Ravenswood Manor Single Family Home Near the River Sells: 2717 W. Windsor

We chattered about this 3-bedroom stucco home at 2717 W. Windsor in Ravenswood Manor in September 2009.

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See our prior chatter and pictures here.

The house was built in 1900 and had a professionally landscaped yard along with a 2-car garage. It had hardwood floors throughout and beamed ceilings.

The large attic was “awaiting the buyer’s finishing touches.”

In the prior chatter, some of you thought $699,000 was a dreaming price and some thought it would sell in the $500,000s mainly due to the fact that it had no central air.

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Diana Duvall at Baird & Warner had the listing.

2717 W. Windsor: 3 bedrooms, 3 baths, 2 car garage, no square footage listed

  • I couldn’t find an original sale price- same owner since 1986
  • Was listed in September 2009 for $699,900
  • Sold in January 2010 for $625,000
  • Taxes of $7445
  • No central air
  • Bedroom #1: 19×16
  • Bedroom #2: 17×12
  • Bedroom #3: 11×8
  • Attic: 39×9

104 Responses to “Ravenswood Manor Single Family Home Near the River Sells: 2717 W. Windsor”

  1. Hot hot hotttt market!

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  2. I love Ravenswood Manor. Pretty neighborhood. $625k, i think, is a great deal on that house.

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  3. Considering you could have the same or slightly nicer house in Winnetka or Wilmette, that is a big price.

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  4. The same house in Lincoln Square proper or Roscoe Village would be no cheaper, so given the location and the fact it’s somewhat unique, this looks like a good price. If any of the cribhaters can produce a comp that sold in the $500’s I would love to see it.

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  5. What on earth is the point of trying to compare this house to one in a location like Winnetka or Wilmette? That’s not apples and oranges, that’s apples and rutabagas.

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  6. Patience on the way down my friend, patience.

    “If any of the cribhaters can produce a comp that sold in the $500’s I would love to see it.”

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  7. They are different no doubt, but its an interesting comparison for a family that is considering a move away from a dense urban environment (which RM tends to be). Ironically, commute to downtown is closer than you might realize. Granted not everyone works downtown.

    I suspect that a large portion of families look at multiple areas in both the city and suburbs before making a home purchase decision above the 500k range. I liken them to independent voters, and we all saw the power that even a small shift there can have on overall dynamics.

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  8. Actually, I retract my statement that this was a good price. This was an marginally lukewarm deal at $625K – reading through some of the layout issues in the prior chatter and the comp that closed at $525k in July 09, it doesn’t look as good. Maybe $575-$599k would have been a real deal. Did I just become a cribhater??

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  9. If I had children and wanted good public schools, I would HAVE to choose Wilmette or Winnetka, which is why it surprises me that a place in Ravenswood Manor would sell higher than a comparable in one of these top-tier suburbs.

    Unless you can get your child into one of the selective-enrollment schools, you are stuck with private schools, which adds considerably to the cost of living in the city.

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  10. “Patience on the way down my friend, patience.”

    In the past year, b/t Montrose and Lawrence, Kedzie to the river, there have been 21 SFH sales (per redfin). 15 of them were for less than $600k, 4 for over $1mm (all apparently new construction). Maybe none of the 15 are good comps, but this place is the high end of non-new houses in RM.

    On JMM: If my two choices for ~$600k-650k were this sort of place in RM and the sorts of places currently listed in the same asking range in Win/Wil, and I had no requirement to live in the city, I’d be hard pressed to choose RM. And, as should be clear, I’m not a fan of Win/Wil.

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  11. “Did I just become a cribhater??”

    By your own apparent standards, yes, you did. You are now barred from asserting that criticism of asking price = hate.

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  12. No my friend, you have touched the monolith and you have evolved.

    “A*Man on January 21st, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    Actually, I retract my statement that this was a good price. This was an marginally lukewarm deal at $625K – reading through some of the layout issues in the prior chatter and the comp that closed at $525k in July 09, it doesn’t look as good. Maybe $575-$599k would have been a real deal. Did I just become a cribhater??”

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  13. Disclaimer: I live a few blocks away from here (closer to lincoln square, other side of the river), so I have a vested interest in this.

    Neighborhood is great, although a bit too far from Lincoln Square proper for my taste. Great parks, small shops, lots of room.

    Schools here are a reasonable bet. It might not continue, but from everything I see about Waters (neighborhood school) it has the potential to be very good in then near future. All the signs are pointing to improvement – scores are higher in the lower grades than the higher grades, new building and grounds, involved parent community w/increasing numbers of kids staying in-district.

    Commute is fine – it takes me 40 (very relaxing, seat on the el) minutes to downtown door-to-door.

