Lincoln Park Vintage Beauty Still On the Market: 2523 N. Burling
We last chattered about this 3-bedroom vintage greystone unit at 2523 N. Burling in Lincoln Park in July 2008.
See the pictures and chatter here.
Since then, it has been reduced another $4,000. But it’s still available.
Susan Parent at Coldwell Banker has the listing. See the listing and more pictures here.
Here’s its history:
Unit #2: 3 bedroom, 2 baths, 1625 square feet
- Sold in June 2006 for $595,000
- Was listed in April 2008 for $599,000 (parking included)
- Reduced
- Was listed in July 2008 at $579,000 (parking included)
- Reduced
- Currently listed at $575,000 (parking included)
- Washer/dryer in the unit
- Back porch
- Central air
- Assessments of $100 a month
- Taxes of $5936
Another young couple who bought the top……..
Take any offer you can get.
$579 to $575? Is this just a strategy to get “new price” search hits?
No way anon I was right on the cusp of affordability and financial ruin at 579 but now that its at 575 its a clear winner!
I’ll say this–The 444 Belmont unit is more worth $725k than this is worth $575k. Not that either is worth their current asks.
anyone have mortgage info? I’m guessing the current homedebtors have $0 equity? I’m guessing 525K at the most.
According to one of my sources, the 2006 purchase was financed for only $250,000 with JPMORGAN CHASE BANK. I didn’t confirm this with ccrd records.
This place seriously looks like a greystone my friend used to rent for $400 a month (shared with two other people.) but with nicer staged furniture in here.
We shouldn’t interpret this as prices declining in Lincoln Park. The sellers just failed to buy smart. 🙂
Gary:
“what were they thinking” is a fair question, tho.
I used to live directly across the street from this place. Although the block is nice, if you try to drive anywhere from that block, with it exiting out to Fullerton, you get really logjammed in horrendous traffic. Also, that one bathroom looks kinda frightening, and the price is way out of line. You can get much more for your $, IMHO.
That is right, Gary. After all listings like this should not distract us from the fact that RE in Lincoln Park always goes up. If you don’t believe me ask Steve Heitman.
Gary – You are cute with your comments. With your “Discount Realty Company” perspective, do you think paying $380 per sq ft for a narrow and small 3 bed with out door parking was a smart move even at the peak? The property is located in a bad school district on the northern edge of Lincoln Park. Anything north of Fullerton should be sold at Lakeview pricing.
The guy who owns it is a CFO and put down a 60% down payment. Does he care that he is going to lose $70k on th epurchase? Not likely? Where would he be if he rented and left his hard earned $350k in equities?
I will be the first to admit that pricing is finally coming down in Lincoln Park. I now expect to see pricing in the 1st half of 2009 at 5 – 10% below 2006 pricing. Depressing but not the end of the world.
Again, I would like to see the post where I ever claimed Lincoln Park only goes up. I think my constant phrase has always been that LP is more stable than other areas. I hate being right all the time.
The SHill says, “I will be the first to admit that pricing is finally coming down in Lincoln Park.”
The first?
The SHill concludes, “I hate being right all the time.”
LMAO.
If it is “not likely” this CFO cares about losing $70K, how does one conclude the $350K was “hard earned?”
Steve,
I had two objectives in making my comment. One was to bait you and the other was to get you to recognize me as cute. Now I am satisfied. Seriously though, I do value your perspective but enjoy the banter.
In response to your valid comment…it’s really hard looking back now to know if anyone overpaid or not given the market at that time. My perspective is that almost everyone overpaid. The data continue to pile up that just about everything that is selling now that was bought in the last 3 years in even the best neighborhoods is selling at a loss.
Steve, you used to say, like a broken record, that buyers could count on 5% a year appreciation in a neighborhood as good at LP–*even* in the downturn, because LP was immune.
I’m still waiting for a link to a post of Steve’s saying anything people have purported him to say. Isn’t linking easier than fabricating quotes?
If I cared enough, I would bother.
I’m shocked that you can’t bother to back up your statements.
You must get shocked a lot around here.
The guy who owns it is a CFO and put down a 60% down payment. Does he care that he is going to lose $70k on th epurchase? Not likely? Where would he be if he rented and left his hard earned $350k in equities?
