The New Construction Mansion in Lincoln Square: 2152 W. Giddings
Multi-million dollar homes are waiting for buyers all over the north side including this 7 bedroom home at 2152 W. Giddings in Lincoln Square.
Just a few blocks from the heart of Lincoln Square, the listing says it was built in 2010.
It has been listed on and off the market since March 2009, however.
It has the custom details you would expect in a house at this price point including custom built cabinetry and millwork.
The house is built on an oversized Chicago lot of 37.5×124. That space allows for a 3-car garage.
4 of the bedrooms are on the second level and 3 are in the lower level.
Is the $1.7 million house the new norm in Lincoln Square?
Marta Kazmierczak at Prudential Rubloff has the listing. See the pictures here.
2152 W. Giddings: 7 bedrooms, 4 baths, 2 half baths, 3 car garage, 5100 square feet
- Sold in June 2005 for $600,000 (prior house)
- Originally listed in March 2009 for $1.65 million
- Currently listed for $1.795 million
- Taxes are “new”
Really pretty place, and amazing photos. Props to the photographer. First to say boo on no floorplan for this place.
I take it the school district is ok?
Looks beautiful – great family house. Unfortunately, in my experience most families with this kind of money/budget usually choose to live in the suburbs. However, all you need is one!!!!
I wish tacky McMansions like this would stay in the suburbs where they belong and leave us city folks alone.
Stunning home.
The otherwise nice yard feels a bit dominated by the house to the east, which just sold for about $1.4MM (did it really not have a garage?). I don’t think the local elem is much good here.
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/2148-W-Giddings-St-60625/home/12584463
“I wish tacky McMansions like this would stay in the suburbs where they belong and leave us city folks alone.”
I’m not sure how this home is tacky? Can you explain. I really like it. But I have no idea what made this place increase in price from when it was first listed in march 2009.
“I wish tacky McMansions like this would stay in the suburbs where they belong and leave us city folks alone.”
agree- i would take the cinder block 4 flats anyday to this ugly building (being sarcastic)
How on earth have we been dumbed down to think that options are either sterile oversized McMansions or the cinder block crackerboxes?
sad, really.
I’m not sure how this home is tacky? Can you explain. I really like it. But I have no idea what made this place increase in price from when it was first listed in march 2009.
The price increase was likely changed during the build out process. Since there was no buyer at that point they had to choose to either finish it to slightly above grade finishes or to add all the bells whistles and extras in hopes of wowing someone to pick this home over a less elegant new home in this area. $1.7 seems like quite a stretch for that location although I wish them well with this beautiful property.
nice mudroom, you don’t see those so often in the city.
“I take it the school district is ok?”
McPherson? 1719 out of 2205 elementary schools in the state. Good grief.
I wonder if it has James Hardy fiber cement siding on it? My guess is yes — if so that is great. In my view, better than a brick facade.
http://www.cookcountyassessor.com/data/searchflat/ParcelImage.asp?pin=14181030170000
Yes, there used to be an ug house here before but did they really need to tear it down and replace it with a $1.75 million mansion? I guess that’s better than the alternative which would be a cinderblock three-flat.
JMM,
I realize that ‘stats’ are quick and easy to look up, but sometimes you have to dig beneath the surface.
My son attended McPherson for the last three years. McPherson has more than a few amazing teachers and a beautiful building with a lunchroom, gym, auditorium and music room.
I was really impressed with his teachers-and I volunteered in his classrooms-so I really could see what was going on. My son learned a lot in Kindergarten and pre-k there.
What the school lacks most at this point is support from educated neighborhood parents…..
wonderful home, a few things though
1. do you really want to pay 1.7mil to live in lincoln square
2. do you want your 1.7mil home to come with vinyl sidding? (I dont know for sure but the siding looks vinyl from the picture of the back “BBQ/picnic area” the siding looks warped/wavy and it was “built” in 2010)
3. do you want to pay 15-20k in taxes to live in Lincoln square?
4. its a beautiful home with nice details most new places dont have but your asking someone to pay 1.7mil and 20k in taxes to live in Lincoln Square?
dahliachi —
With all due respect, there is not a parent of an elementary school student on the north side of Chicago who won’t defend the particular school and the quality of the teachers however mediocre it ranks. People will say “oh it is an up and comer” or “it has a great kindergarten class — just wait in 8 years it will be great”… What is true is that ranking in the bottom 25% of schools in the state is fairly inexcuseable no matter what.
Even if what you say is true (which I believe), the simple fact is that involved parents who care about education *actively pick* the best ranked school districts like Bell, Blaine or Burley. Not saying that is right, but it is a pretty well established phenomenon. Therefore, it is a self fulfilling prophecy because often the quality of your education has to do with the parental involvement and the quality of the students.
All that being said, for the same price house and assuming you believe in public education, you could have top percentile involved parents, teachers and students in one of the top 100 elementary schools in the state. Or you could buy this house and not have all that.
It is a comment on home values, not public education generally.
Groove:
Could be vinyl, which would be disappointing. Cement fiber would be better. Vinyl gets wavy which is not really an issue, it just needs to be tacked in in certain spots.
I can guarantee you that a builder like Mangan or Environs would do masonry facade or cement fiberboard.
1. $1.7 – no thank you.
2. The only vinyl that I would purchase can be played on a turntable
3. I do not want to pay $15-20k in property taxes anywhere!
4. Amen!
Groove77 once again you have nailed this homes main issues.
BTW in previous threads you have eluded to where you reside but I have never read the exact location. Have you posted this and I just missed it? I’m guessing Portage Park or somewhere on the northwest side of the city likely west of Cicero Avenue. Am I close?
“I can guarantee you that a builder like Mangan or Environs would do masonry facade or cement fiberboard.”
Who are good builders in the next tier down below Mangan?
“do you really want to pay 1.7mil to live in lincoln square”
I’m always surprised at how expensive Lincoln Sq seems to be. This is not a general complaint about pricing, more of a comparison to other north side and bucktown/wicker areas. I guess people (including my wife) love it. Commute is bad for me, getting to in-laws bad for my wife, and getting to O’Hare is not great.
Yea, that ugly siding really kills the backyard vibe for me. Big house, fancy finishes, but count me in as hell no. I like Lincoln Square, but not for 1.7 million. Too many options out there for that kinda money in nicer hoods.
Taxes vary according to assessed value, which is what it is at a given price point.
The Cook County Assessor simplified things with a 10% AV / MV calculation. So assuming MV = purchase price (as these should generally converge), taxes in Chicago in non-special areas for given price points should be roughly:
750k = $9,800
$1M = $13,400
$1.25M = $17,000
$1.5M = $20,500
I took out 20k EAV for HE and used the 2008 levy.
Point is, if you buy a $1.5M house, you should be prepared for 20k property taxes. Goes with the territory, unfortunately.
JMM,
Never worked with cement fiber, so cant say if it would have the same effect. But even new vinyl “tacked” correctly will have this wavy effect when its on the sunny side of the house in direct sun (no trees to shade it.) the extra expanding and contracting from the dewy mornings to the beating of the sun drying it quickly.