    I would have expected something closer to the high 500’s without AC, but for someone who wants a suburb feel with city conveniences this is perfect. There’s also not a of turnover in this area, so there may be a premium for that.

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  14. At some point, the W’s and other top tier suburbs are relevant comparisons to the likely family buyer here (though that’s an assumption obviously).

    The other reason I made the comment is the house in question here looks like it belongs on a 50 x 150 lot in East Winnetka near the metra line. There are quite a few of them for sale and they do trade in the 600’s. If I worked downtown, had kids and needed an equivalent amount of space, I would have to seriously think about it.

    I am biased by where I live, but still: when I see i) old houses in ii) neighborhoods that might as well be suburbs that iii) don’t have the best commutes… trade near similar properties in very good New Trier Township school districts… I think it further substantiates that the city is overpriced on a relative basis.

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  15. “Commute is fine – it takes me 40 (very relaxing, seat on the el) minutes to downtown door-to-door.”

    That is higher than I thought. I think it takes all of 35 minutes from the Indian Hill metra stop to the loop. 5 minute walk to your xyz professional services office environment.

    So I’d be hard pressed not to buy this house for the same price and send my kids to Greeley which is a perennial contender for a top 100 elementary school in the state:

    http://www.redfin.com/IL/Winnetka/607-Orchard-Ln-60093/home/13784556

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  16. Hasn’t it always been the case (even before the bubble) that many houses in the city had mediocre/bad schools and nevertheless were priced at or above suburban homes with excellent schools? That’s partly a statement and partly a question.

    I like RM a lot. Lack of school and long commute (can be 45 min depending on where you work) kills it for me.

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  17. I dont think so DZ. Pretty sure burbs used to be higher priced going back into the 80s. Esp winnetka vs rm. could be wrong though.

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  18. “Hasn’t it always been the case (even before the bubble) that many houses in the city had mediocre/bad schools and nevertheless were priced at or above suburban homes with excellent schools? That’s partly a statement and partly a question.”

    I didn’t even think it was a point of contention, but maybe I’m wrong.

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  19. Take it from me folks… the city is for living and the suburbs are for dying. Don’t go before your time or you will be sorry!

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  20. “Pretty sure burbs used to be higher priced going back into the 80s. Esp winnetka vs rm. could be wrong though.”

    I would say until the late 1990s this was true. The SFH craze in certain areas of the city started in the early 2000s. The higher end lake shore suburbs held up for a while (there was a time when an bare 100 x 175 lot in KW fetched $2+M), but fell much harder in the downturn.

    Whatever your view, its still another reason why Chicago RE is still overpriced.

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  21. JMM,

    your place in the W’s+glen’s is like double the taxes!

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  22. “your place in the W’s+glen’s is like double the taxes!”

    Sweet, time for some more school discussion

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  23. “your place in the W’s+glen’s is like double the taxes!”

    The one he linked to is $3600 more. That’s about the same as sending one kid to Catholic school, no?

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  24. My impression of La Grange is that a house like the W house linked to, maybe not quite as redone inside, might have gone for low to mid $300K in late 1990s, and now would be about mid $500K. At a gross level, that doesn’t seem that different from changes in price in the city, setting aside areas with serious gentrification.

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  25. Honestly, I didn’t look at the taxes, but Groove, you of all people are willing to pay them for a good school district.

    You do find a fair number of older homeowners that get taken advantage of on taxes up there. They do not elect senior or even homeowner, do not dispute, etc. I know they have the money to pay it but still, it’s tantamount to a form of elder abuse.

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  26. “The one he linked to is $3600 more. That’s about the same as sending one kid to Catholic school, no?”

    at first glance i thought it was 14k. oops

    “Honestly, I didn’t look at the taxes, but Groove, you of all people are willing to pay them for a good school district.”

    I AM willing to pay that extra for school, parks, and streets. but not everyone. just was pointing it out for others thats all

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  27. ““Commute is fine – it takes me 40 (very relaxing, seat on the el) minutes to downtown door-to-door.”

    That is higher than I thought. I think it takes all of 35 minutes from the Indian Hill metra stop to the loop. 5 minute walk to your xyz professional services office environment. ”

    True. I didn’t go into too many details, but I can actually get home in 30 minutes door to door, but it’s a bit less relaxing. Metra to Ravenswood, el to house. Total cost with the link-up is less than a Zone C metra pass. If I leave the office at 4:57 I generally walk in the door at 5:28 or so.

    If you wanted to go for it full suburb style you could drive 1 mile to the ravenswood stop and take the metra in.

    I’m just making the point that although it looks pretty far out there it’s not bad commute-wise. I can certainly see people preferring to live in the suburbs for the same price or even more.

