A 3-Bedroom Pre-War Deal in the Gold Coast? 1448 N. Lake Shore Drive
This 3-bedroom co-op in 1448 N. Lake Shore Drive in the Gold Coast originally came on the market in August 2015.
The building was constructed in 1928 and has just 52 units with a doorman.
This unit has 3 exposures: north, south and west and also has “treetop views.”
At 2500 square feet, it is a home in the sky with a 14×7 foyer and dining room.
There are hardwood floors throughout, custom built-ins, bookcases and crown molding.
The kitchen has white cabinets and what looks like white appliances.
The fireplace is decorative.
There’s space pac cooling and washer/dryer in the unit. The building doesn’t have parking but it’s available next door for rent.
The HOA includes the taxes.
Priced at $675,000, the listing says this is the lowest priced unit in the building at just $270 a square foot.
Even with the HOAs, is this still a deal compared to renting something of similar size?
Eugene Fu at @Properties has the listing. See the pictures here.
Unit #4C: 3 bedrooms, 2.5 baths, 2500 square feet
- I don’t have the previous sales price because it’s a co-op
- Originally listed in August 2015 for $750,000
- Reduced several times
- Currently listed at $675,000
- Assessments of $3257 a month (includes heat, doorman, cable, exercise room, exterior maintenance, lawn care, scavenger, snow removal)
- Taxes are $13184 (included in HOAs)
- Space pak cooling
- Washer/Dryer in the unit
- Parking is rental next door
- Decorative fireplace
- Bedroom #1: 18×13
- Bedroom #2: 15×13
- Bedroom #3: 14×11
- Foyer: 14×7
- Dining room: 16×15
Gorgeous place. They don’t make them this nice anymore.
That said, it seems for the vintage units, one is pretty much leasing them with the crazy assessments. So in terms of investment, these are terrible, kind of like cars.
You buy them because you need them and enjoy them with no expectation of return.
“Even with the HOAs, is this still a deal compared to renting something of similar size?”
Depends how easy it is to sell the place. I can imagine for a well off family who plans to stay a few years in Chicago this would be a good deal as long as once they are ready to move, they can get their $600K plus back fast. One major attraction of renting is that you can easily move, having to deal with sales is not fun at all.
I wonder if it would make sense for some sort of entity like a bank to buy such units and then make leases with option of paying largish sums at the beginning or paying higher rent. This is quite common in Europe. I know this is done for leasing cars here, but I have not seen something similar in US in the housing market. This way also the sellers don’t have to pay huge real-estate agent fees.
I doubt this is a deal compared to renting or anything else. The costs are staggering for what you (don’t) get. Yes it’s a nice place in a nice neighborhood but the potential to make a nice return on your investment is about zero, unlike some other properties with similar overall costs. But if you’re rich enough not to care why not…
I repeat, these older buildings that I love, are losing value relative to other types of properties because they are just plain outrageously uneconomical. Most modern buyers, younger buyers in particular, just will not front the costs of running these places.
This is a co-op, so I would assume that the property taxes are included in the HOA, which would make it more reasonable. Even so, it is much more expensive to maintain than most low-rise vintage units of comparable size.
The apartment is gorgeous, even though it has been excessively “clean walled”, a current-day fad that people will regret. I’d love to see the place with its original mill work.
Pre-war = crazy high ass. fee
love the unit, f’ing gourgeous in my eyes, with so much potential.
Laura, touched on it and we have chattered about it since the inception of cribchatter, at what point do the value of these units in gorgeous old buildings become almost nothing as the cost of upkeep get and reserves become so high it gets out of hand.
I do wonder though is if buildings like this make the HOA too high just to carry a hefty reserve for no substantial reason.
I would like to call BS!!!!
Call BS on those who say (sorry laura) that the HOA is so high because its old and the buildings insulation, windows and mechanicals are inefficient.
My house was built a long time ago too, but previous owners and me have put updates into it throughout the years to bring it into modern times with modern efficiency. yes i know its on a smaller scale, but in a condo you have more folks to carry the load.
I get that ornate detail will need more care and skilled craftsman, so yes there will be a bit of a premium in costs.
Its still BS in my eyes, and why would one pay their money now for reserves to protect the new owner in 10 years from having a special ass fee?
I love this place.