Jp3,
your assumption is close, and yes i have posted my location many times before you just missed it because you were probably tired from reading a westloop post (gosh they are so long). but google map Riis Park and i am over there.
I, for one, would not pay that price for basement bedrooms. I also would expect more generous sized rooms in a 4-square. I would have taken the bedrooms up on 2 floors/ fewer in number and better-sized and left below-ground for kid/storage, etc activity and the main floor a “little more urban gracious”. The finishes are quite appropriate for the style and pricing and the lot fits the home. Any neighborhood has its fans and detractors.
JMM: I agree with respect to the self fulfilling prophecy in the attendance areas of Bell, Blaine or Burley. I only wish that I found those areas as appealing as others (i.e., too bad they’re not closer to the park/lake).
Any good sources for school rankings, etc.?
What’s the word on Lincoln Elem or Alcott?
BTW,
hope you guys dont think i am bashing lincoln square, i love what it has become over the last 7 years. its a great area now. just saying 1.7 mil to live there you will need a very specific buyer that wants/has to be there.
its the taxes to that will “grind my gears”, 20k in lincoln square your realy dont get your moneys worth for those taxes do you?
Love this place… wish I could afford something like this… I’d live there for the rest of my life!
Groove:
My point is taxes would be the same in Kenwood at the same price point — or the Castle on the Kennedy for that matter. They are based mostly on assessed value, but then also the service districts for the various agencies. You pay more if you have special services or mosquito abatement, but these are minor difference.
but google map Riis Park and i am over there
I was born there and lived in the apartment on Mason and fullerton for 3 years. Being the pain in the ass son from the start my mom had to be pulled on a sled to the hospital right in the middle of the blizzard of January 1967.
Lot’s of photo’s of my sister and me in Riis park during the late 1960’s.
Great place!
anonny —
Lincoln Elementary is one of the best in the state, and perhaps the best in the city, insofar as rankings go. East Lincoln Park has lots of very wealthy parents that could easily afford private, but specifically choose public.
The obvious knock on Lincoln is that it is damn expensive for a SFH there. $1.5M minimum buy in it seems. I think it is overpriced, but that is just my own personal view.
I think the bigger issue with Lincoln Square is that it will never have the old money appeal & infrastructure of LP, Old Town, etc.
You aren’t a stone’s throw from the beaches, the zoo, etc.
For people like me, the gridlock that goes with those things isn’t worth it, but I sense that people with loads of cash don’t have to necessarily punch a clock and rush hour isn’t their greatest concern.
Annony,
Sun times does a yearly ranking of the state and city too. its my go to source as of late (got lazy on the subject).
and as always i will point to most NW side schools that beat out the Bell, blaine, burly, lincoln elm, as those schools use IB or “test in” advanced program to play funny with the numbers.
oriole park elem has all neighborhood kids not special test in program and has 40 kids per class and it tops most of the IB/Test in schools.
also average home price there is 300k i think.
“My point is taxes would be the same in Kenwood at the same price point”
JMM true your taxes in austin would be the same at this price point. (but then your taxes will go to extra patrol cars) in a perfect world each hood would receive the same services throughout chicago, but we all know the is a disproportion for different areas. i would hate my 20k+ Lincoln square taxes to be funding something else than my immediate area.
which is way a burb such as Kenilworth or Riverforest the bulk of their taxes is for improving their immediate area.
Oh no… builders prefab fireplaces. Always a sign, always, that costs were cut. Not that they’re unsafe or anything, but when you get into that price range, you should expect a new custom home to have masonry fireplaces. Makes you think where else they cut, visible or not.
Places like this are real crowd pleasers, but in reality they’re a facsimile of the real thing that fades the more they’re reproduced. Kinda like Banana Republic – nice enough, but always a copy of another’s design.
KW and RF are sub scale as towns go, so you pay more to support the same basic fixed costs of governance. A dedicated police force for a town of 2k or 10k is going to be very expensive.
Looks like hardy board to me–no visible seams.
Don’t like that it backs up to Lawrence–never preferable to share an alley with a major street.
“KW and RF are sub scale as towns go, so you pay more to support the same basic fixed costs of governance.”
thats why i picked them as they go to the random point i was going for….the bulk of a tax bill in a house there funds the services and amenities for said house’s immediate area. as this lincoln square house taxes will fund a police station in englewood (which BTW uses 10x more funds than the police station in LS where the owner would live)
side note doesnt kenilworth subcontract its Fire department form winnetka?
The price went *up* from 2009 to now? Is that a typo?
For this money you can get roughly the same house two blocks from the lake in Highland Park.
I can’t imagine this place ever selling.
“roughly the same house two blocks from the lake in Highland Park”
Please show me the new construction house in HP two blocks from the lake?
Groove:
Pros and cons to scale. Chicago has a swat team, hazmat team, helicopters, and very good experienced cops and detectives.
There have been two murders in KW since it was platted. One was never solved, despite the prominence of the family. One could argue their police force was incapable of solving that kind of crime. The other was a domestic where the perp was obvious and waited at home until the police came and took him in.
Yes, KW subcontracts fire. Been that way since the 1920s.
JMM, are you kidding?
It would take me all day to list every home for sale under 1.8 on the NS two or three blocks from the lake.
Start here:
http://www.redfin.com/search#lat=42.196938&long=-87.839287&max_price=2000000&search_location=60035&v=5&zoomLevel=15
You ever going to get around to telling me where all the smart, cool kids went to school?
Sorry I was waiting on 2009 new construction and 7 bedrooms please?
BTW, Highland Park real estate is on its ass, along with most of the rest of the North Shore. I’d be the first to say the city is overpriced relative to the suburbs. But, please show me the brand new construction 7 bedroom house in Winnetka (HP is fine but it has more desparate sellers) 2 blocks from the lake for the same price?
7 beds are superfluous and unnecessary. I’d rather have a present wrapping room than a 7th bedroom.
“But, please show me the brand new construction 7 bedroom house”
Most houses in the burbs dont piss away their space with 7 tiny bedrooms. It’s more like 5, and then extra rooms for library, exercise room, etc… Effectively you’ll get more space out there.
“It would take me all day to list every home for sale under 1.8 on the NS two or three blocks from the lake.”
He did say “new construction”.
335 Oakland in HP probably qualifies at $1.495–not built yet, maybe slightly over 2 block.
250 Park in Glencoe may be new enough.
624 Willow in Winnetka isn’t an ideal location, and it more than 3 blocks, but it’s not finished and under $1.5mm.
And there’s stuff in Ft Sheridan, too.
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Wilmette/246-Linden-Ave-60091/home/13772223
246 LINDEN Ave, WILMETTE, IL 60091
2006, that’s plenty new. 5 beds, but library would be easy to convert and tons of space in basement. Also all the bedrooms are bigger than this LS property.
All these towns are already established, so there’s not gonna be much new construction when everything is built already. Personally I’ll take location over new construction any day.
“I’d rather have a present wrapping room than a 7th bedroom.”
I’d rather have a present receiving room than a 7th bedroom.
🙂
JMM, for a super cool, super smart guy you had an awful lot of trouble with reading a simple sentence. Go back to my post where I said “roughly” the same house. Not even in “slang” (cool people talk) does “roughly” equate to “exactly”.
