Have Prices Fallen 45% in SkyBridge? 737 W. Washington in the West Loop
In this week’s Elite Street column in the Tribune, it discusses the 3-bedroom condo of WMAQ-5 news anchor Marion Brooks in the West Loop.
Marion Brooks, WMAQ-Ch. 5 weekday afternoon anchor and 10 p.m. news reporter, lives in the West Loop but would like to reside closer to her NBC Tower office in Streeterville.
As a result, Brooks is under contract to sell her seven-room West Loop condo, which most recently has been listed for $429,000.
Brooks, who is recently divorced, said she is expecting to lose a significant amount of money on the three-bedroom unit, which she bought in 2005 for $782,000. Features include 21/2 baths, an open floor plan, a fireplace, floor-to-ceiling windows, two balconies and parking for two cars.
“I want to stay in the downtown area, but I want to get a little closer to work,” she said. Brooks, who acknowledged that she bought the unit “at the top of the market,” listed it Aug. 25 for $499,000 and reduced it to $429,000, when an offer surfaced. She had it on the market for $780,000 in 2007, for $775,000 in 2008 and for $700,000, $675,000 and $650,000 in 2009 before pulling it off the market in January.
TV anchor’s condo under contract [Chicago Tribune, Bob Goldsborough, Sep 3, 2010]
The unit is #3001, in SkyBridge, the award winning high rise at 737 W. Washington in the West Loop.
The unit is a short sale.
But it is currently listed for $353,000, or about 45%, under the 2005 purchase price.
The listing has no pictures and doesn’t tell us much about the unit.
But the room sizes (and square footage on other 01-tier units for sale in the building) indicate a “true” 3-bedroom unit with about 2500 square feet.
Have prices fallen nearly 50% in SkyBridge?
Katharine Dolan at Jameson has the listing. See the listing here (no interior pictures). Click here for pictures of #3301, also in short sale.
Unit #3001: 3 bedrooms, 2.5 baths, no square footage listed
- Sold in March 2005 for $782,000
- Originally listed in 2007 for $770,000
- On and off the market
- Listed in August 2010 for $499,000
- Reduced
- Currently listed as a “short sale” for $429,000
- Under contract
- Assessments of $1140 a month (includes heat, air conditioning, doorman, cable)
- Taxes of $8844
- Central Air
- Washer/Dryer in the unit
- Bedroom #1: 20×15
- Bedroom #2: 16×12
- Bedroom #3: 16×12
anyone think the bank will accept this short sale? the loan on it is around 720k i think..
what is a steal price for this unit? lets see how variable our cribbers are on estimating?!
Talk about coincidence…just got a verbal acceptance on an offer in that building yesterday.
In the last year there have been 2 short sales (including this one) and 1 foreclosure in this building. Prices have been all over the board. I think this unit is 2400 square feet, which means $162/SF after removing parking at $20K. That’s the lowest price/SF in the last year by a lot. It’s been as high as $288. From the price history I’m thinking there might have been multiple offers and maybe this went for more than the asking price.
I would think they already have the bank approval- at least to lower to $429k- because usually you aren’t lowering the price like that without some idea that the bank is on board.
And on a separate note…what’s the deal with no pictures? What a way to market a property. Why do sellers accept this approach? How do these agents get these listings?
“I would think they already have the bank approval- at least to lower to $429k- because usually you aren’t lowering the price like that without some idea that the bank is on board.”
Not really. Scenario A: the bank says bring us an offer and then we’ll discuss a short sale and not until then. Sad but true. Scenario B: agent has an idea that the bank will accept a higher amount but chooses to “auction” the property with a much lower price in an effort to get multiple bids.
What I don’t understand is how someone with a mid to high six figure salary can be allowed to “walk away” from this unit. Won’t the bank go after other assets (or garnish wages)? If not, anyone who wants (but doesn’t need) to get out of their mortgage could just walk away with no penalty. (I know credit scores are affected – but seriously, who cares when you compare the benefit of walking away from several hundre thousand dollars in debt).
“what’s the deal with no pictures?”
There was a virtual tour with interior pictures on the listing
Clio,
That’s a really good point. In order to be approved for a short sale you have to be able to demonstrate hardship. You can’t just want to move. I don’t see how this seller can do that.
The 01 layouts are great units. I toured them and seriously considered buying one back in 2004. The design and layout were excellent. I know that they were priced too high but I had no idea just how low they would drop in four years. One of the developers owned an 01 unit on a high floor that he showed me. He had stone floors, custom doors, and extra trim installed. His place was amazing. The view of the Dan Ryan, Kennedy, O’Hare planes, and west loop sunsets make this a great place to live.
At $200per sq. ft. or below it’s getting to a steal pricing. There must be some serious issues with the association to factor that price down to this level.
jp3, i bet you’re right. $1,140 is already a substantial assoc. fee but how this one goes when priced so “low” will be a huge signal if greater issues lurk behind the scenes.
personally, though i think the views from that 3301 are quite nice (if not amazing), i just decided this weekend that I think SkyBridge is an eyesore. it obstructs so many more views than it offers.
it pains me large than you would ever know…..
..but i am in agreement with clio’s statement. How can a person with income to cover the loss be allowed a short sale. and if this is the case that anyone could walk away then why the F**** not just do it. if there is no ramifications besides a black mark (doesnt it go away after 7 years) why not do it and rent a place for 3 times the size (or quality) for the same price in those years?
can she claim hardship because of the divorce? am i missing some of the whole picture?
shoulda called it sky-fail…I mean those assessments are redic!
I love walk-aways. It hastens the price discovery process on the way down. Soon enough housing will be cheap, plentiful and affordable for everyone.
“Groove77 on September 7th, 2010 at 7:32 am
it pains me large than you would ever know…..
..but i am in agreement with clio’s statement. How can a person with income to cover the loss be allowed a short sale. and if this is the case that anyone could walk away then why the F**** not just do it. if there is no ramifications besides a black mark (doesnt it go away after 7 years) why not do it and rent a place for 3 times the size (or quality) for the same price in those years?
can she claim hardship because of the divorce? am i missing some of the whole picture?”
“Won’t the bank go after other assets (or garnish wages)? If not, anyone who wants (but doesn’t need) to get out of their mortgage could just walk away with no penalty. (I know credit scores are affected – but seriously, who cares when you compare the benefit of walking away from several hundre thousand dollars in debt).”
Ding ding ding! You make a lot of sense here clio and I agree. Also it is very hard for me to feel sympathetic to banks when Illinois is a recourse state and yet they still choose not to go after those able but unwilling to pay.
Ahhh, yes. The divorce. Didn’t see that. If the place was owned jointly and now needs to be sold and the owners don’t have the cash to close then that could qualify as a hardship. However, I think the bank might be within their rights to try to get a note for the shortfall.
For those who missed it, 3001 pics:
http://www.smartfloorplan.com/orders/bin/photopack.pl?file=public_html/il/v302846/v302846.xml&map=yes&idx=yes
I can’t understand this woman’s logic. She is moving to save 10 minutes on her commute? I would understand if she worked in Elgin, but this is just stupid. The bank should have no sympathy for her and take all of her assets to cover the difference.
From what I’ve read, in the beginning, Banks were not prepared to deal with short sales and foreclosures of this volume. They also were not prepared for people walking away from their mortgages. So a few got away with it.
Now seeing the writing on the wall, do you think the banks focused on figuring out how to deal with inventory or how to go after the walk-aways? Ding, Ding, Ding!
IMHO They are working harder on tightening laws so that they can go after the walk-aways.
Papu, if your short sale were in the papers, you’d say the same thing. The real story is probably the divorce.
“The bank should have no sympathy for her and take all of her assets to cover the difference.”
because of her actions i will be boycotting NBC 5 news and not watching it.
the greed and evil neeed to stop.
@Papu
I think she got divorced. And this is property that is being sold as part of the division of assets. …So she is going to move anyways.
And since she is going to move, she is going to move closer to work
“I can’t understand this woman’s logic. She is moving to save 10 minutes on her commute? I would understand if she worked in Elgin, but this is just stupid. The bank should have no sympathy for her and take all of her assets to cover the difference.”