Excellent insight, Steve. Renters are so dumb with their money that they only know of one other option – equities. And when the markets fall, they’re stuck taking the loss. Might as well have bought a place and lost their money there.
I’m glad you’re starting to acknowledge that individuals overpaid for individual homes during the boom. Now, you need to extrapolate that out and recognize that the people who did not overpay are in the minority. I’m glad you are doing well in your real estate investments. Most people are not, and these are the people driving the market.
Who doesn’t care if they lose $70,000? The people I know ‘with money’ get pissed if they lose $70 dollars!
“Does he care that he is going to lose $70k on th epurchase? “
Again will pay anyone $1,000 if they can find a quote from that says “Lincoln Park allows appreciates at 5% per year”
I think the quote was “Lincoln Park Appreciated at 5% per year while other neighborhoods appreciated by 15%. This is why Lincoln Park has less to fall.”
Would anyone expect this owner not to lose some money? He purchased right before a housing slump and then is trying to sell at the height of the slump. Honestly, think about the situation this guy is in. He purchased (what I consider an over priced property, even at the top of the market) and now is selling into the slowest market in 30 years. The owner is just in a bad situation.
You don’t seem to have a hard time looking up your old comments and giving yourself a big ole pat on the back.
it appears the owner may keep it as an in-town and lives most of the time in mich.
http://chicago.blockshopper.com/news/181679-coupon-company-cfo-buys-on-burling
Does anyone really consider this unit a “Lincoln Park Vintage Beauty” other than Sabrina?
Let’s go back to econ 101. Housing should appreciate at the inflation rate plus or minus the change in the demand for a particular neighborhood. (this demand will be affected by changes in interest rates).
Anyone disagree with this statement?
I bet he used a sub prime mortgage and financed it at 110% of the purchase price.
You guys are all funny with your comments…
I guess I lied: I cared enough to google (“crib chatter” and “Heitman” and “Lincoln Park” and “continue” and “appreciate”) and click an older thread. Someone like homedelete might care enough to spend the time to search for more. But this one is pretty funny on its own:
http://cribchatter.com/?p=2823
Wow you nailed him!!!
Steven Heitman on June 22nd, 2008 at 4:37 pm
for the 10th time. There are spenty of properties in LP, LV, ect that will sell for less than they were purchased for. The condo conversion listed above is junk.
From the same thread “I will go back to the same argument I have always supported. LP did not appreciate like others hot areas of the city and will not feel the declines. Others here continue to say that LP is not immune and will come down in value. I simply disagree and my good friend Kevin helped me prove why. It’s a very desirable and stable area for young professionals, families, and the elderly. It will always be in high demand whether the market is booming or busting.
Thanks for your time…”
This was June of 2008 and was accurate at the time. If you go back to the thread I site supply vs demand and months on the market. See I use stats to support what I am saying. Just as I states several times that the 4th qrt was brutal and nothing is under contract. Seems accurate and again supporting with facts. I guess we will have to wait 5 years to see if I am right that LP will be stable and continue to appreciate with inflation.
I will not waste any of my short and precious time on this earth researching the shills previous posts. If I happen to come across a comment maybe I’ll repost it but I will not go out of my way to do so.
Also from the same thread:
“Steven Heitman on June 22nd, 2008 at 9:16 pm
[…]
“It doesn’t mean the upper end will escape the downdraft.” It also does not mean that people who buy quality properties in the best areas will not continue to see healthy appreciation rates of 3 – 5%. […]”
The phrasing gives Stevo all sorts of weasel room to say he wasn’t predicting that, just saying its possible. But that would be weaselly.
Also, I forgot to express my sympathy, Stevo, that your kids are so troubled that, altho you live in LP, they attend a CPS middle school.
Anon – Yes Anon, I don’t pretend to know what will happen in the future as you jokers do. I simply state what I see and back in June things were still rosey in old LP. Obviously the crash of the financial markets has now put a strain on all areas of the city. But as even Sabrina has admitted, if you are going to own, LP is the place to be.
