The Best Selling New Construction Development in the Nation? 1800 W. Grace
Normally, I leave the new construction chatter to YoChicago, which has the people and resources to cover all of the new construction buildings going up around the city.
However, I’ve been getting a lot of e-mails about The Lofts at 1800, the new loft development at 1800 W. Grace in Lakeview.
This is a conversion of cap and gown manufacturer E.R. Moore’s building. It’s a rare authentic loft conversion in Lakeview.
Apparently, The Lofts at 1800 is one of the best selling developments in the the nation.
From the developer’s website:
“The Lofts at 1800 is proud to announce that they have had among the most buyers in any new construction development in the nation. With a VIP Week that resulted in 51 groups of interested buyers and 6 reservations, The Lofts at 1800 is leading the current nationwide real estate market in sales.”
Prices range from the following:
- 1 bedrooms from $254,500
- 2 bedrooms from $364,500
- 3 bedrooms from $759,900
A model is available to tour by appointment only.
Is the lure of the “new” authentic loft strong enough to sustain sales in this building?
See pictures of the units and more information on the website [The Lofts at 1800]
“With a VIP Week that resulted in 51 groups of interested buyers and 6 reservations”
Am I reading right that they have 6 contracts? 6 is “leading the nation”? If I’m not reading it right, WTF are they trying to say?
Other than being b/t the el and Metra, seems like a nice project.
I like the finishes, but it still seems expensive for roscoe/ far west LV. And 12% contracted/reserved???? is leading the nation? Yeowch, there must be ghost towns everywhere…
I looked at this development maybe a year, year and a half ago – before they had a model unit. They played the typical game of this unit and that unit are reserved, but we have this unit (a less desirable unit) available for you. I drove by the project recently and it doesn’t look like a ton of progress has been made since my visit. I have to imagine they are having a hell of time getting their construction financing in line.
I love this location and the building project is pretty cool (there are both timber and concrete lofts). Supposedly a green space would be on the el side of the building. Some of the units had smaller terraces, so outdoor space for a loft was a nice touch. But the units were small and expensive. I think all in for a small 2 bedroom, 2 bath, bottom line finishes with parking without a downtown view (either west facing or north facing) was north of $475,000. Given the times, you go right around the corner and get a much better deal over at the lofts on Irving Park or Larchmont.
And god knows when you could actually move into your place.
That is definitely false advertising especially considering that no one will get conforming financing unless the project is 70% under contract… nice looking finishes though.
Here is some information from a listing for unit 522. They claim 1450 sqf, but based on the information below, I’m not sure how they get there.
Rooms
Bedroom 1 — 13×12 Main Level
Bedroom 2 — 12×10 Main Level
Dining Room — COMBO
Kitchen — 14×8 Main Level
Living Room — 23×14 Main Level
Terrace — 5×23 Main Level
Listing price of $510,000, parking is an additional $32,500, assesments of $383, and I am sure taxes will be high.
Who is paying $550,000 for a smallish 2 bedroom, 2 bed loft in this market? There was a pretty incredible 3 level loft recently at the loft building on Irving Park and Ravenswood for $550,000 that was well north of 2000 sqf. There are countless other examples.
Also, if you look at the various listings, they have sold a number of the 3 bedrooms for well north of $600k. I just don’t buy it, but I can’t imagine the lender would allow the developer to play its typical presale games in this market.
I’d love to see this development go the route of the Vetro – then I would consider it.
“They claim 1450 sqf, but based on the information below, I’m not sure how they get there.”
Looking at the floorplan (it’s 12 of 20 in the concrete lofts section), 1451 interior sqft (as the floorplan states) seems a little … optimistic. Unless their floorplan is mega-unreliable. Based on the 23’2″ dimension, it comes to about 1300 plus the portion of the foyer/laundry room “above” the “top” wall on the floorplan. Without dedcuting anything for columns or intereior walls.
Oh lord… it’s on the freaking train tracks… and “leading the nation” is meaningless rt now… and scary that 6 sales in 1 building is “leading the nation” … how is that calculated anyway? on percentage basis? Is all the data really that accurate about new construction nationwide to really know this statement is even true?
Third, and most importantly, would you *really* buy a conversion that had the bulk of its work done during the real estate bubble burst? If the developer overpaid and wants to get out, it’s going to be ugly. Even with a developer’s warantee, who wants the headaches?
Or, perhaps the developer got it as things started to decline… i’d be curious to look into it. Either way, train tracks = no deal. And the outside needs to be cleaned or sand blasted or something… if it hasn’t been already. The way it looks on google earth is gross.
It looks like they put in all new windows with metal frames though so kudos on that… well, I suppose that’s helping them sell the imagination that the train won’t be so loud…
Maybe they included the balcony and parking space in the sqft measurements 8)
I know, that joke never gets old…
I have not viewed the floor plan but usually SF is measured from the exterior of the perimeter walls and the center of the demising walls by BOMA standards which is what most people go by. Also columns and interior walls are not subtracted.