I imagine if you’re buying this type of place, you don’t expect to make a huge amount of money after selling it. You’re buying because you love the place and that it doesn’t really matter if you end up losing a little money when it’s time to sell.
Groove, as one who owns a unit in a 1929-vintage building myself, I can tell you that this place badly needs to maintain a high reserve. These older buildings need a lot of work and it is ongoing. Tuck-pointing, for example- all that lovely brick and stone work needs expensive maintenance, which you defer at your peril. As one woman I met, who served on the board of the Casa Bonita in West Ridge told me, it is better to keep the HOA higher so you have the money for these expensive and predictable jobs on hand when required, and so owners have a predictable expense that they can budget for, than it is to keep the HOA low, and hit the owners with a massive special they may not be prepared to cope with.
I currently live in a house built in 1904. The kitchen addition off the back of the original house was built in the late 90’s. Original house is solid, the brick and pointing look great, and it’s fairly energy efficient (excluding a couple rooms with original windows and no storms, which would be an easy fix). The modern addition, inside and out, leaves much to be desired in terms of build quality and efficiency. I’m about to move into a house built in the 1970’s, and I’ve resigned myself to simply laughing every time that the place will no doubt disappoint in terms of quality.
This place is awesome, perfect floorplan and all
The HOA’s include taxes thats why they’re so high
So my back of the napkin calc is coming up with a $1,288 difference to the actual monthly HOA fee which I guess woudl go to reserves. That is a third to reserves each month?
Taxes $1,099, Water $60, Com Insurance $15, Heat $95 (if its more use than dang reserves to upgrade the boiler), Doorman $275, Cable $50 (its basic cable), Gym $35 (this is a generous amount as those $19 places have more equipment), Exterior Maintenance $125, Lawn Care $25 (thats a small lawn and not that many bushes) Scavanger $160, Snow $30
Total is $1,969
HOA Fee is $3,257
So Reserves are? $1,288
Doesn’t add up
you forgot common element power, lawyers, management fees, elevator repairs, you’re also a bit low on some of your estimates
I’d much rather live in a house built in 1904 than the 1970’s, especially if the exterior has brick and/or stone, and there is lots of original woodwork inside. Eventually the cost of maintaining these buildings will result in them being acquired and torn down by developers. This is getting closer to happening in other cities with Co-ops, especially if luxury condo values continue to rise so much faster than co-ops with $3K+ assessments.
“you’re also a bit low on some of your estimates”
Where? Remember the monthly carrying costs is spread over many units here.
So common electric is what $50 per unit a month, retainer for lawyer is what $50, elevator repairs should be part of the reserves.
so fine add an extra $300 a month, but still its $1000 each month into the reserves?
“his way also the sellers don’t have to pay huge real-estate agent fees.”
and now a hit has been placed on miumiu by the Realty Cartel
Laura,
I see what you are saying about budgeting it out and not hit owners with high specials.
As to the tuckpointing, the cost should only a bit more than a typical homeowner. Yes the total cost is many times higher, but the cost is spread over many units. Also with big jobs like one for this building you would be able to haggle a bigger percentage discount than a sole SFH owner.
Condo living is supposed to be cheaper and the costs are divided among more people than a SFH (considering the size of building to units owned). But it just doesn’t seem the case.
I think 1k a month is fair savings for a place that on a ‘monthly nut basis’ is probably closer to a 1.2 million dollar property that would be 1% of the value of the home saved for emergencies, on a nearly 100 year old building thats not that crazy is it?
“I think 1k a month is fair savings for a place that on a ‘monthly nut basis’”
So its fair? say, i live there 10 years, I paid $120k into the reserves. and in those 10 years the reserves were use to upgrade and elevator, some lobby stuff, and retrofit the lighting in the common areas. My portion of that was $40k, in turn i leave with giving a building i no longer own a portion of $80k of MY MONEY.
No i dont get that back in my listing price of the unit, i actually get screwed by $50k as its been devalued because of the increasing HOA/Co-Op fees.
So in the end i gave someone/thing $130k of my cash and got nothing in return.
“1% of the value of the home saved for emergencies, on a nearly 100 year old building thats not that crazy is it?”
Not even ‘not crazy’, it’s prudent.
Here’s the thing to remember–it’s hard enough to sell a co-op; selling a co-op with a significant special assessment is basically impossible.