Don’t feel bad for my kids Anon, they are both in the IB program which feeds 80% of their students to the top colleges in the world. Yes, better than the north shore…
Steve – i agree that Lincoln Park will continue to appreciate with inflation, over the long term, but near and medium term will not be pretty. Prices for many 2004-7 buyers have already declined, so we are looking at people who may have owned for 5 years who are having to sell at a loss. Unless you think prices will jump back up in the next two years, we will see many examples of people who bought in 2004 having to sell at a loss in 2011, seven years later.
Steve Heitman on January 14th, 2009 at 10:10 am
Anon – Yes Anon, I don’t pretend to know what will happen in the future as you jokers do.
“LP will never decline”
Well then, Stevo, you should have been more precise the first time. You said your kids go to CPS middle school–an entity that exists–when they are actually at a special program within a CPS elementary school. You’ll say there’s no substantive difference, but it’s akin to the difference b/t “a univeristy in Chicago” and “the University of Chicago”. Words have meaning, man, and you misused them.
Here’s a quote for you, Burt:
“Burt on August 28th, 2008 at 2:17 pm
What recession?”
http://cribchatter.com/?p=5060#comment-13063
Birds of a feather…
That exchange continued like this:
“Kevin (first) on August 28th, 2008 at 2:49 pm
“GDP, grew at a 3.3 percent annual rate”
That is the “real” growth rate. The nominal growth was 4.6%, which the BEA deflated by 1.2% to account for inflation.
Of course, the CPI is actually measuring inflation at 5.6% (yoy for July). If you like monthly CPI numbers, July was 0.8% (9.6% annualized) with a “core” inflation of 0.3% (3.6%).
To me, that sounds like real GDP growth was more like -1%.”
“Burt on August 28th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Obviously the BEA has no clue what they are doing and should listen to you.”
ROTFLMAO.
Kevin (first), where have you gone? Your excellent posts live on.
What about this one “from the same thread?”
“Steven Heitman on June 22nd, 2008 at 9:40 pm
I have been claiming all along that this area is very stable and continues to appreciate. Is there anything from your above post that contradicts this? LP Never appreciated like the Logan Squares and will not decline like the Logan Squares. I never said LP was the best place to invest. I said it was the best place to live if you want stability and continued appreciation. Investing in a property and finding a great area to live are 2 completely seperate things.”
“continues to appreciate” and “continued appreciation.” LMAO.
Looks like some sunlight finally crept in to G’s rental garden studio and woke him from his slumber. Good morning.
Burt,
Please disclose your investment positions on here. If they happen to be liquid and on an exchange I want to take the other side of your bets 😀
I know you would think that would be a good idea 🙂
I sold all of my equities in May. How did the opposite side of that work out?
Wow, Burt, you even missed that call on my wake-up time when my posts were the first of the day on this very thread.
Please, please, please respond to Bob.
Getting back to the original point of the posting…. This is actually a great condo. Gorgeous building located on a beautiful street. The one downside is there is no garage parking – just a slab out back. And the unit has a nice layout, a separate kitchen, great vintage vibe with all the comfort upgrades you would expect.
The kicker? Holy lord it is overpriced. I can’t imagine paying close to $600k for a 3bd/2ba. Especially one that is not enormous and has a pretty typical vintage layout.
The real estate agent told me this was the owners city unit… I can’t imagine it sells anytime soon.
I figured that was right before you went to bed after being up all night playing World of Warcraft.
You “figured.” That does explain it.
Congratulations on checking crib chatter first thing in the morning when you wake up. You must lead such a rich, fulfilling life.
Please feel free to spend more of your time digging up old comments of mine. This has been a real pleasant trip down memory lane.
Well, it sure was amusing to me. “What recession?” LMAO.
I’m glad I could help brighten up your otherwise sorry existence.
Excuse my brother, he’s quite a grump.
Any facts to support that new claim? Because, “I’m shocked that you can’t bother to back up your statements.”
I base the claim you live a sorry existence on the fact you posted at 6am.
Does that help?
He probably has a job to go to. What can be said about you?
I collect rent from morons like you.
“I collect rent from morons like you.”
I’d be concerned with them defaulting when they lose their jobs and selling the appliances before they move out. Morons don’t know any better and they just file chapter 7 after you get your default judgment.
Look out folks we got a junior Trump here. Probably has his panties in a bind since he can’t get a HELOC anymore to live off of.
Oh, I thought it was renters living free until they got evicted in foreclosed properties these days?