“I have not viewed the floor plan but usually SF is measured from the exterior of the perimeter walls and the center of the demising walls by BOMA standards which is what most people go by. Also columns and interior walls are not subtracted.”
Beauty. So it’s a construct, not a reality, and it’s applying commercial standards to consumer transactions. So it’s *always* going to overstate the actual usable/livable/whatever-you-want-to-call-it space.
They don’t measure the rooms that way, do they?
I live about 500 feet from this property and they’ve been fooling around with it for over 2 years. They work on it at night a lot (I’m guessing they don’t have some permits) and work has been very slow over the past 2 years. At one point it stopped for a long time, my guess is someone went bankrupt or ran out of money temporarily (and this was over a year ago when you would have thought financing was easier to get than today).
One of the biggest problems in my opinion is the exact location of this building. On the west side you have the brown line about 10-20 feet from the building and on the east side you have the metra train tracks (there is a small side street of Ravenswood right there – which by the way car thieves love this street. You can’t walk down here w/o stepping on freshly broken window glass).
As for the high prices, those were set in 06 and I don’t think they’ve dropped them once. My feeling is the developer can’t take the hit needed to sell these units and is hoping for a miracle of people to fall in love and overpay.
I personally love the area though, trader joe’s is literally across the street and Lincoln has some nice things on it & the renovated Brown line stop is right on Addison. Close to Wrigley, but not so close that drunks are peeing on your building (like my old place off Clark).
Chiming in here just to say “thanks for the link, Sabrina.”
And to suggest folks search Kopley on our site and read the first couple posts, and especially the comments from Kopley buyers. I said, in a comment on this development:
“There’s something about the amount of hype emanating from this group that should, in my opinion, raise a flag for every potential buyer.”
“I have not viewed the floor plan but usually SF is measured from the exterior of the perimeter walls and the center of the demising walls by BOMA standards which is what most people go by. Also columns and interior walls are not subtracted.”
As a rough rule, BOMA takes it from the I/S of the finished wall on the exterior, windows get handled differently.
Wow – good info Nate… sounds like the developer purchased it at the peak & there were problems indeed. I never would’ve thought about the car thefts…geez.
Is reservation the same as a contract? Or is this just developerspeak for precontract?
What year is this? I think I bought one of these units in the early 1990’s. Nothing interesting to see here folks, same layouts and finishes we have seen since forever. The decorator has dressed them up with lots of dark paint, that’s it.
Does anyone really want their kitchen strapped to the wall in the middle of the room like that? It looks so incredibly cheap and temporary.
Is the tv *in* the fire place? that’s a first. (I know it’s not a fireplace but it sure looks like it should be)
I toured the building last weekend, and although the lofts fit neither my lifstyle or budget, I thought they were really well done. The finishes are not early ’90s, they are much more contemporary than most of the South Loop crap we’ve been looking at on this site recently.
Also, to make the terraces, the developer is setting a wall of windows 5 feet in from the existing exterior wall and then removing the old windows.
“Leading the nation” is like saying “best tacos in town.” Subjective and unprovable.
BTW, Nate, I think your analysis is right on the money on this place. I shop at that TJ’s and have been noticing the lack of progress on that building.
Did Francis Bacon design the interior? Looks dark and messy.
I, too, have noticed the work going on at night (even when it was snowing).
Also, this is right down the street from the North Center Cottage from previous posts (North Center Cottage Returns to the Market: 1750 W. Grace).
I love that other contemporary building across from Trader Joe’s on the Lincoln side. There’s a unit for sale in there — I’d grab that place up! It’s very modern looking, with loft “like” high ceilings but not right ON the train tracks. Don’t know what they’re asking though, but can’t beat the neighborhood..
Terry – I believe I know the unit you’re talking about and the problem with that is you’re on Lincoln. Not a horrendously busy street, but busy enough where the pollution and noise made me lose interest before looking any further. Additionally, there is a fire station (few trucks and a few ambulances) that is pretty active at Grace/Damen and they may (I don’t know) cut throw on Grace and take Lincoln – if that’s a standard route you don’t want to be around it.
Why is 1800 W. Grace considered Lakeview, but 1750 W. Grace is Northcenter?
I agree with Dailiachi in the units are very nice and well appointed. I got the feeling of a “real NY loft” (whatever that means but it was a common phrase at the open house) in both layout and the finishes.
Are the majority of you judging this building merely on it’s floorplans, picturs and the incredulous ad? Or have you actually visited the place? BIG difference in the two.
As much as I do not like condos or any type of attached living for myself, I am really considering looking into this further. A few of the duplexes are real ‘cool’ and to me represent the definition of “urban living”…..I know cliche, but there is a lot more character than say….Vetro or other such disasters.