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  28. “Sweet, time for some more school discussion”

    love you too barry :)

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  29. I’m actually doing a lot of looking right around the Ravenswood Metra stop. It’s a 17 minute train ride and about a 5 minute walk to my office vs. an equivalent ~50+ taking the CTA via the red or brown line and walking to Madison/Wacker area. The way to really fly, bitches!!!

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  30. “I can certainly see people preferring to live in the suburbs for the same price or even more.”

    And I’m not necessarily advocating that (hell my dissertation was political ramifications of 1960’s white flight), but I do think this is a reason why HD (and even Bob) are correct on city real estate.

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  31. Hahaha just poking fun; I realize it’s a BIG deciding factor and incredibly relevant to the whole RE discussion (for those of you with kids, at least), it just seems like every single posting at some point devolves into the nuances of CPS and city vs. suburbs :)

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  32. “The way to really fly, bitches!!!”

    And you can drink and fewer homeless guys to attack you… And if you live on the North Shore, hell you can join a club and have your own car (provided you leave work at the exact same time each and every day, which no one does).

    I only wish Metra North had more stops in the city. I think they are building another one between Ravenswood and Rogers Park. You can tell who it was designed for though — some stops in the suburbs are only a few blocks apart, while there are only 2 functioning stops in city.

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  33. “it just seems like every single posting at some point devolves into the nuances of CPS and city vs. suburbs ”

    Only if there are at least 3 BRs.

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  34. “Only if there are at least 3 BRs.”

    Sort of true but there should be a rule on this.

    I remember there was a 2br on Howe or Cleveland that the RE broker was claiming was suitable for a single mother with kids in the Lincoln school district. That is and always will be a serious stretch IMO.

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  35. no worries barry :) I think i am done with the cps debate or at least i will try.

    the burb debate will always pop up. for me it pops up everytime i have a few bad days in my hood, which has been more frequent.

    “Only if there are at least 3 BRs.”
    LOL @ Anon

    “hell my dissertation was political ramifications of 1960’s white flight”
    I would like to read that JMM.
    i still say too many white people in one place scares me.

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  36. Metra plans to build a stop on the north side of Peterson by 2012. Let’s hope it happens…

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  37. Barry, we’re in the same boat. But, we don’t want single family. Hubby would love to be near enough to that Ravenswood stop…

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  38. Q:

    This one: http://cribchatter.com/?p=7614 may have satisfied you, but apparently it sold.

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  39. “Barry, we’re in the same boat. But, we don’t want single family. Hubby would love to be near enough to that Ravenswood stop…”

    I’d like a SFH to some extent, but I sure can’t afford one (at least anywhere that isn’t a war zone). Sadly, I wasn’t one of those Big Ten grads that was handed a $100k job as soon as I graduated :(

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  40. The tax differences between this place and the Winnetka house are as follows:

    Winnetka 2008/pay2009 w/HO exempt = $11,002.28 (rate = 5.344%)
    Chicago 2008/pay2009 w/HO exempt = $7,867.71 (rate = 4.816%)

    Winnetka 2008 assessed MV = $778,490
    Winnetka 2009 assessed MV = $739,570 (-5.0%)

    Chicago 2008 assessed MV = $615,610
    Chicago 2009 assessed MV = $666,410 (+8.25%)

    Both of these are due for a tax appeal.

    It appears that tax rates in New Trier Twp could go lower than Chicago’s when the 2009 rates are released next summer. This would be due to the coming comm’l to residential tax shift being more pronounced in areas with a higher ratio of comm’l to residential assessment.

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  41. “They are different no doubt, but its an interesting comparison for a family that is considering a move away from a dense urban environment (which RM tends to be). Ironically, commute to downtown is closer than you might realize. Granted not everyone works downtown.”

    I know a few high-earning couples with kids who have moved to RM recently, and none of them even considered moving to a suburb.

    Maybe this is unique to the born-and-raised in Chicago crowd, but I think we tend to view the school difficulty in the vein of “the devil we know being better than a devil we don’t know.”

    Or, maybe they’ll move to the burbs before their kids hit high school, that’s always a possibility.

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  42. We had some interest in it, but it was too close to both sets of tracks for me. Hubby would have bought it, I think.

    “This one: http://cribchatter.com/?p=7614 may have satisfied you, but apparently it sold.”

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  43. Well also high wage earning couples tend to be able to afford private and parochial options.

    The trend you observed is definitely true of Graceland West, by the way.

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  44. G,

    you crafty devil, that puts things into a new light!

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  45. “Maybe this is unique to the born-and-raised in Chicago crowd, but I think we tend to view the school difficulty in the vein of “the devil we know being better than a devil we don’t know.””

    My experience it the opposite. My “born-and-raised” cohorts tend to GTFO of Chicago. The exceptions are those who have residency requirements, but they are also those with clout for whom schools just seem to work out in their favor.