But I thought renting was what all the smart people did. If someone is smart enough to rent they couldn’t possibly lose their job.
I never thought to factor in vacancy. Thanks for helping me out.
The only reason you aren’t renting now is because you live in your mother’s basement.
Everyone knows the only way to make a living in real estate is by taking out HELOCs. I’m sure the guy you are renting from is really in the hurt locker too.
The only reason I’m renting right now is because I was smart enough to see this real estate bubble coming 3 years ago and waited. Now I may pick up a nice River North condo at a nice discount. (I actually submitted an offer yesterday)
“But I thought renting was what all the smart people did. If someone is smart enough to rent they couldn’t possibly lose their job.”
You’re the one who called your tenants morons, Burt. I was taking you at your word–I have no idea who you rent to. Beware the bbq pit in the bathtub.
Don’t you read this blog at all? Buying a place is the worst financial decision you can make! Go back and read all of HD and G’s posting before it is too late.
In all seriousness though, good luck on your offer. Despite what you read on here, there are a lot of great deals out there.
Nah they just like to rip on overpriced places. They believe that its a good time to buy if you get a good price. Which I’m trying to do. 15% less than 2006 price in River North isn’t bad right?
“Buying a place is the worst financial decision you can make!”
Do you have a link to me saying that? “Isn’t linking easier than fabricating quotes?”
I don’t see any quotes, do you?
Here is what a quote looks like.
“I am a sheep” – G
Just as there were no quotes attributed to the SHill when you failed miserably in his defense.
“Burt on January 14th, 2009 at 7:42 am
I’m still waiting for a link to a post of Steve’s saying anything people have purported him to say. Isn’t linking easier than fabricating quotes?”
I’ll get you the link first thing when I wake up tomorrow morning.
Sonies,
Just go in with your eyes open and understand that there is no “good deal” today that won’t be topped by a “better deal” tomorrow. As long as you are the type that can accept the continued decline and be happy, you will get no grief from me.
Wow, is this the best troll we can get these days? LMAO.
The rest of my crew couldn’t make it in because of the weather.
G on January 14th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
Sonies,
Just go in with your eyes open and understand that there is no “good deal” today that won’t be topped by a “better deal” tomorrow. As long as you are the type that can accept the continued decline and be happy, you will get no grief from me.
Everyone knows real estate only goes down!
Its a pretty frickin sweet place at a pretty good price for the area, I don’t think i’d have a problem selling it in 5-10 years if I needed to. And I can’t stand my shitty rental apartment anymore, I need to get out and live somewhere nice.
I think burt is really steve heitman, their language and “mannerisms” are the same.
“And I can’t stand my shitty rental apartment anymore, I need to get out and live somewhere nice.”
Amen brother. I’m in the same boat. I’ve saved and saved because there was no way I’d buy over the many years as the bubble inflated.
I have my 20% and 800+ credit score. Now I’m just nervous about timing.
Not sure about the mannerisms or language, but the baiting seems familiar.
Sonnies – “The only reason I’m renting right now is because I was smart enough to see this real estate bubble coming 3 years ago and waited. Now I may pick up a nice River North condo at a nice discount. (I actually submitted an offer yesterday)”
Which building? I would like to tell you today if you made a good move, or if you just made a terrible mistake. Are you a Kingsbury guy or a Dearbourn, Delaware, Wabash guy? There are big problems in some of the buildings over there. Be careful…
“Nah they just like to rip on overpriced places. They believe that its a good time to buy if you get a good price. Which I’m trying to do. 15% less than 2006 price in River North isn’t bad right?”
Sonnies, I don’t know you but 15% off is NOT A GOOD DEAL in most the river north buildings. There are many (345 Lasalle, 33 Delaware, 10 e Ontario, ect, ect) that are currently selling for 60% of their 2005 and 2006 prices. Over on Kingsbury it is a little more stable but right in the middle (600 north, 100 west) the buildings were grossly over priced. Tell me the address and I will tell you what the units are worth.
I really am a nice guy…
Steve H:
501 N CLINTON ST 2104,
330 W GRAND AVE 1806
720 W RANDOLPH 707
Estimate of actual worth?
Agreed Steve. I wouldn’t touch 345 N. Lasalle, 10 E. Ontario, 33 W. