pm
    “Nothing wrong with Jefferson Park, Beverly, Edison Park, Mt. Greenwood, Garfield Ridge, Edgebrook, Sauganash, Norwood Park etc. Good, safe neighborhoods. Just Sayin”
    Exactly. But they aren’t Palatine or Oak Brook ; )

    I’d live in either of the above over Palatine or Oak Brook any day of the week

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  241. homedelete on August 30th, 2011 at 12:25 pm
    ““Nothing wrong with Jefferson Park, Beverly, Edison Park, Mt. Greenwood, Garfield Ridge, Edgebrook, Sauganash, Norwood Park etc. Good, safe neighborhoods. Just Sayin”
    or canaryville, or garfield park, or albany park, or little village, or dunning, or humboldt park, or back of the yards, or brainard, or roseland, or pullman, or austin, etc…

    ————

    Give me a break. Your talking Niles and Park Ridge yesterday and now your chiming in on Roseland and Humbolt.

    The neighborhoods I listed are essentially suburbs within the city. High population of cops, fire, teachers, and city management adding to a stable population of accountants, salesmen, Lawyers etc in the private sector.

    They are great neighborhoods where people put down roots.

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  242. http://chicago.everyblock.com/announcements/aug22-bike-theft-4202669/

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  243. how scary HD feels terrible. dude are on female hormonal treatment?? not only are you not going to hack it in the city with that outlook you’re going to have to go pretty far out. might I suggest lake Zurich or Huntley.

    you need to be in a well water town so you will fit in your hysteria with that of the well-water drinking, 24hr news & qvc watchin’ stay at home mommies.

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  244. you’re starting to sound liberal to me Bob. Making excuses for the negative aspects of city living, like the crime, the creepers, the heron addicts breaking in your garage….that’s just city living, right Bob?

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  245. I’d continue living in the city (and I’m still living here now!) but the lack of decent schools, the crime, and seemingly limitless property crime (which seems to be slowly transforming into strong arm robberies in the dusk hours) – and the lack of suitable and affordable housing is starting to become a bit irksome.

    But that’s city living!

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  246. “anon(tfo), I’m not luring kids out of their backyard.”

    I know you aren’t, but anyone who is mean to a kid potentially leads to a report of a “creeper”, depending on the parents.

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  247. ” the heron addicts”

    I do love me some heron, but I don’t think I call a taste for game an “addiction”.

    “go pretty far out. might I suggest lake Zurich or Huntley”

    Too many meth addicts there, too, Bob.

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  248. The other aspect seem to ignore is the seemingly pervasive and overwhelming present ghetto thug or hip-hop culture as they say is everywhere. It’s the 20 year old kid at the convenience store buying cheetos with his LINK card; or the guy on the train throwing his half eaten chicken wings on the ground, or lately, the flash mobs, or roving bands of teenagers I see around the NW side on a daily basis that seem to be up to no good. They aren’t playing tennis at the tennis courts, they’re spray painting them with gang signs instead, type of shit. But that’s city living, rihgt? I notice the other day that after Q101 went off the air, I found myself listening to 97.1 the drive (classic rock) and I realized I”m not that far away from being middle aged.

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  249. The particular creeper in the last few weeks was a hispanic guy in a pickup truck who was trying to lure a 7 year old girl out of her back yard and into his truck in the alley by offering her candy. A nanny noticed the exchange and went to see what was going on and the pickup truck sped away. I’m not hispanic nor do I own a pickup truck.

    “anon (tfo) on August 30th, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    “anon(tfo), I’m not luring kids out of their backyard.”

    I know you aren’t, but anyone who is mean to a kid potentially leads to a report of a “creeper”, depending on the parents.”

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  250. heron is what the hip-hop culture calls heroin.

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  251. Some people in chicago live in the ‘green zone’ and others live in ‘Dro City’.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dW7VIPtj79c

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  252. Holy shit. HD’s gone. Replaced by a clio/bob hybrid. Scary stuff…

    “That’s a function of city living. Creppers are all over the nW side of chicago. OIPA has e-mails all the time of ‘watch out for a creeper pedo trynig to lure children from their backyard’ every few weeks.”

    Give me a break. You are really trying to tell me that, based on some e-mail list you’ve subscribed to, there are far more crimes against kids on the NW side of Chicago than in the suburbs? I’m sorry, but that is just patently absurd. Give me some evidence. A report, some numbers, SOMETHING.