After you do that look at this place:
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Highland-Park/1024-Sheridan-Rd-60035/home/17624011
Darn.
Why doesn’t anyone like the western suburbs? I personally think the Hinsdale/ Oak Brook area is extremely nice. The schools are top notch. Great shopping/dining but more importantly, there is easy easy access to chicago. Without traffic, you could be downtown in 15-28 minutes. I have never taken the train – but I heard it was really convenient and takes less than 30 minutes.
Hinsdale is SW burbs IMO
Glen Ellyn, Wheaton, Naperville and Oak Brook are the gems of the western burbs… but its the burbs, you are going to get a very city centric view here. Did I mention the burbs suck?
This house has some nice finishes. However, it is out of synch with the neighborhood, and I think you can find a much more interesting house for the price in the suburbs. With seven bedrooms I’d want (i) great schools for all those kids, and (ii) a larger lot for all those kids. I also think it is a shame that the largest of the seven bedrooms is 15 X 15.
If I am paying one point something million and need a huge house, I want the architecture to be special and memorable. As special and memorable as this:
http://www.jetsetmodern.com/modernproperty/listing1834.htm
Therefore, suburbs. But that is just me.
“Why doesn’t anyone like the western suburbs? I personally think the Hinsdale/ Oak Brook area is extremely nice. The schools are top notch. Great shopping/dining but more importantly, there is easy easy access to chicago. Without traffic, you could be downtown in 15-28 minutes.”
I have family out that way and have considered it. Access to Chicago is fine, but it’s not obviously better than many parts of the north shore. Traffic is the big issue, as it is for almost everything around here. Stevenson really sucks sometimes and I swear the potholes are worse than any of the other expressways. The train commute is fine. There are nice houses that are walking distance to the train (at least for Hinsdale/WS/LG).
Hey ALT,
Is that Jackie Treehorn’s house?
“Is that Jackie Treehorn’s house?”
hahahaha
It Totally is
IMO, Hinsdale is charming, with a cute downtown area, good services and its own metra stop. Oak Brook has mansions, Oak Brook Mall and thats about it. If I was looking for a fortress, I might consider Oak Brook, but I would wait a few years to buy anything anywhere.
“I personally think the Hinsdale/ Oak Brook area is extremely nice.”
“Why doesn’t anyone like the western suburbs?”
I don’t necessarily dislike them, I just really am not familiar with any reason why I’d ever go out that way.
What would entice a Chicago dweller to visit them, unless out of necessity (relatives, etc)?
Fermi Lab is pretty cool
1) Western suburbs are DuPage county and it’s a whole different world out there.
2) If you move to 10 acres in barrington none of your city friends will ever visit you.
and when you live on 10 acres, you get well water and a septic tank. no thank you.
agreed 100% on the water.
after Chicago tap, everything else – and I do mean everything – is a massive step down.
“Oak Brook has mansions, Oak Brook Mall and thats about it. If I was looking for a fortress, I might consider Oak Brook, but I would wait a few years to buy anything anywhere.”
I actually live in Oak Brook and it is a very pleasant area. After stressful days, it is kind of nice to relax in a quiet area. Most lots are large (.5-3 acres – city water/sewer) and houses are not THAT large (most are b/w 3000 and 7000 square feet with a few larger homes). The 3 greatest things about the area, however are:
1. no municipal real estate taxes (ie, no city real estate tax) – therefore it has the lowest tax rate in the state (if not the country). For example, real estate taxes on a million dollar house are in the 8-10k range.
2. Easy access to all major roads (294, 290, I55, I 88 all interesect in Oak Brook). You can get downtown in less than 30 minutes.
3. Absolute top rated schools (Butler, Hinsdale Central).
Overall, a GREAT place to live.
No kidding!?! Is that why you pump it up every couple weeks? Are you trying to sell?
Personally, to me Oak Brook feels sterile and lacks character. And no high school means Oak Brook kids go to four different neighboring high schools, not all of which are top rated.
“I actually live in Oak Brook and it is a very pleasant area”
“Is that why you pump it up every couple weeks?”
Oak Brook needs no “pumping up” – it was one of the few areas that was not that badly affected by the housing crisis.
In the city, if one can’t walk to either (i) work (if in the Loop) or (ii) the lakefront (or at least get to the park and begin making one’s way to the lake) within 5 minutes or so (i.e., no more than 3 or 4 blocks), then why not just move to the suburbs? There’s more space, a yard and (generally speaking) better schools, all for roughly the same property taxes, with very similar home-to-Loop commute times (and the Metra sure beats the bus or the El).
And if one does leave the city and can spend between $800k and $2 million, why not live on the North Shore (including Evanston)? If under $800k, then I can see living in burbs other than the North Shore (Oak Park? LaGrange?). If one has the funds and/or earning capacity to spend over $2 million, several cities/towns with close proximity to either the ocean or mountains (or both) come to mind (I realize that sounds a bit Oprahish, but hey).
I had to look up who Jackie Treehorn is. I take it there is a midcentury featured in the movie; I have never seen the movie but am curious now.
” the simple fact is that involved parents who care about education *actively pick* the best ranked school districts like Bell, Blaine or Burley.”
JMM- I agree with your point about the herd mentality of yuppie parents with regard to ‘top ranked’ public schools.
I don’t want to get into a long discussion about pedagogy or testing-so I’ll try to be brief.
What do you think testing is actually testing? I’d say it reflects parents educational attainment. So how can you say a school is ‘bad’ when it is educating ELL or kids from poorly educated families. If the stats were properly weighted I think we would see a different story.
Bell for example is able to throw its gifted students into the mix. These kids had to test into the gifted program just to attend so they are going to skew the numbers upward.
Some parents like Bell, others think it is overcrowded and rests on it’s laurels-I mean , how is a school with so many educated parents going to have poor test results?
Bottom line to parents thinking about sending your kids to public schools in Chicago: By all means look at the ratings and test scores. In addition consult websites like NPN ( worth the membership fee for all of the inside info) and greatschools. Talk to prospective neighbors.
Finally, please get off your duffs and actually visit schools in neighborhoods you are considering. You may be surprised by what you find…
I actually went to an open house at thishouse a few months ago-but I can’t really remember what it looks like because all of these city McMansions are start to look the same.
I only saw pics of the house next door online, but it looks to be much more distinctive.
“In the city, if one can’t walk to either (i) work (if in the Loop) or (ii) the lakefront (or at least get to the park and begin making one’s way to the lake) within 5 minutes or so (i.e., no more than 3 or 4 blocks), then why not just move to the suburbs?”
Live music venues, restaurants (especially real ethnic food from every country imaginable), museums, movie theaters, gyms, bowling alleys, clubs, shopping, etc.
And a real public trans system & the grid makes everything accessible.
The suburbs are BORING.
Even Evanston bores me to tears, and that’s pretty urban. Where I live I get the full urban palette of options, plus the Chicago River very close, and the lakefront is a 20 minute bike or bus ride.
But the real joy is in how spontaneous one can be on any given evening or weekend – I don’t need to plan weeks in advance, I can do whatever I’m in the mood for easily & immediately, with maybe 5 minutes of surfing the web.
I feel totally trapped in the burbs. You need a car for everything, it seems, and wherever you go – that’s it, no changing your mind at the last second or just “winging it” – barring perhaps the malls, which suck for different reasons. : )
I guess Zillow’s home value estimate of Oak Brook being down 12.6% y-0-y isn’t as bad as … other places. Nothing to worry about there in your little castle.
“Oak Brook needs no “pumping up” – it was one of the few areas that was not that badly affected by the housing crisis.”
“I was born there and lived in the apartment on Mason and fullerton for 3 years. Being the pain in the ass son from the start my mom had to be pulled on a sled to the hospital right in the middle of the blizzard of January 1967”
The park “as my parents say” is pretty much the same as it was back 60’s 70’s but with the added ice skating rink. the “hill” is still prime for sledding. but last year there were more ghetto sleds being used (you know people using a cardboard box for a sled) and to ride your bike down the hill is probably a bit different now as its not smooth and you will most likely end up head over handle bars.
oh, and almost forgot that I’m a 20 minute public trans ride from O’Hare, and living right off of 90/94 means I can get many places in the region faster than somebody out west can get into the City.
but IMO, I also live in a pretty street-smart location in Chicago. (patting self on back). especially as the region grows and gridlock continues to increase, it was of paramount importance to have maximum mobility without being exclusively reliant on one kind of transportation.
The almost identical house built by Landrosh Development (that have built many homes in this neighborhood) sold for $1.8M at 2161 W Sunnyside in 9/2009.
I’ll venture to say this could catch $1.6ish.
I’m not sure why people say there are “better hoods” for the money with comparable houses than this location. Clearly, it’s whatever is “better” to the buyer. This part of Lincoln Square has very low crime (property, personal) compared to sexy Lincoln Park, Near North, Lakeview etc… It also has a distinct feel with bucolic residential streets and the very inviting and amenity filled mini- downtown along Lincoln Avenue. Welles and Winnemac parks are better than what you find in most of Lakeview or LP (unless on the lake, which won’t happen in this house for $1.6M!).
A 37 wide house of this caliber may be double in list /sell price in most Lincoln Park locations (and more in “east” Lincoln Park… the real Lincoln Park).
Anywho, I’ll live here any day over Lakeview and most of Lincoln Park for quality of life. Unless you’re super loaded or need a much faster commute downtown, there is a lot going for this home at this location at this price.
The attendance schools are not considered good by most academic measurments. However, Waters Elementary is walkable from here and your kid can test in (great school and community). Most folks buying this price-point will send to private schools, and there are plenty good ones that are not that expensive compared to the Francis Parkers, Latins et, al. St. Andrews, Montissorey (spelling?), St Mathias, St. Bens and other non-religious private schools are ready to take your thousands.
I think the live in the city/burb choice for people is very valid and many struggle with it . However, comparing the actual homes and property price city/burb is useless. We live in the city for many specific reasons (my business, culture, look, feel, walkability, wife’s career), so I compare the market here, not with the North Shore, West burbs etc…
My family often stays at my in-laws in Lemont for several days at a time and we really enjoy the newer build huge house on big lot, quiet (although our city block is just as quiet most of the time) etc… My wife will sometimes commute to work from Lemont on our extended visits. She told me “I get sad leaving the city on the train home”. That pretty much sums up our city/suburb choice.
Ad Skeptic’s reasoning to mine above and our decision is final. I ride my bike last minute with 4 yr old in jump seat to Wrigley in 7 minutes, buy cheap tickets after the first inning for the Cubs game… priceless and I’m my kid’s HERO! It will be even cooler when he’s older, playing ball!
“Pros and cons to scale. Chicago has a swat team, hazmat team, helicopters, and very good experienced cops and detectives.”
yes because Chicago NEEDS a swat, hazmat, ect. good ol keni can redirect its cash to schools, parks, streets, and that oddly vacant strip of commercial that look so depressing.
“Waters Elementary is walkable from here and your kid can test in (great school and community).”
Eric, Waters is becoming more popular, but it is not test in. Students outside of the attendance area can applyb (lottery) and will have better luck if they are in higher grades.
damn, it’s been years since I was smart enough to go for the 2nd inning Cubs game thing, thanks for the reminder!
“I’ll live here any day over Lakeview and most of Lincoln Park for quality of life.”
A-men. The sluggish brown line is the, I repeat THE, only issue I have with Lincoln Square.
“clio on August 10th, 2010 at 12:04 pm
Why doesn’t anyone like the western suburbs?”
because you live there thats why!
no but Elmuhurst, oak brook, D grove, hinsdale are nice. the mall we shop at is oak brook mall but we just dont like the patrons there.
we have, and i posted about this before, seriously considered naperville. but i think like most get a better vibe from northshore burbs as they dont epitomize everything people hate about the burbs as the west burbs do. given schaumburg is the seventh layer of hell when it comes to everything wrong with burbs in the world.
I would rather have this and pocket the extra million.
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Winnetka/975-Oak-St-60093/home/13787596
you’ll need the extra million to pay those taxes! DAMN!
Tax: $13,685.18
thats WITH exemptions…
“Anywho, I’ll live here any day over Lakeview and most of Lincoln Park for quality of life.”
really you would take this place for 1.7 million and 20k+ in taxes say over a NW side place with better EVERYTHING.
save your self a million and 10k+ in taxes and get a larger lot better schools and a pool….
……..see MLS#: 07532528
“save your self a million and 10k+ in taxes and get a larger lot better schools and a pool….
……..see MLS#: 07532528”
But I might as well be in the suburbs (and I get a HS with the Winnetka house). Where I can I walk to from here?
I know i pump up NW side hoods but i for the life of me cant understand why a person would say “hey i lets buy a 1.7 mil 7br home for our family”
when any NW side hood will get you better EVERYTHING for a third of this place.
what does LS have the say a norwood park doesnt?
DZ,
yes but a Lincoln Square home is same as saying “might as well be in the burbs”
I read this site a lot and I rarely chime in. however, this is just another post where the burbs are debated…which one is better etc. People always say–but you can get to chicago in 15, 20, or 30 minutes (or whatever it is). but- isn’t that the point of living in chicago? us city dwellers don’t want 15, 20 or god forbid 30 minutes to get to chicago so please stop pointing that out. I want to walk to the bar, restaurant, museum, work (what have you) and then walk home.
“I know i pump up NW side hoods but i for the life of me cant understand why a person would say “hey i lets buy a 1.7 mil 7br home for our family”
when any NW side hood will get you better EVERYTHING for a third of this place.”
A big chunk of the difference is for the fancier pants house. What’s the difference between a Lincoln Sq and Norwood Pk lot? Maybe $300K? I know the Norwood lot if it’s in Old Norwood is prob bigger.
“what does LS have the say a norwood park doesnt?”
Answers to my question: “Where I can I walk to from here?”
dahliachi, good catch, should have said “application” not test in. But, these kids in this house will go private, wink 🙂
Groove dude, what the Hell are you smokin’? You take my statement that I would personally live on this block of Giddings than Lakeview or most of Lincoln Park (true) where I don’t even bring up price cuz I live in my world and budget (which is not $1.7M).
Then you send me a Norwood Park house where “everything’s better?”
Ha. Sorry, I’ll live at 2200 W Giddings in less house, a block from Giddings Square free concerts, dozens of restaurants and shops, awsome parks, cool people etc… rather than drive way the heck out to Norwood Park and back every day I have to work. No one would compare that small stretch of Northwest Highway in Edison Park/Norwood Park with a handful of decent places with the freakin’ awesome Lincoln Square retail and cultural stretch. If you want a more suburban feel, Norwood Park is great and I’ve written about it on my blog.
To use monopoly money for our purpose here, OF COURSE I would live in this area of Lincoln Square vs just about anywhere in the city or burbs with $900K (which is about what the house you sent is listed at). My wife and I have played this game… with $800K-$1M, we live here, no reason or want to move to a southeast neighborhood for the trade-offs in quality of house or hood. Again, for big bucks, maybe we’d go East Lincoln Park soley for the lakefront.
We could have gone northwest city, various burbs whatever for a single family house in our budget, but we chose (and just bought a house) in Ravenswood again near this Giddings location.
No house at the money we are actually spending was worth living 30 minutes plus drive time from our current location.
“I want to walk to the bar, restaurant, museum, work (what have you) and then walk home.”
You ain’t walking to museums and work from this place. The issue with this property is that it’s geared towards a large family with top percentile income. Also at the surface it’s “only” 1.795 million, but add in private schooling and it becomes ridiculous. That’s why it’s being slammed. Also it’s ugly.
Bob 2,
But you are walking to the train to go to the Museums or anything in between with no worries (just did free day at Field Museum yesterday, hopped on train then walked down Rossevelt into Museum Campus. Kids and I just have a blast). You can walk to Swedish Cuttual Center with pretty cool Kid’s Museum at Clark and Foster. Nanny took kids there today 🙂 It’s too hot to play at the parks.
Nice looking house IMO. Threshold for this house is probably $1.5-$1.6M for the neighborhood. They got $1.8M for the same build a few blocks south on Sunnyside at the end of 2009 and $1.5 plus for another similar house on the street about a year ago that was brick, but less pimped out.
“If I am paying one point something million and need a huge house, I want the architecture to be special and memorable”
You are likely not going to get “special and memorable” architecture when you only spend 1-1.5 million dollars. 2.5-3 million dollars starts getting you into the “special and memorable” architecture.
“2.5-3 million dollars starts getting you into the “special and memorable” architecture.”
all too often, memorably *bad*.
“Groove dude, what the Hell are you smokin’?”
not the good stuff i cant grow it myself anymore 🙁
my nonsensical rambling is just pointing out the absurdity to pay 1.7mil and huge taxes to live in LS. i would pay 400k for house there and be happy just dont see the person for this market.
yes the short strip in edison isnt as trendy as a LS lincoln strip but it doesnt have the DAMN OVERPRICED BOUTIQUES AND CAFE”S so my dollar will go farther there. and really is LS a walkable hood? you still will have to take the brown like to the loop and get there in like 2 hours, or take the blue line and be there in 25 minutes.
both LS and Norwood you WILL need a car. the only difference is Your personal job it would be closer.
sorry i am just cranky and tired of these Big Ten suburb transplant hoods being so hyped up. CHICAGO EXISTS AFTER WESTERN AVE!
now i understand your monopoly money example but if you take your job/travel time out of the equation you would really choose Lincoln Square over a Edgebrook or Norwood?
now i played the East LP game and can say the dining, lake front, parks and zoo are top notch. the shopping is overpriced, the people are douchey, and the traffic is blood pressure medicine inducing. but take out my horrible travel time to work from ELP if i had a choice i would still pick a NW side hood anyday. but that is “family man groove”, “Single no kid man groove” would not be caught dead on the NW side.
“i would pay 400k for house there and be happy just ”
I’d pay $400k for this house, too. And you can get a house for $400k in LS, but not a house you would choose to live in.
“After you do that look at this place:
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Highland-Park/1024-Sheridan-Rd-60035/home/17624011
Darn.”
Really? I don’t know why you posted this. This is 2004 construction. A 6 going on 7 year old house isn’t even in the same ballpark as a brand new constructed home (quality of construction held constant).
You can get “roughly equivalent” if its new to new. Start over and take the chip off your shoulder.
“I don’t want to get into a long discussion about pedagogy or testing-so I’ll try to be brief.”
I agree to a point, and if this was 75th percentile versus top 5%, I could buy your argument but bottom 25% of testing is downright awful. As for poor families, I think there are about 500 elementary schools in far more impoverished areas in Chicago and it seems like a solid bunch of them test higher than McPherson.
Don’t get me wrong, testing is one dimension, not the whole. But a miserable fail on that one dimension is telling.
I’m with groove and anybody else that says Lincoln Sq is not the place for $1.7m homes. I’ve lived there at two different points in my years in this city. I saw them cut down most of the trees during the long horned beetle fiasco. Then I saw them tear down a lot of the houses. I saw the prices of the houses that remained skyrocket. I dug it all from my $800 month rent point of view. But I never understood why people thought it was a place that should be transformed into the next Lincoln Park. It just never made sense to me. Not close to the lake and not close to the loop. Now the old German bars are filled with yuppies instead of old German people. In my opinion it’s a neighborhood that’s taken a turn for the worse.
The only people who should be buying $1.7MM homes in Lincoln Square are those German bar owners who are getting rich selling $5 pints to the yuppies. Dumb yuppies felt too old for Lincoln Park and Lakeview so they just followed the Brown Line north to Lincoln Square.
Its not as obnoxious a hood as Roscoe Village, but there really isn’t that much spectacular about it. It has a small town America fell to it similar to Southport corridor but that doesn’t seem to justify a 1.7MM SFH.
1.7MM in LS..LOL
1.7MM in LS..LOL.
1.7MM in LS..LOL..
1.7MM in LS..LOL…
1.7MM in LS..LOL….
1.7MM in LS..LOL…..
1.7MM in LS..LOL……
1.7MM in LS..LOL…….
1.7MM in LS..LOL……..
1.7MM in LS..LOL………
JMM-I’m not sure where you are getting your rankings from-I’m looking at the Interactive Illinois report card put out by .
McPherson tested 78% meets or exceeds state standards. (ahead of Waters by a few points). District average is 68%. McPherson gets these decent results with 74% Hispanic population, many of whom do not speak English at home compared with Waters’ 40 something) percent Hispanic.
By 8th grade 92% of McPherson students meet or exceed standards. Fairly impressive considering that 82% are low income.
My point is that the school is already doing a lot of things right.
Why does everyone seem to think it is the school that makes the kid? Of course you want to go to a “decent” school – but the reason many of the schools in wealthier areas rank highly (in terms of student scores, etc.) is because their parents understand the importance of education, etc. and make sure their kids do their homework, get help they need, etc.
Do you think that if you put the child of an uncaring parent in a great school, that child will all of a sudden start doing well?!! If you believe this, then YOU guys need to go back to school!!!
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Highland-Park/1024-Sheridan-Rd-60035/home/17624011
Yuck, this house had been on the market for years and it is way overpriced.
“no but Elmuhurst, oak brook, D grove, hinsdale are nice. the mall we shop at is oak brook mall but we just dont like the patrons there.
we have, and i posted about this before, seriously considered naperville. but i think like most get a better vibe from northshore burbs as they dont epitomize everything people hate about the burbs as the west burbs do. given schaumburg is the seventh layer of hell when it comes to everything wrong with burbs in the world.”
Any of the old suburbs on the train lines north, west and south are all pretty similar. They all developed the same way (built next to the train stop and it slowly grew from there.)
If you blindfolded someone and took them to downtown Hinsdale and then did the same thing with downtown Lake Forest- would the person know any difference? I doubt it (except downtown Hinsdale is actually bigger and nicer, in my opinion.)
Downtown LaGrange has great restaurants and the old movie theater. Also Borders and Traders Joes. All within walking distance of your house, if you so choose.
I was just in the Davis in Lincoln Square for the first time. What a mess! It could be great but it needs serious renovation. But go into the older movie theaters in the western suburbs (the classic cinemas) and it is a joy.
People are really missing out on some great areas if they don’t look at the close-in suburbs. Schools are wonderful. Like I said- great restaurants and kids activities. And, yes, the Metra is faster than the brown line. But you’re not riding your bike to Wrigley Field.
“Do you think that if you put the child of an uncaring parent in a great school, that child will all of a sudden start doing well?!!”
No genius but if you put the child of an uncaring parent in a great school there is far less chance the kid will fall in with the wrong crowd. Duh!
“I was just in the Davis in Lincoln Square for the first time. What a mess! It could be great but it needs serious renovation.”
LOL you should just be grateful they now take credit cards. A relatively recent phenomena–only a few years ago and 15 years behind everyone else.
“But you’re not riding your bike to Wrigley Field.”
See?– Gotta live the dream!
Groove, okay, I’ll take the bait… First point… you CAN’T take commute time out of the equation when choosing where to live and and what house. That’s 50% of the decision. Also, your claim of two hour Brown Line commute is a way nuts. I’ve done Kimball (the end of the world) to Merchandise Mart in 50 minutes easy many times leaving my door. Western stop is of course shorter time, and Damen less, so on etc..
You are not getting to the Loop in 25 Minutes from Norwood Park or Edgebrook out your door. Unless, MAYBE living on the Metra Line stop literally and working in southern Loop outside the station.
Seriously, this is exasperating. The amount of free cool stuff to do and WALK TO in the 47th Ward is fantastic.
Lincoln Square not walkable? Geez. Norwood Park and Edgebrook have nothing to do with Lincoln Square… nothing. Completely different living. I show houses in Edgebrook, Norwood Park, and Jeff Park for that matter all the time. Looked in Edgebrook and Norwood Park for myself too. In the “nice parts” of those hoods you get squat for $500K and live in a suburb environment with … not much diversity (cough) in any stretch. Anyway, $400K gets you a really crappy house on the outskrits of Lincoln Square and a teardown where this house is located.
From this location especially, you can walk to dry cleaner, coffee, grocery, bars, CVS, Walgreens, movies, high and low end restaurants, awesome cafes, Old Town School of Folk Music, Framer’s Markets… whatever you want and have choices.. Norwood Park… Edgebrook? You can drive to a strip mall I guess. Over priced? The restaurants offer any budget and no one I know shops at boutique clothes stores anyway, ha.
Need a car in Lincoln Square? There is Rockwell, Western and Damen Brown Line stops (this Giddings house is two blocks from either Western or Damen stops), Western, Damen, Lawrence, Foster, Clark buses etc… We rarely use our cars outside of work… and I don’t even need my car to work most days. I ride my bike, walk and take the train to listings sometimes.
In our free time, we never need a car to get anywhere… we train it downtown from Damen Brown Line stop. On weekends door to door to Mag Mile is 30 mins… 45 mins tops on weekday commutes downtown with any delays. But we barely make it out of Lincoln Square or Andersonville because there’s lots of stuff to do. We can take the Clark bus to Lincoln Park, go to the Zoo, hit the lake… whole day for little money. We’ve even taken the Metra north to Evanston and Downtown. I have two local coffee shops and a drycleaner, brunch place, beer run store, (all good) within a block of me on Damen. CVS, two bars with decent food, more eateries, three blocks etc… Get on this Giddings location and your a block away from the best stuff.
Also, we don’t allow our au pair to drive. Let’s just say she probably would have left us if stranded in Norwood Park or Edgebrook with no car rather than living here in Lincoln Square. She takes the kids all over and has an awesome social life here without driving.
So, I don’t care where someone wants to live. People buy in Schaumburg for the love of God. But, there is no apples to apples comparison to far northwest city neighborhoods and the Lincoln Square area west of Rockwell and south of Foster. It’s totally different.
And what’s with the dude all ticked off about new construction homes in LS (if you came and looked at them, they are usually very fitting to the neighborhood compared to other hoods). Secondly, trees were cut down years ago from beatles, but no one would ever know it. “most of the trees were cut down” Ha! Streets are completely tree lined, parks are beautiful. No one in Lincoln Square would say, or want to think, that the hood is trying to be the next “Lincoln Park”. Ridiculous statements. Most owners here know we’re lucky to be in a safe, pretty neighborhood with something for everyone.
I don’t think anyone is claiming this house should or will get $1.7M. It will be over $1.5M most likely though.
Sabrina, how much are you paying for one of those houses actually walkable to downtown and the Metra in LaGrange? What do you get for the money? And, you still have to work right next to the Metra station downtown or you’re gonna ad a lot of commute time getting to the office north in the Loop.
I meant “east” of Rockwell in my rant, not west.
“how much are you paying for one of those houses actually walkable to downtown and the Metra in LaGrange? What do you get for the money?”
In Hinsdale, the houses that are close to downtown are actually a little less expensive than the outlying homes (because their lots are a bit smaller). You can get a “decent” house for less than 500k. In La Grange, things are even cheaper – you can get a “walkable house” for less than 400k. Also, things (groceries, gas, clothing, etc.) are a bit cheaper and stores are more easily accessible in the suburbs.
Eric,
Agreed you cant take the commute out and thats why your Bias towards Ravenswood, LS, LV, SoPo, ect. my bias towards NW side is value for dolllar and family based. as i said above, if your single or a DINK the NW side is not for you.
Lincoln Square has a new hefty premium to own there now and where i am going with the above rants are the Premium is not justified.
my train commute example is a bit out there but the brown line is slowwwww but the cleanest in the city. but with a NW side place you have the option of 90/94, Blue line, and metra so your commute options are better and even faster to get to things out side the area. Try going to a burb from LS and see how much fun that is.
also their are other teams besides the Cubs, wanna guess who will get to those faster?
and i dont know about other people, but my good friends and family are spread throughout the city and burbs and easy/quick access to them is a priority. Only the friends that live in Rodgers park and my one friend in Lincoln Square are the hardest to get to and a Pain.
i will give you that you LS has more things to walk or bike to which is a 100% true. but the same amount of time it will take you to walk or bike my car can get me there also in that time. but the basics like food and liquor are walkable in the NW side.
also to me walk-ability is over rated, i found i make more trips which in turn waste more time and i spend more in the long run as more small trips add up than when i make one big trip and stay within the budget.
walkability you would think trim down the body fat, well i found that i fricken gained weight.
and diversity…really? no really! lets sit in the heart of Lincoln square and stop all the people that are not White Yuppies and ask them where they live, yes you are correct they wont say LS.
now lets sit in the heart of Jefferson park and ask the non whitey walking by where they live and they would just point to their house.
so the diversity comment is true for both a norwood and LS but the difference is norwood doenst have the annoying douchey yuppies walking around.
now i have no rebuttal for the Au pair thing as the nanny thing hasnt really caught on in NW side, its still stay at home wife, day care, or grandmas house.
but i dont see a problem with a nanny in norwood as she has a SUPERB park right there, the metra, and harlem blue line for all the museums. and if you let her drive she will have access to a 15 min drive to the Kohls kids museum.
now most of my ramblings are scattered and make no sense, its cuz i start a point/idea and then work on something then try to finish then get called away and by the time i started to i hit submit my brain has bounced around from thing to thing so i appologize for that.
i like Lincoln Square and really like this house (sans the vinyl siding) but i will still say one thing…….
….WHY IN THE F*@% WOULD A PERSON WANT TO BUY A 1.7MIL HOUSE AND PAY 25k IN TAXES TO LIVE IN LS?
“n the “nice parts” of those hoods you get squat for $500K and live in a suburb environment with … not much diversity (cough) in any stretch”
I’d thought that Groove was nervous around too many white people? How can he pump up the far NW and retain that nervousness?
“I’d thought that Groove was nervous around too many white people? How can he pump up the far NW and retain that nervousness?”
see above post..
“now lets sit in the heart of Jefferson park and ask the non whitey walking by where they live and they would just point to their house.”
“And what’s with the dude all ticked off about new construction homes in LS (if you came and looked at them, they are usually very fitting to the neighborhood compared to other hoods). Secondly, trees were cut down years ago from beatles, but no one would ever know it. “most of the trees were cut down” Ha! Streets are completely tree lined, parks are beautiful. No one in Lincoln Square would say, or want to think, that the hood is trying to be the next “Lincoln Park”. Ridiculous statements. Most owners here know we’re lucky to be in a safe, pretty neighborhood with something for everyone.
I don’t think anyone is claiming this house should or will get $1.7M. It will be over $1.5M most likely though.”
That was me, so I’ll respond. I’m not “ticked off.” I’m just saying I knew the neighborhood before it got fancy. I lived there beforehand, then I lived there again while the change was underway. In my opinion it was a change for the worse.
It was a nice neighborhood before the change. It was safe, it was ethnically and socioeconomically diverse, it was filled with interesting stuff. A mix of working class and moderately wealthy people living side by side in decent quality / moderatley priced housing stock. In short, it was what people on this site often say Chicago needs more of.
Then the money started rolling in. People may think they know what happend to the real estate, but I think it’s hard to really understand unless you watched it happen. I remember lots of signs: “Affordable housing for all in the 47th Ward!” With the new housing came a new look. Working class started to disappear. Pretty quickly everyone started to look the same. Nice young couples with nice little kids in expensive strollers. That’s fine, I look more like them than the people who left. But it WAS a SIGNIFICANT change. This lead to a transformation of Lincoln Ave. It was also really hard on Montrose Ave. That stretch used to be pretty vibrant. But rents went up and all the cool old business were run out. Best example: the old pharmacy is now a bar that sells $20 glasses of bourbon.
As for the trees – You can’t understand how bad that sucked unless you lived on a street when they cut the trees down. One morning you went to work and your block was lined with beautiful 100 year old trees. You came home that evening and all the trees were gone. I know the city has done a good job replanting. I’m just saying, that wasn’t that long ago and most people that now live in Lincoln Square/Ravenswood probably don’t even know what the place looked like beforehand. It was more a comment on the passage of time / collective amnesia / how people who think their neighborhood is great don’t really bother to think about what their neighborhood was like before they got there.
daaaaaamn groove! Hater!
also, put down the fork fatty!
“walkability you would think trim down the body fat, well i found that i fricken gained weight.”
“see above post..
“now lets sit in the heart of Jefferson park and ask the non whitey walking by where they live and they would just point to their house.””
J.Park isn’t the Far NW Side you tout so much. Oriole Park Elem is 75% white, and the ‘hood moreso.
“J.Park isn’t the Far NW Side you tout so much. Oriole Park Elem is 75% white, and the ‘hood moreso.”
true, and the reason i lack on mentioning Jeff park is the schools but for the example of LS where the schools are on par with jeff park i switch over. (given Beubian is a top school but thte part of jeff park i do “tout” isnt in the beubian district.)
Sonies,
LOL…it is true we went from eating out only two days to only cooking one day a week (if that). and i think thats been the killer on top of that i dont hit the gym any more just run outside.
and thank you alanon!!!!
that was a great read and i LOVED it!!!!!
Eric,
we will be at Gale street inn tonight and we were planning on walking from our good friends place. but with the shytie heat we will be driving.
see the options you have with the NW side 🙂
Oh and forgot to add,
my wife is driving to our friends, i am meeting them at theier place by car, and her husband will be arriving at gale street by blue line.
so yes our eco-footprint will be huge but just look at the options we have and this is the NW side.
ha – I am so totally on board with Groove. all white people (and I am one pale mutha) make me itchy, just doesn’t feel right. when I moved to Avondale I heard the old Greek dude on the corner telling a buddy “holy shit – the white people are moving back here!” of course, we were the only ones for a good 5 years+ on our street specifically.
but also in agreement with alanon and Eric as well. I think we may be developing a Borg-mindmeld here.
this is a good piece regarding transportation/walkability, btw:
http://www.grist.org/article/2010-08-11-housing-transportation-affordability-index-location-efficiency/
“With the new housing came a new look. Working class started to disappear. Pretty quickly everyone started to look the same. Nice young couples with nice little kids in expensive strollers. That’s fine, I look more like them than the people who left. But it WAS a SIGNIFICANT change. This lead to a transformation of Lincoln Ave.”
btw, this is true, but not the complete story – I grew up by Alphonsus, and much of that old neighborhood has been slowly migrating north up Lincoln Ave since the 80s, businesses & people. I know loads of scruffy underemployed thirtysomethings in LS, you just won’t notice them, and they like it that way.
fact is that LS never had any serious issues holding it back – it wasn’t a skirmish zone during white flight in the 70s, and if there’s anything less offensive and easier to rally around than the culture of German beer gardens and streetfests where you can drink starting at almost sunrise I don’t know what it is – LS has been waiting to blow up for 20 years.
and btw, I do most definitely remember driving on Western in 1995 or so and seeing a bunch of old white haired folk in the lederhosen drinking the mongo beers at about 9 am one Mayfest/Oktoberfest/I-wanna-spend-a-lot-of-cash-for-beer-so’s-I-can-get-plastered-in-the-street fest.
LS is a charming, pleasant, PRETTY neighborhood. Yeah I said it. It’s a “gal” thing I guess.
IMHO the biggest drawback to the cultural quality of the nabe is the Sultzer Library – poorly built, often messy and functional-computer-challenged. But the kids seem to like it!
Oh yeah, and the Post Office on Lawrence + Rockwell. Avoid it unless absolutely necessary (pick up package), and go to the sweet lil’ substation at Damen + Montrose instead.
“ha – I am so totally on board with Groove. all white people (and I am one pale mutha) make me itchy, just doesn’t feel right.”
it just give this creepy vibe like the children of the corn or something.
“when I moved to Avondale I heard the old Greek dude on the corner telling a buddy “holy shit – the white people are moving back here!””
Doode when i was a skate board punk in the 80’s i dated a chick over in your area. Cant remember the street name but its one perpendicular to milwaukee ave and bit closer to the Gap than belmont.
but back then the area was polish with a strong hint of latin. that dunkin donuts on belmont/milwaukke back then was 100% polish contractors in line there.
Alphonsus is a nice part of Lake View. Quiet, family friendly, close to transport. I don’t think that section has changed that much, other than some newer houses.
From alanon:
“That was me, so I’ll respond. I’m not “ticked off.” I’m just saying I knew the neighborhood before it got fancy. I lived there beforehand, then I lived there again while the change was underway. In my opinion it was a change for the worse.”
I can totally relate. I moved to my area in Brooklyn in 1997 because it was quiet and clean and beautiful, and also very convenient to Manhattan with all the bars and shopping and fancy restaurants when you wanted that kind of stuff. So a couple of years later, the stroller brigade – (the same people who scorned me for moving to Siberia in the first place) – were all like “Oh my God! I went to Brooklyn this weekend and it’s actually NICE there! Is it cheap? It must be cheap. Can I get a deal on a co-op?” Like they were the first people to discover it or something.
So the stroller moms moved in and now all the mom and pop stores have closed because they can’t afford the rents anymore. The bakers, fruit stands, dollar stores and shoe repairmen are gone. I’m sorry, but I don’t need yet another bistro with $17 entrees or another hipster store with $200 jeans. And I don’t need another fancy cupcake or a spa.
What I’ve really enjoyed all these years about Chicago is walking around all day and exploring all the neighborhoods, especially on the West Side. I find them fascinating. Some gentrification is inevitable I suppose, but a part of me dies when the flavor which made a neighborhood appealing in the first place is extinguished.
“IMHO the biggest drawback to the cultural quality of the nabe is the Sultzer Library – poorly built, often messy and functional-computer-challenged. But the kids seem to like it!”
keep in mind that the new Sulzer Library is what allowed the old building to house the Old Town School, so if you think OTS has been an improvement, you can thank the Sulzer in all of its microfiche glory. : )
Groove – I’ll bet $50 we either know each other or have friends in common – you have a throwaway email?
“Groove – I’ll bet $50 we either know each other or have friends in common – you have a throwaway email?”
Groove77cc at yahoo dot com
“but a part of me dies when the flavor which made a neighborhood appealing in the first place is extinguished.”
milky,
Great post!
Milkster,
I may have sounded harsh to the other reader but I too went through the trees getting cut down in Ravenswood… however, you’d think there were no trees here when it’s fantastically tree lined with old and newer trees. I also think there is relatively plenty of affordable rents in the greater Lincoln Square area when you consider the quality of life and nice loaction in the city.
These neighborhood “flavors” and “mom and pop” stores going to the wayside is a cliche that is not reality. NOTHING stays the same. Gentrification does not kill mom and pop stores as evidenced by empty storefronts in small town main streets like Macomb IL or Galesburg etc. No gentrifaction, yet mom and pop shut down. I think larger market and macro economics play a role. How do explain large populations of college kids with mom and dad’s disposable income and ghost town downtown main streets and run down local populations? The auto plant shut down, or the TV manufacturer shut down… that’s how. People buy on the Interwebz etc…
There are dozens upon dozens of sole proprietors meeting the market in Lincoln Square and Ravenswood, some have been there for decades and evolved or kept their niche going. They are meeting the market demands like any business has to do… or there is no business period.
There are plenty of dollar shops, $2 beer nights, cheap food deals, cheap grocery dtores and produce etc every night of the week… no need for $17 dollar entres.
Again, this post was about a house in Lincoln Square and what the market will bear. Instead we have the burbs, far nortwest side, “there goes MY neighborhood and too many white people”. Whatever. My neighborhood where I grew up from 6 yrs to 18 yrs is now a dump. Guess what? We moved when things were looking bad. I wish it went the way of Lincoln Square. Instead, old timers and “mom and pop” lost their home values and dealt with serious crime. I don’t even recognize the neighborhood. At least in Lincoln Square, there are seniors that paid $100K for their house, they have nice neighbors and their house is now worth $500K.
Haha Milkster got pwned by ER. Sorry Milkster but only hipsters or people with no business sense whatsoever think gentrification ain’t good. And a hint: the more commercial activity the better chance of even cheaper places than ER mentioned.
If you don’t like gentrification there are many suitable neighborhoods for you available throughout Chicago to choose from. Go forth & conquer!
Hi Eric – It’s nice to hear from you!
I love a neighborhood which has a good economic mix of people that alanon spoke of – working class, middle class, moderately wealthy and wealthy homeowners who have a vested interest in where they live. Yes, let’s be completely honest. I don’t want to live anywhere near Section 8 or welfare riff raff either. I did that before and it SUCKED. However a lot of these working class/middle-class neighborhoods which were stable and multigenerational with residents who really cared about their properties and their blocks and their neighbors for so many decades are now becoming “trendy” and attracting a more transient young-professional type of person who will come and go and drink their cafe lattes, talking on their cell-phones, pushing a double-wide stroller while walking their dogs – (and not cleaning up after them, I might add) – without making a long-term commitment to things even though they make a big salary. For example, because they can afford to send their kids to private schools, they have no reason to demand better public schools. I don’t know – maybe it’s macro-economic forces at work, I just lament the loss of my 100 year old Austrian bakery with the $3 apple pies. I hate the fact that I can never make it to the public library before it closes because they’ve reduced the hours. I hate it that my elderly parents have to walk to a different neighborhood to do their laundry because all the laundromats have shut down. I miss my old neighbors who were NYC cops and schoolteachers. My co-op is full of bankers and lawyers now and they are not that friendly.
I think this is the beginning of a really good period of time to buy real estate. I hope people put a great deal of consideration into things, buy for the long term and make a commitment to their neighborhoods and make them great places to be!
Oh – that Austrian bakery by the way? It’s now a spa.
Under contract in December 2010 at $1,795,000 and now pending. My guess was between $1.5M and $1.6M. Looks like that will happen. I heart Lincoln Square.
Closed 2/3/11 $1,675,000
New listing just down the block, maybe emboldened by this sale?
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/2020-W-Giddings-St-60625/home/18954198