Could You Restore This Vintage Gold Coast Rowhouse? 112 W. Oak
This 4-level rowhouse at 112 W. Oak in the Gold Coast is on the market as a residential property or as a commercial structure. It is zoned as live/work.
Not much of its vintage features remain on the inside (from what the pictures show) except the fireplace.
But it’s got a Gold Coast address and space in the back for 5 car parking.
Meladee Hughes at Sudler Sotheby’s has the listing. See more pictures here.
112 W. Oak: 4 bedrooms, 3 baths, about 3200 square feet, 5 parking spaces
- Sold in June 2001 for $565,000
- Currently listed for $2 million
- Also available as a commercial space for $2 million
- Taxes of $16,394
- Central Air
- Sold “as is”
OK, there was clearly something not-quite-armslength about the 2001 sale, but still, is this actually worth anything close to $2mm? What have units at the Oak Club (across the street; yes, smaller, less parking, but also updated and not “as-is”) sold for?
this number makes no sense. i think it might be ok if this property was already renovated.
probably hoping some high-end artist or interior decorator, etc would buy it for use as a workspace/showcase/staging op. the parking could be a huge asset for people who work with really wealthy clientele.
$1.2MM sounds about right (was thinking closer to 900k until I considered the parking spaces), would be higher but needs a lower price due to needed renovations.
I wouldn’t have any money left over to restore this giant POS.
that’s not a kitchen, that’s a pantry
Perhaps a stupid question, but how the heck do you park 5 cars there? And outdoor spots? Blech, not for my benzo’s beamers and whatever else I can afford when I can afford a 2 million dollar house…
Say you get it down to $1.5 million. Then you spend, what, about $1.5 million total on renovations ($750k) and building a garage ($750k), over which there could be an additional 800 sq ft of space connected to the house (and the garage should be topped by a lavish deck). For roughly $3 million, you’d have a fully renovated, 4,000 sq ft house with a multi-car garage and custom outdoor space, all at that location. Not bad.
“the garage should be topped by a lavish deck”
The parking area is pretty hemmed in by neighboring, taller buildings. I wouldn’t find it very desirealbe outdoor space.
That better be one hell of a garage for $750k!
Is that really possible, to spend $750k to cover five parking spots?
“Is that really possible, to spend $750k to cover five parking spots?”
I think anonny was rolling in the 800 sf addition, full integration with the existing structure and the lux deck. Keep in mind this would be construction in very confined space. Even then, $750k is pretty rich.
I do doubt that you’d have 5 cars parking once you built the structure, tho 4 is definitely realistic.
You could install some sort of underground + above ground parking garage for tha kind of money… Or just build a McMansion addition 8)
frame garages are like $10,000.
“frame garages are like $10,000.”
So, you know someone who will build a 50×20 frame garage for $10k (or even $20k)? And this frame garage would support a 800+ SF second level (likely for a big kitchen)? And a lux deck on top of that?
Please post the name of your contractor. I would like to hire him for some work at my house.
The comments in here are cracking me up. You have Bob acting like he already visited the property and is ready to make an offer. Bob, do you just pull these “bobstimates” out of your culo? Then you have people dicussing renovations that make no sense. Gotta love crib chatter.
Big swingin’ Dee. Aren’t you the one who said that there are tons of wealthy people ready to support Chicago’s RE valuations on another thread?
Wasn’t your peking order something like:
1) 150k+ income households
2) People from money
3) People with parent help?
How is that working out for you, Dee? You never did respond to my replies in another thread so I’ll give you another chance here.
Are these three segments in the Chicagoland area going to support Chicago’s lofty RE valuations?
For some background on Dee, here is a post where they think 615k for a west loop townhouse is a great deal:
“Bob on June 19th, 2009 at 10:22 am
I will never understand the mentality of someone who spends $630k for a place before starting a family.”
1. They earn 150k+ year
2. Trust Fund
3. Wealthy Parents
etc.
Not everybody is a low wage earner like you Bob.”