    I’m sorry, but with your “heard through the grapevine” reports of crime, you are starting to sound like the average Trib or secondcitycop poster. That was not a compliment…

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  253. You guys aren’t ruining my ideal of the far out burbs being like mayberry. Andy Griffith would sweep the streets with meth addicts.

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  254. ” I’m not hispanic nor do I own a pickup truck. ”

    So, there is only one creeper to go with one stalker, but they’re all over the place?

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  255. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQVTPuE_qRU

    Pilsen’s Finest (nsfw)

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  256. I don’t believe this is HD actually. Maybe the hooker he was seeing offed him or something. Lawyers don’t talk/write like he is now–dr phil does but he’s not a real doctor.

    Maybe its his spouse who pis considerably dumber than him (sorry toots). Lawyers don’t say “hip hop culture” unless its a defense trial for pookie facing an M1 and there’s so much evidence they need something to blame as a hail Mary attempt at an M2.

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  257. tftinchi: evidence?

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/watchdog/childabduct/ct-met-child-abduct-suburbs-20101214,0,6355814.story

    “One reason families move to the suburbs is safety. Yet since 2008, at least 123 cases of attempted child abduction by a stranger have shaken suburban Cook County communities from Schaumburg to Riverdale and from Skokie to Blue Island, the Tribune found.

    Because of inconsistencies in how the municipalities catalog and disclose reports of attempted child abduction by a stranger, an exact suburb-to-suburb comparison of the crime was impossible. Tinley Park — selected by BusinessWeek in 2009 as the best place to raise a family in America — reported 16 cases of attempted child abduction by a stranger since 2008, while similarly sized Hoffman Estates reported none.

    Responding to Tribune freedom of information requests, nearly two-thirds of the 80 largest suburbs reported no stranger abduction attempts — even though several of them had put out alerts about suspected incidents. Among these was Mount Prospect, where police investigated a September 2009 incident in which a middle-age man tried to lure a boy into his SUV on Hi Lusi Avenue.”

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  258. bob, THIS IS NOT ABOUT RACE, it’s a thugish cultural thing. I really mean that, the thugish hip-hop cultural crosses racial boundaries, and seriously, don’t go around saying pookie, you sound like a god damn racist idiot.

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  259. “attempted”

    how many of those were successful

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  260. I’m sure 123 is a large number to viewers of Nancy Grace but my question is how many fingers would I need to count that high?!

    OK got one for you guys..
    Q: what is the difference between a Hooker and an onion?
    A: nobody cries when cutting up a Hooker :D

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  261. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuwHmxMPY44&feature=related

    Here’s a Chicago gangsta video that crosses cultural boundaries, all races seem to be represented in this video, white black hispanic asian, they’re all there. It’s the culture that is pervasive in the city. It’s everywhere, you just don’t pay attention to it becaise it’s so pervasive.

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  262. hd: wha? Am I missing something? Beyond the following sentence, there is no attempt in that article to draw a contrast between Chicago and the suburbs.

    “One reason families move to the suburbs is safety.”

    No evidence there, sorry.

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  263. HD please don’t lump the entire culture of hip hop with gangsta rap. that’s like me saying that black metal is indicative of all rock music. loser.

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  264. yeah there are tons of Asian and white gangstas, esp on a per capital basis..lol.

    HDs spouse why don’t you focus on feeding the baby and let us be. And we’re sure he married you for your brilliant mind & keen insights.

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  265. http://media.apps.chicagotribune.com/childabductions/map.html

    Yup, i’m wrong. The city is just as unsafe as the suburbs for this type of nonsense.

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  266. Fine I’ll call it gangsta culture.

    “sloopdeville on August 30th, 2011 at 3:02 pm

    HD please don’t lump the entire culture of hip hop with gangsta rap. that’s like me saying that black metal is indicative of all rock music. loser.”

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  267. So what do people think this should sell for? It’s a nice house in my opinion.

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  268. Enough talk about gangster culture in the city and creepers.

    This house will sell for $525,000.

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  269. I think around $700K

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  270. homedelete on August 30th, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    Pilsen’s Finest (nsfw)

    ahahaha. i remember when you first posted this, still funny.

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  271. HD: “Yup, i’m wrong. The city is just as unsafe as the suburbs for this type of nonsense.”

    Can’t tell if you are serious. Normalize this to a per-capita basis and I’m not sure this is at all worse.

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  272. City is too big to lump all the areas as being ‘unsafe’.

    Anyway, I am sure young couples look at this listing and they go ‘Ewww, ick, it’s old’.