    It’s the transplants that seem to believe in the CPS. I always figured it was just due to them wrapping up so much of their identity to the folks back home in being able to say “I live in Chicago.” “I live in Wilmette” has some meaning to a Chicagoan, not so much if from bumblestank Kentucky (thanks, sonies.)

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  46. I think transplants (those in the nicer hoods) do often believe in CPS in general, but the folks I grew up with seem confident that they know how to work in the system to get their kids into a good magnet/gifted (I forget which is which) school, or worst-case, go with a private. No, my childhoods friends are definitely not in any way huge fans of CPS, they just see it as another obstacle in life, not the defining one.

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  47. A colleague of mine jokes that when he met his wife he described how we grew up in a quaint small town in Illinois that only had 2k people, no grocery store or movie theater and was located outside of Chicago. She was from the East Coast and pictured a place with cornfields and cows. When she showed up for dinner in Kenilworth she was in for quite a shock.

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  48. I doubt I am typical, but I am a transplant. The suburbs just scare me, especially the high end suburbs. So do fancy private schools. That leaves me trying to figure out if something in CPS works. And I have no particular love for CPS.

    I have zero CPS clout. I’m just getting up to speed on CPS but think the system can be worked even w/o clout at the elementary school level. Or you can buy into one of the few good districts.

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  49. Why do the suburbs scare you again? Where did you move from?

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  50. Suburbs scare me too. And I’m a transplant. But, I don’t have kids.

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  51. “Why do the suburbs scare you again? Where did you move from?”

    Conformity, entitlement, privilege. Elitism of the wrong sort.

    I’ve moved around a lot, most recently east coast, but have spent significant portions of my life outside US. Have lived in cities almost all my life.

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  52. Uh, that’s like a handful of elite suburbs in the north shore, northwest burb’s or in DuPage County. There are plenty of suburbs with decent schools and regular wage earning people. You obviously don’t go out there much but for all practical purposes there isn’t much difference between most of the burbs, in some hoods there are bigger homes and in some there are smaller homes, the schools in general are better than the city and in fact, as I’ve shown repeatedly, it’s tends to be more diverse and less segregated (outside of a handful of high end burbs). Palatine and Arlington heights (next to each other) which are prime examples of a sprawling suburbia in the NW corner of Cook County have nearly 200,000 people between them, they have rich areas, poor areas, and plenty of areas in between with lots of tract homes, decent schools and more diversity. Yes it’s soulless but that’s the melting pot that is supposed to represent America. The suburbs have changed a lot since the 1950’s leave it to beaver attitude. The second generation immigrant left the city long long ago and they too want the same things that the whitebread crackers want and they move to the ‘burbs. I love the city and I’ll stay here as long as I can until the blight sets in again on the northside, maybe in my lifetime, maybe not. Who knows but you really should take an opportunity to get to know the geographical area you live in. you might actually find you enjoy other areas of the state that aren’t on teh chicago grid.

    “DZ on January 21st, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    “Why do the suburbs scare you again? Where did you move from?”

    Conformity, entitlement, privilege. Elitism of the wrong sort.”

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  53. Evanston is a good example of a North Shore suburb that also fits this bill. It has wealthy areas and poor areas and feels like its own city. It is also a college town which has nice ancillary benefits. It has one very good primary school (Willard) which is located in a nice area. Jr. high and high school are subject to debate. Evanston, along with Oak Park, is also one of the most liberal suburbs in the area.

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  54. The burbs scare me too much for the same reasons DZ mentions. As a transplant also I am totally and completely perplexed by the New Trier ‘machine’ and attitude. Just not something I want to surround myself with or my kids.

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  55. This is a two-bedroom professional couple house; look at the bedroom sizes. Bet this house was purchased by two professionals, sans children, who think they’ll do the “house in the city” routine.

    Been there; done that.

    Commute from Ravenswood Manor is not by Metra; it’s Ravenswood Line, now known as Brown Line, chug-chug-chugging along for 45 minutes of there are no delays, packed by the time it gets to Lakeview. A yuppie crowd, but unlikely to give a pregnant woman a seat. (I knew a pregnant woman who said she was offered a seat on the Brown Line Fullerton transfer only two times in her last month of pregnancy.)

    School situation is not promising, and Montessori school at $13,000/kid from preschool onward is an expensive proposition. Blagovich’s two daughters attend Montessori school, and that’s a $26,000+ after-tax annual expense. It makes suburban taxes look palatible.

    Shopping situation is an experience in ethnic blue-collar lifestyle; Lawrence Avenue is hispanic-korean, and never upscale. Nothing fancy, and sometimes little english translation needed.