Isn’t it likely that her move is forced by the divorce and finances? And that’s her way of covering for it? I am curious about the bank going after her assets or future income. Someone said that even though Illinois is a recourse state, courts have been generally unwilling or reluctant to let lenders go after borrowers’ other assets. But how clear is the caselaw, was that established in world where almost all homeowners losing their homes were in pretty dire financial straits, so that there really wasn’t much to go after anyway? This woman has to be making at least decent money I assume, and could probably pay off the shortfall in what, 10 years?
“And this is property that is being sold as part of the division of assets.”
…or in this case, liabilities.
ok lets says she sells for the short 429k and then buys her new place closer to work for 717k.
how would you feel then?
*even if the divorce was the reason (forced) to sell
maybe the bank doesnt care bc it gets free money from uncle sam?
@Groove:
If a person is taking a rational approach vs. errr pay the mortgage as a moral obligation for 20+ years even though the property value is worth half of that…
Is it best to go after that person or change the rules.
and of course if we change the rules, we make things more complex and costly and get into the debate about how much govt should be involved in our daily lives.
I guess what I am saying is that when you are going to be part of society, you are going to have to take some of the bad lumps too along with the benefits
Regarding short sales/foreclosures, is there any set method banks use to “kick people out” of their homes? One of my friends (who is a physician making aroudn 300k/year) keeps bragging to me that he hasn’t paid his mortgage in 2 years. He lives in a high-rise in the gold coast and his unit is worth about 1million (w/ a 1 million mortgage/HELOC) and states that the bank hasn’t made any effort whatsoever to kick him out. He says he will stay until they kick him out. Is this standard practice? I hope not….
“maybe the bank doesnt care bc it gets free money from uncle sam?”
Ding! Ding! Ding!
Why pursue rational economic outcomes when your industry does not compete in the same capitalist sphere as other industries but rather if you make really bad decisions you are bailed out? Why would there be any motivation to improve your business or pursue these outcomes knowing full well your business is never going to be a going concern?
And for those that say that banks indeed can be taken over by the FDIC let me remind you that less than 3% of banks crisis to date have been taken over so far, which probably represent far less than 3% of the entire deposit base.
We see banks making dumb decisions all the time here on CC, yet is it really “dumb” from the bank’s perspective if there are no bad consequences for said decisions? I think not.
I didn’t realize March 2005 was the peak of the market.
“Is this standard practice? I hope not….”
Yes, clio, it is. Its all part of the housing ponzi economy working in the shadows. These banks are sitting on these defaulters like a papa penguin on an egg in Antarctica.
http://www.doctorhousingbubble.com/culver-city-foreclosures-focus-on-lower-priced-homes-shadow-inventory/
“Banks are merely buying time until they can lobby the government to setup a virtual trash bin to move off their books the giant underwater homes. “
Great eye opening article, Bob – thanks!! I wish more people out there knew this was going on and made more noise about it!
Marion’s place is beautiful and has a fantastic view of the skyline; I toured it in 2007 when it was listed for nearly 800K. She had white tile floors which were later torn out and replaced with wood but I think those and some other personal touches with regard to finishes made it a slow sale.
I sold my condo in Skybridge (#3708 at roughly $292/sq. ft.)this past June. The building association is suing the developer and they just levied a massive special assessment which makes securing financing nearly impossible.
Glad I got out when I did.
Isn’t this exactly what’s happening in Chicago as well? Only we boomed late and busted late so the problem will be worse? Has anyone else noticed the following phenomenon:
MLS lists a property as sold at list price when it really went much much lower.
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/are-existing-home-prices-overrepresented-40
I started to see some data like this and figured I was just looking at typos, but this practice is getting way to common simply be an admin mistake.
@JMM
Its the Chicago Tribune. Not the best paper in the world in terms of fact checking and worse in terms of quality after Zell took over.
I would have thought the peak was in 2007…but what the heck do I know.
@Bob:
It is a pretty extreme example though:
from the comments:
“Sold for 245K in 1996 and then (drum roll please) 800K in 2006. WTFFFFFFF. ”
I’d be more interested in our local area…given that all real estate is local.
So maybe HD or others can comment. Take LP 60614 or South Loop etc. and from 300k – 1.3M. What’s for sale, what’s foreclosure and what’s shadow….
I tried Trulia. I don’t know about the veracity.
http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/60614-Chicago/
984 Homes For Sale 6 Open Homes
757 Recently Sold 221 Foreclosures
We used to have a regular on here (G) who was awesome at gathering and compiling this sort of aggregate data. But then one day he got hit by a bus so..
it def sucked when G stopped posting. he was pretty smart.
i never understood the allure of Skybridge especially when considering the $$/sq ft.
to each their own.
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/3853-N-Keeler-Ave-60641/home/13458700
Owned by a physician, sold for $1,050,000 in 2006 and now in foreclosure.
Probably been years since a payment has been made.
This is more common than you think.
My firm, just like many others, have got a number of high profile people, just like this new anchor, making serious money who are walking away, going into foreclosure, filing bankruptcy, getting loan mods etc.
It’s far more common than any of you want to believe.
Walk aways are good. The million dollar homes of 2006 will soon be the $500k homes of tomorrow. Today’s $500k listed home will be in the $300’s and the $300’s will be in the high $100’s and $200’s.
“#clio on September 7th, 2010 at 9:06 am
Regarding short sales/foreclosures, is there any set method banks use to “kick people out” of their homes? One of my friends (who is a physician making aroudn 300k/year) keeps bragging to me that he hasn’t paid his mortgage in 2 years. He lives in a high-rise in the gold coast and his unit is worth about 1million (w/ a 1 million mortgage/HELOC) and states that the bank hasn’t made any effort whatsoever to kick him out. He says he will stay until they kick him out. Is this standard practice? I hope not….”
For ever news anchor or doctor walking away from their mortgage there are 100 others who walk away and don’t have any attachable assets, whatsoever.
The sheriff will come bust down the door and kick them out
“For ever news anchor or doctor walking away from their mortgage there are 100 others who walk away and don’t have any attachable assets, whatsoever.”
Fair enough, but why don’t the banks go after the ones that have obvious assets? Is the caselaw really that unfavorable in Illinois (and not distinguishable in cases where there are clear assets to go after)? Are the costs of litigation really that great (especially when you factor in the value of establishing a reputation as a bank that you really will go after assets)?
“Falling from Bridge through Sky” is a very potent image.
DA MARE IS ON DA WAY OUT!!! I see Chicago RE benefiting as any change in Chicago city government would have to be an improvement.
As general rule the banks (or the assignees) will pursue second mortgages but not first mortgages.
It’s hard to know who has obvious assets, especially if you’re in an office at a bank in Charlotte deciding who to go after and who not to.
There’s a story from a few months ago in the NYT about how banks are only half-heartedly pursuing deficiencies.
“#DZ on September 7th, 2010 at 12:14 pm
“For ever news anchor or doctor walking away from their mortgage there are 100 others who walk away and don’t have any attachable assets, whatsoever.”
Fair enough, but why don’t the banks go after the ones that have obvious assets? Is the caselaw really that unfavorable in Illinois (and not distinguishable in cases where there are clear assets to go after)? Are the costs of litigation really that great (especially when you factor in the value of establishing a reputation as a bank that you really will go after assets)?”
Who says that a doctor or news anchor has any assets? Many of them are underwater in other areas of their lives as well. Student loans, credit card and lifestyle debt, and over financed automobiles are just three examples of how they might have nothing to pursue. Add to that a spouse that was more irresponsible and they may have created a mess that will not be easy to resolve.
Why does everyone assume that she is not being forced to cut a partial or full check at closing? Does it say somewhere that the couple is blowing off the balance? I did not see any evidence to that point. Perhaps I missed something in the article or in another part of the listing but one could assume that they are trying to avoid foreclosure and are planning to make it right with the bank.
Also careful Cyclops that sounds a bit like slander. Perhaps it is all true but unless you can back those statements up with published facts it is just an opinion.
That’s completely true, both are known to spend frivolously.
“jp3chicago on September 7th, 2010 at 1:08 pm
Who says that a doctor or news anchor has any assets? Many of them are underwater in other areas of their lives as well. Student loans, credit card and lifestyle debt, and over financed automobiles are just three examples of how they might have nothing to pursue. Add to that a spouse that was more irresponsible and they may have created a mess that will not be easy to resolve.”
Good-bye world class city, we’re now on our way to becoming Detroit.
“#Bob on September 7th, 2010 at 12:58 pm
DA MARE IS ON DA WAY OUT!!! I see Chicago RE benefiting as any change in Chicago city government would have to be an improvement.”
“Why does everyone assume that she is not being forced to cut a partial or full check at closing? Does it say somewhere that the couple is blowing off the balance?”
She is definitely going the short sale route and the bank is eating a big chunk here. The brokerage team that is being used focuses on short sales. By definition short means the bank is eating it.
Regarding the disappearance of G. I’ve been wondering the same thing. Apparently he had a job that gave him access to lots of raw historic MLS data from a database. I’m thinking that either he got in trouble for posting here or he lost his job.
“As general rule the banks (or the assignees) will pursue second mortgages but not first mortgages.
It’s hard to know who has obvious assets, especially if you’re in an office at a bank in Charlotte deciding who to go after and who not to.”
Really? Is it that hard to research, or pay someone on contingency to do so? I would also think for a short sale that you could demand anything reasonable to get a picture of someone’s finances?
Also, can you go after future income? You could probably google what many people’s employment situation is.
“Good-bye world class city, we’re now on our way to becoming Detroit. ”
Oh no Rahm is gonna do for Chicago in a much more concentrated fashion what he’s done for the country as WH chief of staff…
😮
I am also with DZ on this. Not only should the banks be punished with these bad loans but they should also be required to pursue these people using every extent possible within the eyes of the law as a pre-condition of maintaining FDIC insurance.
Lets not forget people living beyond their means were just as complicit and instrumental to this bubble and the resulting wreckage.
Yes divorce sucks but its not like divorce has to wreck your finances. Typically divorce only wrecks both parties finances when they are each trying to get back at the other over and above any financial consequences.
They should be forced to live as roommates and pay the mortgage they signed up for. That would be just desserts for these former RE highfliers.
@Bob
“They should be forced to live as roommates and pay the mortgage they signed up for. That would be just desserts for these former RE highfliers.”
Amen….Marriage is simply a contract like a mortgage, people should deal with the consquences and no one should feel sorry for them. If divorce causes additional financial problems, than they should consider waiting for a while for the market to pick up. I hate that people praise god during a marriage and never say damn god during the divorce
When getting approved for a short sale you have to provide bank statements, pay stubs, and tax returns. There’s a reason for that. That’s why I am perplexed as to how this can be a short sale without the seller signing a note – but maybe they are.
Banks may not be wanting to put money into litigation to go after people who stopped paying on their mortgage. Instead, they’ll try to renegotiate once they finally get to the homeowner which is taking months and years.
OR
Banks have such a ginormous backlog of paperwork that they can’t easily get a foreclosure rolling within a few months and it’s taking years as a result.
Sorry Anonemoose, the banks have been delaying for so long using the whole “ginormous backlog of paperwork” excuse that its really no longer valid. Instead its just blatant at this point:
http://www.americanbanker.com/issues/175_165/foreclosures-modifications-california-1024663-1.html
It doesn’t take multiple years to ramp up your foreclosure department with personnel and training if your bank’s loans are a bunch of deadbeats.
HAMP isn’t making anything better when they drag out the loan 40 years and put a $100k balloon payment on the back end of a $200k mortgage. It’s ridiculous. Imagine paying your note 40 years and STILL not own the home. I see these stupid HAMPs all the time.
At what point in the future do the borrowers just walk away? I mean, two years, five years, 15 years? Foreclosures will continue for years and years to come when the banks engage in this sort of nonsense.
Which means that housing prices will be cheaper tomorrow than they will be today.
Bob – believe me. I’m no apologist for banks. I’m going off anecdotal stories from people who live in their homes without paying a dime on their mortgage for a year or more.
From the article above:
“One possible way banks are dealing with that last threat is through what O’Toole calls “foreclosure roulette,” in which banks maintain a large pool of borrowers in foreclosure but foreclose on a small number at random.
O’Toole said the resulting confusion would make it harder for borrowers to evaluate the costs and benefits of defaulting and fan fears that foreclosure was imminent.”
That’s totally not happening, and if it is, it’s not at all apparent to the borrower who defaults.
whaoo..so much for estimating a cost on this unit….i think i have a better understanding of the newscaster than her unit…
to get back on track..leaving aside the short sale…wat is market price for this unit in todays market? anyone??