Keep up the entertainment Dee. The more disconnected and insulated from reality they are, the more entertaining to me.
How are your wages faring in this downturn, commission schedule Dee? 8) Sorry babes you’re gonna have to re-train for a new career because transaction volume and valuations aren’t coming back. And I’d futher guess that in the realm of RE agents, in separating the wheat from the chaff, you’re the chaff.
Perhaps dog grooming would be better suited to you? It is a burgeoning profession.
Just another day of the same old shite here dee.
Next we will have the resident RE economic/financial expert signing on to debate the logics of taking out a mortgage on the soon-to-be built garage/outdoor rooftop entertaining space.
Which will then roll over into a discussion of who owned this place in the past, the type of person who could possibly afford to do such a thing (and the ‘it wouldn’t be CC without the degrading comments about the fictional character) and their chances of getting said mortgage.
Then you will read about the unemployment rate in the city and the effects that will have on the ‘impossible’ sale of this house.
Predictions will then be made that the house will sit on the market for another year…. after which point it will be demanded that the idiot owner will have to reduce the price to $950,000 for a sale… and still then…
it will be overpriced.
Did I miss any steps in the flow of conversation?
And here we go…..
Didn’t dee say she was not involved in the RE business before Bob when you were cursing her and all other agents with the “NO COMMISSIONS FOR YOU” rally cry?
No WLEO, that was a different thread.
She never responded to my posts in another thread, as is typical. From her non-chalant attitude, detachment from reality and belief in unicorns, fairy tales and the real estate boom returning, I’m guessing she’s in the biz.
So, WL, your comment makes me think that you feel $2mm is a fair ask for this. How so?
Also, the $750k garage/addition/deck might “make no sense”, as dee put it, but it’s more reasonable than a $10k frame garage, no?
Finally, yes, on the UES/UWS or parts of lower Manhattan, this would qualify as “cheap”. But, as you have repeatedly acknowledged (while continuing to express mild surprise), even the “best” parts of Chicago aren’t Manhattan-esque from a house-price perspective.
Given that, what do you think this place might reasonably fetch, if genuinely reno’d the right way? I have a hard time getting a $3mm+ vibe from this place, no matter what gets done to it, because of the precise location–on an alley across from numerous garages, on the same block as Dave & Busters, the fact that it is advertised as commercial space, meaning that the neighbor might be retail in teh future, etc.
Hey I’ve got an idea, lets all pool our money together and turn this into a shitty night club for the “after party crowd” from D&B. That would be sweet wouldn’t it?
Let’s post a comment the westloopelo way instead: $2 million is a steal for a place that’s barely inhabitable! The seller could have asked even more. You could only be so lucky as to own a townhome for less than $5 million in this neighborhood, even in this condition. Anyone who disagrees with this post is just a lowlife broke renter who is jealous of the many successful people who will be lining up for the bidding war on this place.
Actually no anon, I don’t think this is the ‘right price’ for this rowhouse, vintage or not. More just commenting on the predictability of how the chatter is carried out here.
Now had it been renovated correctly the first (few?) times and the restoration(s) were done in a manner that retained and showcased some of the period details, then yes, $2 mil would have been a great deal for it. Not so much anymore. 2 poor loft like tiny kitchens and that torn up space? Yikes…
What price would I be willing to pay for it considering the renovation $$$ that I would invest in it…based loosely & solely on the location and square foorage on the listing info here…just around but not much more than $1 mil. To go from the ’01 $565k price to $2 mil now is just insane, I don’t care where it is located.
Not really experienced in commercial RE so I wouldn’t know the range there, but for a residence only I could see easily investing the same amount as the sales price…around $1 mil. Then if I were to place it on the market, I would price it at $2.25 million. Didn’t sell then? No problem, at that point I would probably not care to sell it.
Of course I can hear the gasps from other cribchatters even this late at night.
Re: the $10k 4 space garage construction…alrightee then…the windows and garage doors would cost that much alone.
A nice attached 4 car garage (for a residence) with a private roof top deck would be possible and would add at the very least $300k, without all the extras, to the reno costs. Ten years ago I added a 3 space garage to my place in Fl for $80k…and it was a pretty nice ‘parking spot’. LOL, dad’s term for a garage…
“Finally, yes, on the UES/UWS or parts of lower Manhattan, this would qualify as “cheap”. But, as you have repeatedly acknowledged (while continuing to express mild surprise), even the “best” parts of Chicago aren’t Manhattan-esque from a house-price perspective.”
That predictable, huh? I have gotten away from the shock of low dollar Chicago residences and don’t compare them to nyc places anymore…at least not in this company. In attempting to compare the two cities, I realized it was more like comparing Queens to Chicago rather than Manhattan…forget about the UES or UWS. NYC construction worker portapotties are priced similar to most places here…
I recall this building was the surgical suite for a de-licensed now-deceased plastic surgeon.
If this unit is priced at $2 million, then the W Chestnut mini-townhouse at $700,000 (?) with the renovated kitchen/bath and one-car garage is a steal.
Renovation costs for downtown/gold coast/streeterville locations have a much higher premium due to staging and delivery premium costs for contractor parking, delivery problems, storage problems, condo by-law requirements, demanding neighbors who like to call Building Dept to complain or call police, etc.
I wouldn’t call this gold coast. it’s too far west, sort of a no-man’s land by LaSalle Street. not exactly surrounding by gold coast mansions.
WL: “In attempting to compare the two cities, I realized it was more like comparing Queens to Chicago rather than Manhattan”
Now, be fair. Most of the parts of Chicago discussed on the CC are more like Brooklyn than Queens. And the “hi-end” hi-rises are cheaper mostly b/c it’s so much easier and cheaper to build here. Or have you turned into a typical NYC-look-down-your-nose-at-Chicago DB?
WL: “A nice attached 4 car garage (for a residence) with a private roof top deck would be possible and would add at the very least $300k, without all the extras, to the reno costs.”
And anonny was proposing a garage, plus a level of living space, plus the deck on the 3d level, which more than doubles your $300k est., no? But what the hell, I’ll buy this and throw up (haha) a $10k frame 2-car garage, b/c $500k+ for a garage + 800 sf kitchen = deck is just absurd.
WL: “[After reno], I would price it at $2.25 million.”
That seems plausible to me, but I’d definitely want to see garage parking–rather than an open lot–in this location.
Arch: “Renovation costs for downtown/gold coast/streeterville locations have a much higher premium”
Jeez, it’s almost like half of the commenters on this post realized that. Thank you (seriously) for confirming my point with details.
$2MM ask price and a refrigerator straight out of 1989? LOL.
Its amazing the crap people try to pass off as value in the RE ponzi scheme.
Actually anon, I am not being a cliched NYer (don’t start with DB insinuations like last weeks heated convers) at all by saying Chicago could be compared to Queens. If you are invested in and follow NY RE closely, you would see an infant aged emerging trend that Queens is now becoming the ‘new Brooklyn’ as far as RE buying/investing goes.
With the boom and new construction craze of the livable sections of Brooklyn disrupting the lives of the long term residents & natives (new buildings are actually being protested) NYers are now turning to areas of Queens to invest their RE $$$….what little there is of it left. Spend $350k now for a tear down or a property with serious rehab potential and in five years time it will be listed at $2 mil.
As far as becoming “a typical NYC-look-down-your-nose-at-Chicago…”, I guess it is just home town pride. If you are a Native Chicagoan, don’t you too tend to feel some superiority over say, Philly or Detroit *I know Detroit is a bad example at this point, but you get my drift*? I am not attempting to bad mouth Chicago at all, esp with all of the $$ I now have invested here and the upper end permanent residences (a high level 110 Superior unit) I am considering for myself, but rather just attempting to put purchases and renovs here in perspective for the way I think.
“And anonny was proposing a garage, plus a level of living space, plus the deck on the 3d level, which more than doubles your $300k est., no? But what the hell, I’ll buy this and throw up (haha) a $10k frame 2-car garage, b/c $500k+ for a garage + 800 sf kitchen = deck is just absurd.”
Oh I realize that fact. I would not go the route of a garage plus an addition plus a fab roof top deck in an alley location such as what exists behind this place. I mean, who in that demo would even think of putting their guests in a guest house with alley views. Maybe, just maybe, a basic outdoor space with some view blocking hard/landscaping, but not much more than that. And of course in a $2.5 mil property you would require a garage instead of the existing parking spot. No question there, but I don’t think you would end up recouping 100% of your investment dollars in a resale for it. Your own private residence/work space, yes it would be a requirement, for a renovation then resale, no.
“With the boom and new construction craze of the livable sections of Brooklyn disrupting the lives of the long term residents & natives”
And I’m saying that that has happened in most of the ‘hoods most often featured here at the CC. Yes, prices are still lower than B’lyn, but that wasn’t my point–the *change* in price, ‘hood demos and expectations are B’lyn like. Sure, from an investment perspective, Chicago might be “more like Queens”, but from a living perspective–at least in the areas we talk about most–it’s more B’lyn-lite (yes, lite, not like).
“If you are a Native Chicagoan, don’t you too tend to feel some superiority over say, Philly or Detroit”
Man, if I were a native Amarilloan, I’d feel superiority over Philly and Detroit. Why don’t you just propose Jackson, MS or B’more as Chicago “equivalents”? Philly and–especially–Detroit are insulting comparisons. And, yeah, I realize that (most) folks from Philly get insulted when you belittle the place, but I know a few people who live there (by choice!) that would agree with the assessment.
But this is a conversation destined to descend into mass recrimination, so I’ll stop.
If today were still 2006, this property would sell in a day and a half for more than ask by a specuvestor with an option arm loan. People like Dee wake up every morning still believing that it’s 2006 and that prosperity is again only right around the corner.
However, now that financing is tight and banks require million dollar homes to be purchased by bona-fide millionaires, no millionaire will buy this home for $2,000,000. I doubt they’d even pay $1,000,000 given that it’s not turn key. This was the perfect home for a specuvestor willing to buy, rehab then flip after 4 years hoping for an outlandish sized profit. It’s not perfect for the hedge fund manager or plastic surgeon in the Gold Coast looking for a turn-key high end property.
“It’s not perfect for the hedge fund manager”
I don’t think traders and hedgies are very cultured and would mind. Remember that foreclosure downtown with the in cabinet small LCDs?
“…no millionaire will buy this home for $2,000,000. I doubt they’d even pay $1,000,000 given that it’s not turn key… It’s not perfect for the hedge fund manager or plastic surgeon in the Gold Coast looking for a turn-key high end property.”
While this property would not appeal to that person looking for turn key prop, would they then consider the North Avenue renovated house? I mean, not a thing would need to be done to it…hell you could probably even offer a bit more and get it furn’ed just as it is in the pics.
That used to be a common thing in Florida a few years ago when the overbuilding in Miami Beach first started. Crazy rich people from South America/Europe would breeze though a model condo, decide right then they had to have it NOW without any strain or time subtracted from their social life.
Now I think many developers (the ones who haven’t fled back to Europe and still living in Miami) would actually be more than happy to make any of their units totally turn key.
In a prior thread I told of my good friend in NYC who changes homes on a yearly (or sooner) basis. What he usually does is pick up a place that needs a total top to bottom gut and reno and sits in his current mulit million $$ place while every tiny detail is performed to his satisfaction. After a year of costly renovations, he drops in, gets comfortable for a month or so before he and his broker hit the open houses in search for his next project. As much as I enjoy the whole reno process, I think his ‘nothing is too expensive’ fascination with playing in RE is bordering on an obsession. Fun to watch nonetheless and a source of inspiration and information for me. Many of the details I have in my own homes were hatched from seeing the tried and true methods he employed in his many renovation projects. And yes, come time to sell, he has no problem turning them over at all. Usually they are closing in under two months.
Would this occur in Chiacago? Probably not, but there may be one or two who do this here.