Regarding HOA / reserves. Who sits on co-op boards? Rich people w/ time on their hands – same people who sit on charity boards. Guess what – they love fresh orchids in the lobby every week and are more than willing to spend the other owners’ $$$ to keep the building looking 1%-y enough.
The current high reserves are either because of unchecked spending, building a massive reserve for some kind of deferred maintenance so a special isnt required or to pay for a previous high maintenance situation they didnt have the reserves for. Or maybe a combination of those factors.
Regarding specials vs consistently high fees – isn’t the point of the co-op gauntlet to weed out those who wouldn’t be able to pay the special assessment?
Insult to injury on this place is that it doesnt even have parking – you have to park next door.
SFHs can be a pain but at least YOU control the spending and make decisions.
I wonder if there has ever been a reverse special where over-bloated reserves are returned to co-op holders. Probably not – they just increased the orchid delivery to twice weekly instead.
$95 a month to heat 2,800 square ft? I can’t believe it would cost less than $250.
Why are the fire places cosmetic? Shouldn’t a building as old as this have real ones?
“$95 a month to heat 2,800 square ft? I can’t believe it would cost less than $250.”
yes $250 in the 3 winter months, and $0 for the three summer months. but averaged out by month for the year its $95
I am just going by what its costs me, for around the same sgft with all 3 levels added together. and mine includes cooking gas use.
OT, Anyone voting today? I am out of country so no voting for me.
“$95 a month to heat 2,800 square ft? I can’t believe it would cost less than $250.”
would you get to control the heat in your unit? a friend has a 1 bdrm condo and cannot adjust the temp. it sometimes is so hot we have to open the windows in the middle of winter.
I can’t imagine living anywhere that didn’t allow me to control my own heat/AC.
“I’d much rather live in a house built in 1904 than the 1970’s, especially if the exterior has brick and/or stone, and there is lots of original woodwork inside”
I agree but it does not have to be that old. Our home built in the late 50’s. And when we did our remodel last year it did not even have one single crack in the foundation.
The dual zone heat system still works flawlessly keeping the home warm and or cold! That was apparently very modern technology for that era. The walls are plaster and really keep down the noise transfer between rooms. They used a brick and steel skeleton for the house and almost sixty years in the place just feels rock solid. They sure don’t build em like they used to….
Then again it was built for an architect as his personal residence. He actually lived there for the first 35 years. And the second owners were there for 19 regrettably leaving due to a job transfer. Not sure we will last that long but it is a great place to live.
miumiu – Good for you. Hope that you are somewhere really warm and sunny. Are there tiki huts, boat drinks, and sunset views near your current location?
Nobody’s voting. The choices are all crap, just like the real estate market.
“Nobody’s voting. The choices are all crap, just like the real estate market.”
Chicago turnout was over 50%. Usual turnout for primaries is about 25%.
“The current high reserves are either because of unchecked spending, building a massive reserve for some kind of deferred maintenance so a special isnt required or to pay for a previous high maintenance situation they didnt have the reserves for. Or maybe a combination of those factors.”
No offense, but do we HAVE to explain what the maintenance costs are on a 100 year old building along the lake every single time one is listed and you complain about the assessments?
It’s NOT about having orchids in the lobby. Come on. Don’t be stupid.
This building has a doorman and just 52 units. It doesn’t say if it’s 24/7 doorman, but I’m assuming it is. That is several people working there, full time. Just 52 units have to pay for all of those salaries. And then there is usually an engineer either on-site or on call. That costs money too.
The façade of this building isn’t brand new concrete and glass. It is intricate and carved and needs maintenance, including tuckpointing. Again, there are just 52 owners to pay for all of this work.
Honestly- these assessments actually seem LOW to me. The taxes are $1,000 a month so you can take that off the top. So that leaves them at $2200 a month. That includes heat, which is probably $300 or more in the middle of winter. The cable is over $100 a month. You’re also getting an exercise room so you don’t have to pay $50 or $100 or whatever you pay for that.
And, again, you have someone shoveling all around this building in the winter time. The hallways and elevators have to be maintained. Carpet has to be replaced.
Are you really THAT clueless that you don’t think anything needs to be done to maintain a property and have a doorman accept your packages??? It’s expensive.