    All this for $625,000 per year. Gee. It’s not “conformity, entitlement, privelege” – it’s kids, education, reasonably decent neighborhood amenities, easier Metra commute that makes us suburbanites. For the hard-core, there’s always Evanston, Oak Park, Riverside, Wilmette, River Forest, all with a strong “sense of place” as we architects call it.

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  56. “All this for $625,000 per year. Gee. It’s not “conformity, entitlement, privelege” – it’s kids, education, reasonably decent neighborhood amenities, easier Metra commute that makes us suburbanites.”

    You forgot to mention all the chain restaurants you can handle. :)

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  57. Architect,

    Which is why it still amazes me that homes continue to sell for the prices they do!

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  58. Evanston I like. But commute is not great and it’s serious hike from Evanston to SW suburbs where we visit family a lot.

    Oak Park is also ok, but I don’t like how people in Oak Park are entirely too satisfied with themselves for living in Oak Park. I don’t really like liberals (or most conservatives) that much either. (It is entirely possible the main problem is I am a misanthrope.) And high taxes in OP.

    As for the suburbs HD mentions, I just don’t see any point in living out there. Also my office is not that close to metra, so commute would suck with any suburb.

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  59. “For the hard-core, there’s always Evanston, Oak Park, Riverside, Wilmette, River Forest, all with a strong “sense of place” as we architects call it.”

    Interesting and all towns with great architecture. I for one live in a George Maher house. As long as you can stomach what is inside the walls when you remodel, it’s a classic work worth preserving. Unfortunately not all my neighbors agree.

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  60. The commute from Evanston to the city sucks. But it is a nice town. Great amenities and diversity of housing. However, we found that there wasn’t much to look at in the mid range of pricing. Stuff was either next to a crack house, too rich for us, or over run with undergrads. Didn’t see a lot of nice stuff(as in didn’t require a ton of work or have some serious other flaws) in the $400-$600 range when I was looking at houses.

    I really like the People’s Republic of Oak Park though. Great tree lined streets, architecture, decent amenities, easy commute to downtown. The it’s all Bush’s fault liberalism is a bit much sometimes though.

    Single family homes are a bit pricey in the city and I know we decided it wasn’t worth it. Evanston and Oak Park are a nice compromise for city folks who would otherwise cut their wrists if they had to move to the McSuburbs with tract housing, minivans, and a date night means dining at Red Lobster.

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  61. Russ,

    What about NW Evanston near the Willard school? Thinking streets like Thayer, Park pl, Isabella, etc? Or south of Central?

    I’d bet 500-600k would get a nice house there nowadays.

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  62. “(I knew a pregnant woman who said she was offered a seat on the Brown Line Fullerton transfer only two times in her last month of pregnancy.)”

    Yes, and the young mothers with toddlers, struggling. It disgusts me. You want to grab the first able bodied 20 something and pick them up and throw them on the floor.

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  63. “Conformity, entitlement, privilege. Elitism of the wrong sort.

    I’ve moved around a lot, most recently east coast, but have spent significant portions of my life outside US. Have lived in cities almost all my life.”

    I don’t live in the burbs and don’t plan to, but it has nothing to do with the imaginary things you mentioned. In your first line. From that alone you strike me as an east coast liberal arts grad who has seen one too many showings of “Little Children”.

    The city beats the burbs for walkability, cuisine and meeting other singles. But “Conformity, entitlement, privilege. Elitism of the wrong sort” is all BS imagined crap you heard in your sociology class. Most people in the burbs of a certain age (30+) are more down to earth than most city folks is my experience.

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  64. “The commute from Evanston to the city sucks.”

    You are referring to the el and not Metra.

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  65. “you strike me as an east coast liberal arts grad who has seen one too many showings of “Little Children””

    “all BS imagined crap you heard in your sociology class”

    Not liberal arts, never came close to a sociology class, and had to look up “Little Children” just now. I am talking about the “elite” suburbs and I will happily agree that my complaints about them may thereby be self inflicted. I don’t know if you would disagree about my complaints as applied to Winnetka etc.

    FWIW, I agree about the benefits you list for the city (happily married so zero interest in meeting singles, but did meet my wife here). There are some good restaurants in the suburbs, especially the “non-elite” ones.

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  66. Can anyone tell me the deal with 1928 N Hoyne? Is it short sale? Bank owned? I see some stuff in the listing notes I don’t fully understand. Sold for 920K in 05, 1.05MM in 07, now listed at 740K. Odd layout, 3 bds seem to all be on different levels.

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  67. I still am not clear on all this drama over CPS grammar schools. No one wants to send their kid to a failing and underperfoming school in the lower 50%, but c’mon… aren’t we putting WAY too much emphasis on the school, and not enough on what goes on at home, and what parents do to make sure their kids learn? I went to fairly average CPS grammar schools, always did really well, scored very high on all standardized tests, because learning and schoolwork, educational achievement were highly valued at home. In my case, the public high schools were unacceptable (Lane Tech? maybe good enough, but too many boys back in the 70’s when they first started admitting girls…) so, off to Catholic girl’s high school. We were not especially well-off, but dad scrounged enough for that and my braces, too.