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  273. “Anyway, I am sure young couples look at this listing and they go ‘Ewww, ick, it’s old’.”

    I think they are saying that about that comment, not the house.

    Altho, I guess it’s new, bc now you seem to have both halves of the couple saying “eww”.

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  274. HD would you believe I was watching Nancy Grace on the tele the other day and she was talking about this young mother in Florida who, would you believe, _killed her own toddler_?? I mean _can you BELIEVE that_? I’m not visiting Disneyland again if people in Florida treat their toddlers like that!!

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  275. Yes, anon, I don’t want to be sexist. It’s a buyers market, and young under 40 home-seekers want new and no reminders of old days, which means pre-1990.

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  276. gringozecarioca on August 31st, 2011 at 12:33 am

    Clio.. I guess I need your super Stamford/Hartford 800 Math SAR brain.

    If as you say:
    50 percent overpriced is 500k on a 750k property.
    100 percent overpriced is 350k on a 750k property.
    What is it overpriced by if I think it’s worth 300k??????????

    I wish i went to better schools, stupid me would then know the answer off hand, and wouldn’t have to ask Lunker what he/she meant. Must be good 2 B so smrt!

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  277. Bob – that “joke” was SO not funny.

    So when a poor unfortunate girl who has fallen into “the life” gets attacked, presumably by a customer, it’s ok to regard her as something other than a human being who’s been violated?

    Uh huh, and rape victims “were asking for it,” right?

    Sabrina, please put this guy on the “blocked” list!

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  278. gringozecarioca on August 31st, 2011 at 1:18 am

    typo on the 300, meant… ‘000’

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  279. gringozecarioca on August 31st, 2011 at 1:51 am

    ok.. I am arguing semantics of what people generally mean vs. Actual definition, with someone who I don’t know, is obviously a sociopathic liar, before even havin my coffee… I was smarter yesterday. It’s like a bad energy too close.

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  280. homedelete on August 30th, 2011 at 3:10 pm
    Enough talk about gangster culture in the city and creepers.
    This house will sell for $525,000.

    $675K, your in Lincoln Square NOT Old Irving..

    It will only go at $525 in a short sales. That lot is worth at least $400 as a tear down

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  281. “Yes, anon, I don’t want to be sexist. It’s a buyers market, and young under 40 home-seekers want new and no reminders of old days, which means pre-1990.”

    Not this young and under 40 home seeker. We love vintage in our family!

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  282. I toured the home recently and and do think it is over priced, but not by as much as some of you are suggesting. I also looked at the house the last time it was on the market and know for a fact it sold very quickly with multiple offers. It just shows you the change in the market is to blame. This seller just has to come to grips with that. Buyers out there are expecting everyone to take a loss.

    The location is amazing for those looking in Lincoln Square. In fact, the home itself is a very well known LS farmhouse, one of the first homes in the area, great curb appeal. My husband and I always lamented it as the “one that got away” which is why we took a peek again. I know many upgrades were done since that last time it was on the market. The lighting is much better and I think the owners finished the basement and added a sound system? not sure, though. There are some updates still needed, so maybe the seller should drop the price accordingly.

    The floors need to be redone, if they did this I bet there would be less gripes about pricing. The layout is differnt than the normal family room/kichen you see everywhere now-a-days, is that good or bad? The extra-wide lot and side drive add a lot of space to the yard and the ceiling height on all levels is really high, even the basement has a good ceiling height. Master closet space is small this a vintage home. If you are looking for new construction where everything is done pristine perfect, go look somewhere else.

    This home will sell once they drop the price and find a vintage loving buyer who doen’t mind doing some upgrades and getting creative with the closet situation. I’m betting high 6’s low 7’s. Eric R’s pricing isn’t that far off, he just has to convince the seller to drop.

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  283. The DB owner of 1904 W Fletcher is trying the trick of re-listing their pig for 600k to make it appear new. And from the interest barometer on ziprealty it appears to be working for now.

    Lunker is still talking about 400k lots as teardowns like he’s in a fantasy 2007 world. Sorry Lunker Lincoln Square ain’t Old Town, boss.

    Chitowngal: I thought the joke was funny and most others do, too. You don’t speak for all women but with your big head I bet that never crossed your mind. If you have so much moxy how come you’re likely in such a precarious financial position due to real estate?

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  284. Sold for 695k-hmm that is a long way from the 500k so many of you were guessing, although more than I thought it would sell for.

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