But artificially low HOAs in SO many buildings lull people into thinking they should be lower.
I was once in a 9 unit condo building on the north side that didn’t have a doorman or an elevator. It only had $10,000 in reserves. Monthly assessments were like $225 for a 2/2. I asked the realtor, “what happens when you have to paint the nice, historic lovely façade that clearly already has visible peeling paint?” He looked at me blankly.
I guess you will only “get it” when you get hit with a $10,000 or $20,000 special assessment.
And yes, some buildings are better run than others. There are some downtown buildings that have NEVER had a special assessment. And they have healthy reserves that can pay for the elevator replacement when it is needed. THAT is great building management.
“Condo living is supposed to be cheaper and the costs are divided among more people than a SFH”
Do SFH owners have someone sitting at their front door 24/7? Are their garages heated? Do they have an in-home gym sometimes with a pool?
Sabrina, I understand that old buildings need more maintenance, but I am surprised with these assessments. I have lived in prewar homes elsewhere and although they did not have a gym or a cable, the assessments were nowhere near as high as in US.
I wonder if this is because maintenance work is much more expensive here? Honestly people cannot to afford to pay such assessment/maintenance fees in other countries where salaries are much lower.
I would rather be hit with a special if that means low hoa’ each month. I’d rather keep my money in my own pocket then give a chunk to a group of thugs (the board members that get a little bit of power and think they rule the world).
It’s people like Gonefishin, putting their own interests first in a collective living situation, that make me want to give up condo life.
“I would rather be hit with a special if that means low hoa’ each month. I’d rather keep my money in my own pocket then give a chunk to a group of thugs”
I agree Mr. Gonefission, i dont mind *some money going to reserves but like you i would rather manage my own money.
“the board members that get a little bit of power and think they rule the world).”
they are still not as bad as the folks on the LSC or PTO. Oh my those are a crazy on anotha level!
I was recently in a condo that had a staff of 20 people. The hallways and common areas were cleaned daily by a full time janitorial staff. There was a recycling program with daily garbage collection. There was a team of valets in the garage. A staff of about 7 doormen on the rotation. A full time manager and maintenance person. HOA fee was about $675 for a 2/2.
“No offense, but do we HAVE to explain what the maintenance costs are on a 100 year old building along the lake every single time one is listed and you complain about the assessments?”
Yes we do, as the math just doesnt add up each time!
majority of the CC’ers live in old homes/buildings and like i stated above my home is old and my maintenance on the scalable level is nowhere near as high.
if an old building is inefficient and mechanical are ancient its because of years and years of the HOA not doing modern upgrades. There should be no reason a boiler or windows not be modern and efficient in this era. Plumbing? well aint nothing modern about plumbing so no excuses there either. Exterior work on buildings with ornate detail, yes that will cost more and need more skilled labor. But the totals just dont add up
“Do SFH owners have someone sitting at their front door 24/7? Are their garages heated? Do they have an in-home gym sometimes with a pool?”
Union Doorman i get the costs care high on that
this place has no garage (pre-wars dont) so no heated garage to even consider.
this place doenst have a pool so no costs there either
and the gym is 1/8 of a size of those strip mall $19 buck a month gyms. so that cost is minimal
“And, again, you have someone shoveling all around this building in the winter time.”
really, really, really? you are talking about the 5-7 times a year someone has to shovel? Its really not that much and even a lazy arse like sonies could knock it out in a hour. so even if you paid sonies $200 an hour thats only $1,400 a year spread over 52 units THAT COMES TO $2.24 A MONTH. thats it!
“That includes heat, which is probably $300 or more in the middle of winter. The cable is over $100 a month. You’re also getting an exercise room so you don’t have to pay $50 or $100 or whatever you pay for that.”
that high heat bill is because of HOA mismanagement then, it shouldn’t be that high.
the $100 cable bill? what for basic cable? nada, no way
Exercise room is not $100 a month, for that just pay $50 more for equinox.
One thing i did forget to add is an on site engineer. and yes that costs mucho too as it HAS to be a union guy.
But still it all doesn’t add up and in the end you paid in money you dont get when you leave and got no ROI out of it.
“Then again it was built for an architect as his personal residence.”
That will *never* be typical of build quality for the era. *never*. MOst houses built in the late 50s were built like crap.
Sid, it’s in Everbodys interest to keep their own money in their own pocket. The only reason why you would want to hand over your money is because you don’t know how to budget.
Groove, don’t get me started on LSC. You wouldn’t believe what is going on at Ogden. The principal is a nut and he’s getting his nutty friends to run for the LSC so he doesn’t lose his job. Even Claypool wants this nutty principal out.
“It’s NOT about having orchids in the lobby. Come on. Don’t be stupid.”
Your humor radar must be down. I also mentioned 2 other reasons in addition to unmitigated spending.
From your comment:
“No offense, but do we HAVE to explain what the maintenance costs are on a 100 year old building along the lake every single time one is listed and you complain about the assessments?”
From the post itself:
“Even with the HOAs, is this still a deal compared to renting something of similar size?”
You were the one who mentioned the high HOAs. If this wasn’t a co-op and the HOAs weren’t so high this would be a $1mm place. Of course we’re gonna talk about why they are so high – its the EXACT REASON this place is “cheap” and the DRIVING FACTOR (which you mentioned in the post itself) that would make this a good or bad buy vs rent proposal.
Regarding rent vs buy – I rented my 3/3 in RN in 2012 for $4500. Guessing that rent would be $5k by now. Assessments + taxes for that place (a condo) were about $1200/mo. Price was $650k. No brainer to buy that place instead of rent. Here you rent for $5k – $2.7k in after tax hoa (assuming 50% marginal tax rate for RE tax) = $2300 / mo = $27,600 / yr. Throw on a 5% cap rate = $552k price. So better to rent it given the price. That assumes HOA is constant which we all know is not the case. And 5% cap rate is pretty aggressive in my opinion.
“Groove, don’t get me started on LSC”
My wife did LSC as a community member before we knocked her up. She did one term and thats all the crazy she needed to see for a life time.
“Even Claypool wants this nutty principal out”
Technically he wants all of them out and the CTU.
No, he really wants this Ogden principal out. Claypool and his lawyers wrote the Ogden principal a letter and reprimanded him. Anyway, I used to wonder why people sent their kids to private if there was a good public in the area. Now I know.
“Anyway, I used to wonder why people sent their kids to private if there was a good public in the area”
Oh the private is just the same, you just pay more and surprisingly need more parent hand out$.
its always the same type of people that are attracted to things like LSC, HOA boards, PTO, ect. it seriously should be studied by some college sociology department.
“Claypool and his lawyers wrote the Ogden principal a letter and reprimanded him”
is it the parents, the LSC, or Claypool that really wants it?
“Anyway, I used to wonder why people sent their kids to private if there was a good public in the area”
for us, we didnt want to do private so we moved into a good public school option.
Groove, yes you are right, the same types always run for these things. Where did you move that you consider a good public school? I thought Ogden was good. Then I get there, and they hire a wacko principal. Claypool wants him gone. Claypool doesn’t care about LSC or parents. Claypool knows he is crazy and is setting him up. Once your boss reprimands you in writing with a cps atty signing off, the writing is on the wall.
“Where did you move that you consider a good public school?”
I am up in the Norwood neighborhood now. Our high school is turning around fast so it will be a great neighborhood option by the time little groove is ready for HS. Hopes is they build a new HS in Dunning to dramatically help the overcrowding issue it has.
“I thought Ogden was good. Then I get there, and they hire a wacko principal”
dont worry, principals dont make a school. From what I hear you got some good solid teachers there.
“Claypool knows he is crazy and is setting him up. Once your boss reprimands you in writing with a cps atty signing off, the writing is on the wall.”
Be thankful they are getting him out, sucks the tax payers will foot the bill/salary.
Principals set a tone. And good teachers transfer out of nonsense situations. The principal was interviewing in the suburbs, we were all happy. And then this principal plots to get a new LSC. He went as far as cozying up to a local reverend and asked him to run for the LSC. Now, this reverend is telling his whole congregation to vote for him, although they don’t even know what is going on at the school. A bunch of church going senior citizens are going to robot over and vote in the LSC.
One of the reasons for the strong turnout numbers was the fact that the voter rolls were scrubbed for “dead voters”, which includes people who died, but also those who moved to other areas of the city/suburbs/out of Il, etc. In the past, people stayed on the voter rolls for extremely long time periods, that’s how dead people have “voted” in prior elections.
Also Dave the register to vote at the polls, plus 17 year olds helped that number too. But many polling centers on the far NW side had lines out the door for the first time.
“Principals set a tone. And good teachers transfer out of nonsense situations”
Very true, but the older good teachers wont transfer as they know if a new Principal will last or not. And the good young ones are to wet behind the ears to transfer. You will loose the middle of the road ones though.
Yes I know too much about teachers (CPS and Burbs) for someone not in that field. My whole hood is teachers so block parties and kids playing and talking to neighbors means there is always talking to teachers.
“He went as far as cozying up to a local reverend and asked him to run for the LSC”
Good move on his part, to protect him from the school parents. but wont do anything if Forest has a target on him.
I will say though some principals have clout, and it may take longer than expected to give the boot. I will talk up my “network” and see what the word is over by you.
Why’s the ogden principal a nutjob? For trying to merge Ogden and Jenner?
“One of the reasons for the strong turnout numbers was the fact that the voter rolls were scrubbed for “dead voters””
When did that happen??
Per the Chicago BOE:
2016 primary registered voters = 1514912; total ballots = 858314; 56.7%
2000 primary registered voters = 1384438; total ballots = 453929; 32.8%
Chose 2000 as the last potus primary contested on both sides w/o Obama on the ballot. Also happens to be the oldest with online info.
So, they scrubbed the rolls and found an extra 10% of voters??
The comparison was to 2008 only. Maybe they only scrub it every 16 yrs
“The comparison was to 2008 only”
Try again:
2008 primary registered voter total = 1307519
2008 general registered voter total = 1497292
Still more registered voters yesterday than in 2008.
Ok, well the news media made that up last night then. Wouldn’t be the first time. They referred to Cook County I think, but Chicago is 2/3 of cook county anyways.
“They referred to Cook County I think”
That’s a different kettle. Lemme take a look…
2016 primary — 1,443,261 registered voters
2008 primary — 1,350,580 registered voters
2008 general — 1,436,210 registered voters
and, for funsies:
2000 primary — 1,219,409 registered voters
2000 general — 1,308,940 registered voters
So, not correct for suburban Cook, either. As you note, not really surprising that the media can’t get it right.
The peak registration number for suburban Cook was in the 2009 (state/local) election cycle at 1,463,070.
“That’s a different kettle. Lemme take a look…”
Are you counting all the people who actually registered yesterday? They changed the law. You could register and vote on the same day for the first time yesterday. Supposedly over 18,000 did that. Also, 17 year olds were allowed to vote for the first time as well (as long as they were turning 18 by November.)
“I was recently in a condo that had a staff of 20 people. The hallways and common areas were cleaned daily by a full time janitorial staff. There was a recycling program with daily garbage collection. There was a team of valets in the garage. A staff of about 7 doormen on the rotation. A full time manager and maintenance person. HOA fee was about $675 for a 2/2.”
How many units are there to spread out these costs? 150, 200, 300, 500? It matters.
What are the reserves like? You don’t say- so we have no idea.
I know plenty of condos with “low” assessments and then, whoops, here comes the bill for the $25,000 special to “fix” the balconies or the brick walls or the parking lot that needs to have the potholes repaired, or the concrete is crumbling somewhere.
Big buildings take a lot of maintenance. It’s just the reality. If you can’t handle it, don’t live in one. And don’t think that other buildings can cut corners because they’re so “smart.” They’re not. Some ARE, however, better managed than others. It behooves everyone looking to buy a condo to really dig down into what the management has done in the past. If you don’t, you’re an idiot.
“I wonder if this is because maintenance work is much more expensive here? Honestly people cannot to afford to pay such assessment/maintenance fees in other countries where salaries are much lower.”
Ever see the assessments in New York City? They are much, much higher than anything I’ve ever seen in Chicago. I never asked my friends who live there why. You’d think most of the costs would be the same.
In San Francisco, I always found them to be pretty similar to Chicago costs.
“Ever see the assessments in New York City?”
No, because i live in chicago and care less about what other pay/do in other cities.
“Big buildings take a lot of maintenance. It’s just the reality”
no its not. Buildings of any size takes the same amount of maintenance. The scale may be larger, but it doesnt take more or more frequent than any other building.