    What’s the big change that I’m not grasping here? If we were talking CPS in really distressed communities, I’d agree, but is a local CPS school in a middle-class neighborhood like RM really so crappy that it would be a deal-breaker?

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  68. “easier Metra commute that makes us suburbanites”

    I am currently in Naperville – my door to door commute is an hour and a half each way. Leave the house at 6:50, get on the train at 7:17, pull in to US at about 8:02, disembark and walk to office, sit down by about 8:20. Leave my office at 5, train pulls out at 5:22, gets in at a little after 6:05, pull in the driveway at 6:30. That is the express train that makes only two stops. If I have to take a local train, forget about it. I can shave a few minutes here and there if I had to, but I do certain things that take a few extra seconds/minutes to save my sanity.

    I grew up in Bolingbrook and Naperville. I’m a pretty well adjusted, middle of the road politically, generally tolerant, Engineer type. The suburbs (completely generically speaking) are soul sucking, Revolutionary Road kind of shit. Strip malls and vast swathes of the exact same home for as far as the eye can see, just about completely devoid of culture. Granted, I’m over generalizing, but god damn why anyone would want to live here (West burbs, specifically) if not to take a bullet for their children is beyond me.

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  69. “I am currently in Naperville”

    Barry,
    my new friend, you are never going to live that down from me :)

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  70. logansquarean,

    I am supprised that you gone through CPS dont see its sub-par performance.
    I will say the grammar schools do get bashed but i will say 100% the High Schools are a POS.
    I went to a top grammar CPS, and a top CPS High School as well as a bottom CPS HS. I was not prepared for college at all and i wasnt “bad performer”. when i got my shyt together i was at the top of my class.

    example, I have a friend who graduated Valedictorian from an average CPS HS went to UofI and failed out the first year. and not because of partying or being homesick or the freedom it was because she wasnt prepared and struggled. and UofI really isnt that hard of a school.

    ok groove is pretty drunk right now so i cant drive home. i guess i will sleep on my buddies couch. guess who is going to be late for work tomorrow :)

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  71. groove, maybe more has changed in the years that I’ve been out of the CPS system than I can even imagine, even in the demographically better areas? I guess I need to look at more numbers to understand this better… Although I have noticed that the kids from poverty level homes in the worst schools borders on 100%. hmmmm. Just keep in mind that my CPS experiences were in the 1960’s. Crap. I’m old. :-)
    Maybe it’s time to look into joining a Local School Council or something to see just what the hell is going on over there.

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  72. “Just keep in mind that my CPS experiences were in the 1960’s”

    as mine were from the 80’s and very early 90’s. and now most of my opinion is based on test scores and my couple of friends that are teachers in CPS.
    I will admit i am jaded from my experiences and what i saw around me. but the hearsay that i get is that it really hasn’t changed all that much. its just now they schools focus on teach to state tests than TEACHING.

    also CPS district is huge and even if you went in the 60’s change in that system will take awhile compared to a small district or private school.

    i hope i made some sense, im tired and my wife handed my azz to me this morning.

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  73. “Barry,
    my new friend, you are never going to live that down from me”

    It’s for purely financial reasons, let me assure you. And just to be clear, it’s a pretty good place for kids all things considered (I think it was voted USA Today most child friendly town in America or some other such nonsense a few times). Plenty of sports and other little bastards to pal around with, great schools and all that. I have no regrets about having grown up there.

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  74. JMM:

    When we were looking, we just didn’t see anything. Of course, this was like six years ago now, but everything we looked at in our price range was either decently sized, but really dumpy or not so dumpy, but really small or in a part of Evanston we didn’t really care for. Admittedly, we didn’t look in Evanston all that hard as we quickly decided the commute wouldn’t work for the wife, but we really liked it since we lived there shortly while in graduate school. I am sure the inventory now is a lot more plentiful though.

    Regarding schools, I agree with LoganSquarean. The parental involvement is much more important. However, there is a line that gets crossed where a school is so shitty that it affects even the smart kids. My middle school was pretty bad and the lack of challenging work since everything was dumbed down really screwed me up when I went to high school which was similar to a New Trier like school. I was so far behind it wasn’t funny. Took my freshman and sophomore year to catch up and learn how to be successful in a competitive environment.

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  75. Barry,

    hey i am only ribbing ya and will use it as my running joke with ya :)
    secretly my wife wants to move to naperville and i am entertaining her idea. for test purposes we will be spending a day there shopping, dinning, going to a park, and walking the streets of a open house we are attending there. I did live in naperville for three months once but i was young and couldnt take it.

    russ,
    Parental involvement is HUGE, i mean seriously HUGE!!!!! If it wanst for my parents involvement i wouldnt be where i am at today. i would not have graduated and would not have gone to college. Its so easy to slip through the cracks in the CPS system and i did many times, it was my parents that wouldnt let that stand. they challenged the school and myself.

    Crib Chatters unite and defend our community…. http://yochicago.com/call-of-the-wild-realtor-bashing-in-action/13741/

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  76. Groove77. 100% agree. My parents kept me in line. Believe me, I had one foot on the wrong side of the tracks and could have easily wound up just another statistic growing up in the dirty south. My point is just that there is only so much a parent can do. My parents ensured I got great grades, but my middle school sucked so bad that despite all of their involvement, I was still behind when I went to a top performing high school.

    I didn’t get to take “pre-algebra” or other more advanced classes in middle school while the kids at the better schools would have taken that in say 7th grade. I never had to do real homework whereas the kids at the better schools were used to staying up late studying. I just did well on sheer talent, but it wasn’t enough when you get in a situation where everyone else is just as smart.

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  77. “It is entirely possible the main problem is I am a misanthrope.”

    I don’t see how that presents a problem.

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  78. “I never had to do real homework whereas the kids at the better schools were used to staying up late studying. I just did well on sheer talent, but it wasn’t enough when you get in a situation where everyone else is just as smart.”

    i hear ya, same hear with the homework was way to easy to BS my way through it.
    but when i got out of JuCo and went to real college thats when i had to play catch up and struggled bad at first. and it was a state school :). I was no dumb dumb either, even when i was slacking and f’ing around i still tested top 5 of my class. in college it was also my parents who pushed well and also the fact it was my OWN cash that i hard worked for paying my tuition.

    the craziest thing is it took a tutor in college to recognize i had a slight learning disability (most here on CC after reading my post will see that) so why couldnt a teacher in CPS catch it?

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  79. Matt as a fellow Illini I promise to leave you alone from now on 8)

    But for the most part, realtors (such as Joe Z) are nothing but creepy middlemen pushing product.

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  80. Bumping my question above. Does anyone know anything about 1928 N Hoyne? Is it short sale? Bank owned? It’s listing for 30% off its bubbly 2007 price. Any insights appreciated.

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  81. “1928 N Hoyne”

    It was $302k from the builder in 1994. There’s no LP filed on the property. Current owners used a single, $840k mortgage for acquisition. Other specualation I’ll avoid posting.

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  82. Thanks, as always, anon (tfo). On redfin I see the items below under property info. I guess I’ll call the listing agent at some point, but am confused as to how they relate.

    Exceptions (Call List Office)
    Exclusions (Call List Office)
    Court Ordered/Bank Sale

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  83. Groove77,

    Debating JOE Z isn’t worth anyone’s time.

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  84. I am not trying to debate anyone just defending our online community.

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  85. Look Grove77 I heard or read somewhere never to waste your time arguing (or defending yourself) with an idiot, because to a bystander, you look like 2 idiots arguing. I won’t stoop to the level of Joe.

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  86. HD,

    Question, off topic here, on your droid have you found any good RE apps i am unable to find good ones. block shopper sux.

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  87. “Exceptions (Call List Office)
    Exclusions (Call List Office)
    Court Ordered/Bank Sale”

    Personal bankruptcy is a possibility.

    HD, BKs don’t typically get filed w/ the RD in Cook, do they?

    As to the exceptions/exclusions, that’s just about what personal property is on premises and contract terms, isn’t it?

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  88. Groove, no good RE apps yet! iPhone has a cool zillow app but I don’t think we get that yet.

    Anon(tfo) – no bk’s don’t get recorded with the recorder’s office.

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  89. “Commute is fine – it takes me 40 (very relaxing, seat on the el) minutes to downtown door-to-door.”

    nothing like a good 40 minutes of sitting on a urine soaked seat and getting josled violently every few seconds and add about 20 minutes of someone hitting you with their bag or stroller for a nice “relaxing” trip to my “low stress” job… Did I mention the waiting outside no less than 15 minutes in the wintertime? And certainly the stinky people traversing from car to car is “fine” for you as well?

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  90. cash flow positive:

    http://www.chicagomag.com/Radar/Deal-Estate/January-2010/-ldquoDude-Don-rsquot-Rent-rdquo/

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  91. “Groove, no good RE apps yet! iPhone has a cool zillow app but I don’t think we get that yet.”

    iPhone gotz zillow, redfin, truilla (sp), everyblock. my nexus one gets a crappy version of block shopper wooo whoooo :(

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  92. I’m going to call BS on this article in soooo many ways. First of all, it’s tough to get a mortgage if you don’t have a full time job which is exceedingly difficult for a 20 year old student to do. How did she qualify? Did someone co-sign for her?