I don’t care to chime in with too much negativity, but I think the ad represents the work of a good PR firm, much like the new construction projects in Manhattan/Brooklyn…it’s all about marketing and the feeling of exclusivity folks!
Regarding the L noise, I live three blocks from the Blue line in a building that features ‘virtual soundproof’ windows and I can hear the trains 24/7. I think most Chicago residents are in the same boat with the noise, you just learn to tune it out.
“Why is 1800 W. Grace considered Lakeview, but 1750 W. Grace is Northcenter?”
They are both wrong. The line is at Ravenswood. 1800 W Grace is technically North Center and 1750 w Grace is technically Lakeview.
Properties frequently are intentionally misidentified for marketing purposes and also frequently b/c whoever is drafting the copy is ignorant.
“there is a fire station (few trucks and a few ambulances) that is pretty active at Grace/Damen and they may (I don’t know) cut throw on Grace and take Lincoln”
Almost never b/c making a u-turn out of the station is slower than alternatives and Grace is pretty narrow b/t Damen and Lincoln.
I live a 1/2 block from the Grace/Damen firehouse. For starters, it’s very rare for the fire trucks to take Grace west, which has east/west traffic west of Damen. I’ve never, ever seen them take Grace east…it’s way too narrow of a one-way street east of Damen. I’d be more concerned about the nearby trains than the firehouse.
They’re probably marketing this as Lakeview to lure in the crowd searching Lakeview and Lincoln Park…it is North Center, as anon pointed out.
My wife and I ‘looked’ at this place about a year ago. It wasn’t clear if they had a model at that time or not…the sales guy working the office in front told us that we had to schedule an appt to see a unit. Sorry, if you’re holding an open house, I expect to be able to see something then and there, not just your plans. I agree with some of the previous posters that I absolutely love the neighborhood, but the unit pricing is out of line for a building with small rooms sitting right next to the train.
And yes, I can comment first hand that they seem to work late at night a lot…don’t know what the reason is, but every time I drive down the street there’s something going on there at late hours.
Ah, thanks for clearing that up about the fire station. I just wasn’t sure if they would take Grace to Lincoln as a common route, but the narrowness and impossible u-turn make sense. That however is more in regards to a unit on Lincoln that Terry was talking about (not this one).
I’ve heard this area referred to as Roscoe Village, North Center, Wrigleyville (and west wrigleyville), and Lakeview. It’s kind of in a no man’s land area actually, a far west wrigleyville or lakeview and a far south north center. I don’t know, everyone seems to draw these fake lines wherever they please for marketing, but anon kind of hit the real answer I’d say.
The area is nice, but there is an abnormal amount of crime in the area. During the day it’s all baby carriages and dog walkers and at a night the criminals come out. Car and condo break-ins happen frequently. In the past year I’ve seen two cars put up on bricks (well one bricks the other coke cartons), our company van was broken into, my neighbor was broken into, someone attempted to break into my unit (different day) by prying the door open, and like I mentioned above, you can’t walk down Ravenswood w/o stepping on fresh glass.
The cops are constantly driving around, but so far it seems they haven’t caught them although summer is just here so we’ll see how bad it’s going to get.
As for this building – yes I’ve tried to look at it about 3 times, each time there has been a OPEN come in sign outside… and the door is locked… They may have a model unit, but nothing else – sometimes I see only one guy working there – very odd. I actually think it might just be one guy working all the time on it, but then has to bring in help occasionally to get certain things done.
alookatcook.com
pick an intersection/area and just work backwards
I saw these condos recently and was somewhat impressed, but I would like some advice if anyone can give it. If the asking prices are too high for these units, especially because of the el / metra noise, what would be a good offer on one of these units? I think they start at about $285,000 with parking, so what would you offer?
I have read a lot about crime, negative location because of the tracks on either side–is this really a bad buy then? Please advise.
I toured the building in early August. It is a nice property with nice finishes and offers some things nothing else (that I know of anyway) does in Northcenter. A building with a doorman and what appears is going to be a pretty nice gym (for a condo building). There are some really cool floorplans in the building (the duplexed, 2.5 bed/2bath come to mind), but overall I think they are way overpriced for the area. I can’t see coming close to getting back $650,000 for a 2.5 bed/2bath duplex with one parking space anytime soon. The rest of the units, for the most part, are typical layouts with very contemporary finishes. You will get train noise (though not a huge issue for me as I am used to it, I understand a lot of people don’t like it) and you are close to Trader Joes, the Brown Line and other bars and restaurants. Bottom line for me? Right now there are 3 bedroom lofts and 3 bedroom condos on quieter streets and at cheaper prices within a mile of this location with similar comps (or in the case of the loft, the three bedroom is over $150k cheaper than the cheapest 2.5 bed/2bath unit at 1800 Grace. I could redo that entire place to my exact liking and have a larger space in a true loft building for less money). I think there are better options, especially since this is not even a green building, which might justify the higher prices in this market.