“the parking lot that needs to have the potholes repaired”
these are Heated garages on condo buildings and will not have pothole issues. It is removed from the freeze thaw cycle and is concrete not asphalt.
I still call BS on saying that ‘its because it cost more to maintain theses buildings’. No if the argument is ‘having union doorman 24/7 and union on site engineer is as expensive as crazy shyte’ then i can get behind that.
“Why is the principal such a nut job, for trying to merge Ogden/Jenner”.
Actually, he didn’t have a dog in that fight. That merger idea was before him. However, that merger is going to go through anyway. They can’t leave Jenner to just sit there 20 percent full while all other north side schools are busting out of the seams.
Groove, thanks for any info you have.
“Are you counting all the people who actually registered yesterday?”
I’m not counting anything. I am referencing the “total registered voters” numbers from Chicago BOE and the Cook County Clerk.
And, if anything, same-day registration would make the total higher, which just further emphasizes that whichever news Dave was reading/watching/listening to was simply making shit up.
these are Heated garages on condo buildings and will not have pothole issues. It is removed from the freeze thaw cycle and is concrete not asphalt.
Um…no. There are dozens, hundreds maybe thousands (??) condo buildings in Chicago with outdoor parking where the lot will have to be maintained (asphalt, snow plowed, relined etc. etc.) Not every condo building has an indoor garage. Some just have 3 outdoor spaces behind the building. Some have 6 spaces. Some have 50 to 100. It varies.
And my reference to big buildings needing a lot of maintenance applies to ALL big buildings. An 8 unit building doesn’t have to spend a million dollars re-doing the hallways.
Ever been in 165 N. Canal in the West Loop? That’s just one example. Redoing the hallways is a HUGE job. Heck, just repainting them, let alone recarpeting them, is a huge expense. It’s a different animal compared to an 8-flat in Roscoe Village.
No offense Groove, but I don’t think you’ve ever lived in a condo building before. And that’s okay. It’s not for you (which is why you argue about the assessments.)
“Ever see the assessments in New York City?”
“No, because i live in chicago and care less about what other pay/do in other cities.”
The person was commenting about OTHER CITIES Groove. That the assessments aren’t as high in many other places. That’s why I said- ours in Chicago are much less than NYC but it doesn’t make sense why (many buildings around the same age and with similar amenities.)
“No offense Groove, but I don’t think you’ve ever lived in a condo building before.”
None taken, you are correct never did condo living, it doesnt make sense to me financially. my bias is because pre-family i choose to rent, and go striaght from renting to SFH owning. skipping the 2/2 condo phase as it didnt make sense to me and still doesnt.
“Not every condo building has an indoor garage. Some just have 3 outdoor spaces behind the building. Some have 6 spaces”
Realy? that doesn’t seem like a lot of maintenance even if you jumped the hypothetical to 10 spot. and really the building we are speaking of above doesnt even have parking.
“And my reference to big buildings needing a lot of maintenance applies to ALL big buildings. An 8 unit building doesn’t have to spend a million dollars re-doing the hallways”
Yes a 8 unit building is not as big as a 75 unit building. thats why i mention TO SCALE above. An 75 unit building will spend $112k on hallways so thats what $1.5k each unit. an 8 unit building will need to spend $12K on hallways so the same $1.5k is spent. So ON SCALE its the same
take your parking lot thing, a 125 car parking lot pitch and repave is about $90k so $1,520 per spot. a 12 car lot repave is $22k so about $1830 per spot. TO SCALE its around the same cost per unit. (i just approved a check for our company to pitch and repave one side of our lot, so i used those estimates for the calc)
“Heck, just repainting them, let alone recarpeting them, is a huge expense. It’s a different animal compared to an 8-flat in Roscoe Village”
As explained a 8 unit building has no need for a huge hallways, but again TO SCALE the maintenance costs are around the same PER UNIT as any other building. So yes at first glance a bill for $300,000 is larger than a bill for $15,000, and thats a shock. but when you find that bill of $300,000 will equally be pitched in to pay by 100 people and the $15,000 will be paid by 5 people. Then you realize they are are paying $3,000 each, nothing shocking about that.
Now if the argument is, a boutique building with 2 units a floor has two 24/7 doorman a heated indoor garage w/ valet and a 3 union engineers on staff, will cost more to maintain. Then yes I can agree.