    Secondly, 2 bedroom apartments in north center are not 1400 a month like the article claims. $1,000 maybe but not $1,400

    Third of all, why the hell would a college student want to own? as a student lived in probably close to a dozen apartments all over the city as student in 8 years. Why tie yourself down to the area around northeastern? Why carry such a liability? won’t it make it more difficult for her to borrow private student loans when she already has a mortgage?

    The only positive is that she can charge a roommate rent about $500 bucks probably to cover some of the mortgage, but she’s still stuck with the assessments and any special assessments.

    I bet she was sold on this because the tax breaks, right? She can write off teh taxes…oh wait she doesn’t pay federal taxes anyway because she doesn’t have enough income!!! What a joke of an article.

    “Dan on January 22nd, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    cash flow positive:

    http://www.chicagomag.com/Radar/Deal-Estate/January-2010/-ldquoDude-Don-rsquot-Rent-rdquo/

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  93. Thanks anon (tfo), HD. Have a good weekend, all.

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  94. “Secondly, 2 bedroom apartments in north center are not 1400 a month like the article claims. $1,000 maybe but not $1,400″

    I’m sure it’s just a brainfreeze, but in North Center, that’s not too far off, but she didn’t buy anywhere close to North Center.

    “The only positive is that she can charge a roommate rent about $500 bucks probably to cover some of the mortgage, but she’s still stuck with the assessments and any special assessments.”

    You didn’t read very carefully–I skimmed and caught that her PITI+A is sub-$750, so $500/month pays 2/3 of nut.

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  95. South of Foster and west of the river makes it Albany Park, right? The unit in question appears to be the below grade unit closed 12/30/09 at 5140 N. Albany #G. It was listed as a 4RM/1BR apt, listed as 1,000 sf with room sizes of LR=15×13, Kitch=12×9, BR=13×11 and Other=10×7. Previous listings prior to the prior sale indicate it was 1400 sf with DR=10×12 and 2nd BR=12×10, but that doesn’t seem possible since the 3 upper floor units are listed as 1400 sf.

    If the current listing is correct, there is no way that it rents for $1400/month. I don’t know if it even rents for $750/month.

    “The foreclosed owner had paid $219,500 for the condo in 2006″
    No, that was the previous buyer’s lender that paid that money. He put nothing down.

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  96. aww G. why you gotta rain on the cute girl’s parade. she’s gonna save so much money by the time she’s 25 she’s like, ecstatic. I like her regardless of the factual errors.

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  97. “rain on the cute girl’s parade”

    I promise not to make it a deluge considering the below grade nature of the accommodations.

    3BR at 5144 N Troy currently asking $1200 no parking.
    5140 N Albany 1st floor 2BR + den 1400 sf cancelled after asking $1400 with parking this past summer.
    5140 N Albany 2nd floor 2BR + den 1400 sf expired after asking $1300 with parking this past summer.
    Current asks and recent rental of 1BR’s at 3121-23 W Foster and 5130 N Albany indicate $699-799 rents.

    Article also says she isn’t transfering until fall. If she was still with Mom & Dad, that’s a solid 7 months of carrying costs that are likely to be forgotten in the ecstasy.

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  98. anon(tfo) I read the article carefully I just mistakenly typed north center not north park, my bad.

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  99. “I promise not to make it a deluge considering the below grade nature of the accommodations.”

    Looks to be only ~2′ below grade, at least. Not that that is much consolation when one is .5 block from the river and the channel. Didn’t the whole football field (across the street) flood in Sep 08?

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  100. “anon(tfo) I read the article carefully I just mistakenly typed north center not north park, my bad.”

    *That* wasn’t why I thought you didn’t read the whole thing (it was obv. brain to fingers issue), it was the “$500 … to cover some of the mortgage” when the mortgage is under $350/mo.

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  101. sorry, my common parlance is to say that the ‘mortgage’ includes PITI+A because it’s all a monthly housing expense. I meant if she can get $500 buck (Which is not likely) that’ll cover 2/3rd of the nut.

    North center apartments are like $1,400 for a decent two bedroom IIRC but I haven’t lived there in a few years

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  102. “Didn’t the whole football field (across the street) flood in Sep 08?”

    Much more than that, I seem to recall.

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  103. “Much more than that, I seem to recall.”

    Sticking with avoiding the deluge.

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  104. Census Tract 140800 is Tier 3
    Median Family Income: $54,636.06
    Single-parent households: 22.97%
    Owner-occupied homes: 37.32%
    Speaks language other than English: 57.07%
    Educational attainment percentile: 73.85%

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