With the massive glut of unemployed lawyers on the market, you’d think that for a relatively low cost, an enterprising group of lawyers would form some temp staffing operation and then set up a ginormous foreclosure mill that does nothing but litigate these cases for next to nothing. HD – why don’t you get in on that game? There have to be some people with assets or future earning potential that banks could go after for some of these losses. Although part of me thinks that the last thing the banks want is the “documentation” surrounding roughly 90% of their mortgage portfolios to ever see the light of day.
You’re a little behind the curve here, Codilis Freeman Shapiro etc all probably 75% of foreclosures, with a handful of smaller firm filling niche markets like Dykema doing commercial and etc.
Volume collections is not an area of law I’m interested in. but they tell me that they’re hurting too. Lots of credit card and HELOC charge offs so they’re really busy; bt they’re collecting less money per debtor, usually $50 bucks a month or so.
Furthermore, the banks are now moving to non-lawyers for closings. Most states don’t use attorneys but in IL it’s still common; but now the banks are selling REO’s without attorneys and they use $9.00 an hour employees to make sure they’re property interests are taken care of.
You know it’s tough in every market legal market out there. PI/defense attorneys are making less because there are less car accidents because people are driving less; they don’t shop as much so there aren’t as many slip and falls; commercial lit attorneys make less because biz is less likely to litigate huge cases; first amendment cases are down because of less money; don’t even get me started on commerical or residential re attorneys. Although I had a dram stop attorney tell me drunken bar fights are up, way up, so that’s a decent area to earn a living (hahahah!) Everyone wants a discount on their bill; or they pay SLOW, even banks and larger corporations. Divorce is getting slaughtered. I know plenty of divorce attorneys who used to run up bills, sell the house and make out like bandits. Today there’s no equity in the home and nothing is selling so they’re hurting bad; condo association attorneys are hurting because they don’t want to or can’t afford to litigate – fewer owners are current on assessments. The list goes on and on.
“PermaBear on September 7th, 2010 at 5:58 pm
With the massive glut of unemployed lawyers on the market, you’d think that for a relatively low cost, an enterprising group of lawyers would form some temp staffing operation and then set up a ginormous foreclosure mill that does nothing but litigate these cases for next to nothing. HD – why don’t you get in on that game? There have to be some people with assets or future earning potential that banks could go after for some of these losses. Although part of me thinks that the last thing the banks want is the “documentation” surrounding roughly 90% of their mortgage portfolios to ever see the light of day.”
I have heard from a friend that the owners are negotiating who covers the shortfall as part of the divorce, which suggests that someone is writing a check at closing.
I commute by this out of place abomination every day to work and I attribute the excessive PPSF premium to one of two things:
1) Views of downtown for select units.
2) People from bumblefvck who are immediately awe-inspired by tall buildings and lose all economic sensibility and get giddy when in them.
Seriously this place isn’t even in a neighborhood its off on Halsted by itself. I couldn’t even hang out here much less live here. No wonder the highflier is moving closer to work–you’d have to be a workaholic with no appreciation for your surroundings to stomach living here (or well off enough to just cab/limo it everywhere).
At least people I know who live in other highrises in W Loop like Prez Towers just live there because their job is right there. This place isn’t “right there”.
Garnish wages? Moral obligation? What are you guys talking about? A mortgage is a simple contract with a few potential outcomes. If you stop paying your mortgage, the bank gets the house. You are simply exercising the other option in the contract.
“the bank gets the house.”
and if the bank gets less for the house than is owed then they can come after you (depending on state law). This has happened even with short sales.
I’d bet that that bank is getting something from the sellers.
@Bob 2 – You are correct. I guess my issue is with the “Moral Obligation” argument. I feel that a contract is a contract – morals really shouldn’t play into it.
morally, Chase/every national bank Bank shouldn’t charge me $3 for a non-network ATM transaction that literally costs them pennies to conduct.
I have to disagree DC. Legally, you are correct, but there is a bigger picture here. Pride, self-respect, confidence, humility, perseverance, and commitment are all incredibly important virtues/qualities to possess/achieve/experience. Being responsible and standing behind your commitments helps one achieve/experience these intangibles – which, in my opinion, is MUCH MUCH MUCH more important than money.
I’m putting it out there on CC but remember that you heard it here first….
After reading that last blog my vote is for Clio as the next MAYOR OF CHICAGO! We need a man with ethics and a commitment to do the right thing.
Sure he would have to move back into the city but he is constantly commenting on the great deals on cc properties in the city so that should not be an issue!
We know he has a huge pile of cash so he will not need to tap any special interest money. I’ve only read his blogs but my guess is that he is clearly at least as articulate as R.M. Daley! His policies would clearly help the RE market in Chicago. He is often optimistic and has made comments about not wanting to feel dirty.
He is my write in Candidate. He is a way better choice than “Ina the breakfast godess” that ran against Daley the last time around.
I’d bet that he would be the first Mayor to glide to work in a Lambo. Now that would be cool! It might even fuel a new Thursday night dramedy on NBC called Mayor Clio and the Posse. That would be fun to watch. Who do you think should play Clio?
clio,
Its easy to talk a big talk about the moral obligation coming from someone who purports to already have a lot of money. Truth be told there is no moral obligation. Benefits from walking away should be weighed against the costs and each person should decide from there.
Any social circles that consider a foreclosure a societal black mark or scarlet letter, if you will, aren’t social circles I nor any rational person would be interested in being apart of.
Besides clio I’d imagine you’re as annoying in real life as you are on here so it IS the optimal outcome. 😀
“Besides clio I’d imagine you’re as annoying in real life as you are on here so it IS the optimal outcome.”
putting a “smiley face” after saying something mean doesn’t make it better – it just shows hesitation and fear of reprisal. Seriously, if you have something to say, say it and don’t be afraid.
…but back to the “moral dilemma” of foreclosures – there IS ABSOLUTELY 100% something wrong with walking away from a property and not feeling bad. That is not saying that the people who do so are terrible people – it is just another one of life’s lessons that needs to be learned. By minimizing penalties (social or monetary) people will not realize the gravity of their mistakes and may make them again.
By minimizing penalties (social or monetary) people will not realize the gravity of their mistakes and may make them again
His first policy is set! We are up and running!
“By minimizing penalties (social or monetary) people will not realize the gravity of their mistakes and may make them again.”
I have stated this before and I will do so again: never, ever, ever in business count on any sort of moral obligation in lieu of good processes or business practices. This was entirely on the banks, or the investors who bought the notes. If those investors aren’t forced to take haircuts they will absolutely make the same mistakes again of lending their money too cheaply on a risk-adjusted basis.
If the system was so badly broken that one would need to resort to the moral obligation argument as an attempt at keeping it together the entire system deserves to fail and unravel.
Trust me clio: noone else in the business ecosystem of this whole mess ever thought about “moral obligation” one bit. Whether it was the mortgage broker giving the cash at closing on the 105% LTV mortgage or the credit ratings agency rubber stamping the AAA, etc.
I have a friend who actually is in a tough situation and we keep telling him to walk. He won’t but he really can’t afford the place. He’s just delaying the inevitable and meanwhile his financial situation just gets worse as each month ticks by, going deeper into debt to others to stay there.
Mayor C and the LB Thursdays this fall on NBC!
The office staff is still working on this one. Run Clio run we will make you even more famous! The RE market will still suck for the next 4 years. Make it happen!
If the system was so badly broken that one would need to resort to the moral obligation argument as an attempt at keeping it together the entire system deserves to fail and unravel
Bob While I do agree that the moral compass is not the end all be all of policy it is still important. If there was no moral compass all buildings, tolls, and other structures would have to be rebuilt like prisons. In addition all laws would have to be written so tightly that no one could get around anything. It is the moral compass that allows society to function without complete police state and over zealous rules and regulations.
It’s a contract. For some people the “moral” thing to do is what’s best for themselves and their family.
“It is the moral compass that allows society to function without complete police state and over zealous rules and regulations.”
Moral compass does not come into play with most laws as our laws are written so as to minimize areas to bypass them. If the mortgage ecosystem was not, those deficient institutions deserve to fail and be replaced by ones with more stringent business policies and practices. Leave the moral compass argument on the church steps on Sunday morning.
“He’s just delaying the inevitable and meanwhile his financial situation just gets worse as each month ticks by, going deeper into debt to others to stay there.”
…but his pride/self respect are probably still intact – much much more important. Boby, I actually DO understand what you are saying, but don’t minimize the emotional/social aspects of “walking away”. Just talk to someone who has lost their job- it is not just about the money.
“but his pride/self respect are probably still intact”
He’s borrowing from his elderly parents to make the mortgage payments.
“Boby, I actually DO understand what you are saying, but don’t minimize the emotional/social aspects of “walking away”.”
You are right. My friends and I tend to be business oriented (both educated and uneducated friends) and more merchant class oriented. It wouldn’t play a role in our psyche but people are wired differently. At the end of the day you DO need to be able to look in the mirror and live with yourself.
“Seriously this place isn’t even in a neighborhood its off on Halsted by itself. I couldn’t even hang out here much less live here. No wonder the highflier is moving closer to work–you’d have to be a workaholic with no appreciation for your surroundings to stomach living here (or well off enough to just cab/limo it everywhere).
At least people I know who live in other highrises in W Loop like Prez Towers just live there because their job is right there. This place isn’t “right there”.”
The neighborhood may not be as dense as LP, but it’s a 1 block walk to the restaurants on Randolph, and 2 blocks to Greektown. The biggest neighborhood downside I see are the numerous area bustouts who live at the New Jackson Hotel.
I have to side with Clio on this one. Anyone who thinks there isn’t a moral obligation associated with fulfilling a contract is kidding themselves– especially when your fellow citizens (i.e., your friends, neighbors, co-workers) are stuck with the broader issues that arise when too many people decide to walk away. Financial hardship is one thing (and I DO sympathize with those that have TRUE financial hardship issues), but walking away just because you made a poor investment shows complete disregard for your fellow citizen. I bought a place in 2004 and took a hit on the sale end. I take responsibility for my actions and don’t expect others to clean up my messes.
***Besides clio I’d imagine you’re as annoying in real life ***
oh the irony…but you both sound like verbal colostomy bags. Bob, a grumpy, frustated baby boomer and Clio, a 30-something younger version of Bob.
nothing personal and apologies for going ad hominem (but that is the tradition of the internet and cribchatter, ain’t it).
have a nice day.
UGH…TACKYTACKYTACKY was my own and my client’s reaction to this building, and several units therein, a few years ago when we were shopping for a nice “in town” close to the Loop. Uninteresting layouts, white-on-white decor, walls and carpets in the hallways with all kinds of dirt and damage…what a contrast to the lovely presentation and model units that were shown to us during the pre-construction brokers’ tours!
Does anyone know if bugs and “critters” make their way to these condos from the Dominick’s back room? (The reason I ask is that many people don’t want to live above a restaurant or grocery store because they do not want non-human “roommates.”)
chitowngal…
find me a 2400 sq foot unit with 2 parking spaces at this price with views like this(they are good,iv seen them),with comparable short sales/forclosures that this building has, this close to the heart of downtown….its okay..put me on top of a restaurant or grocery store…(south loop isnt a choice cause that area isnt comparable)…
if ur able to do that,ur last comment has wieght…if not,u really dont know what your talking about..
btw i am serious…i am interested if u can find me a unit.
Wife told me she heard on the news that this place closed and recalled it was around $450k. If that is the case I believe that someone got a good deal on the unit. I recall being VERY interested in this floor plan but just could not justify the developers pricing. Thank god I kept walking away. Great views, open floor plan, and three good sized bedrooms would have allowed me to stay for a long time but I’d be bummed out to know that my value had dropped by 35%.
“Wife told me she heard on the news that this place closed and recalled it was around $450k.”
Yes- it closed on 1/3 for $450,000.
how good of a deal did the buyer get..anyone?
They got a damn good deal. The 01 tier units are beautiful. Look at the pictures: you get the northwest-facing view from the master bedroom and the breakfast nook. Even better is to see them in person. I did and it was jaw-dropping; the pictures did not capture how amazing and light-filled those units are. And at $450k, you are not paying the Skybridge coolness markup. That said, you still pay the high assessments for the services (doorman, heat/cooling, common deck+party room+fitness room+upkeep).
That sale affected comps big time: 1401 sold 24 days later for $530k versus an asking price of $650k (for a non-short-sale). That’s about a 1/3 drop versus the March 2006 purchase price and almost 20% off the asking price.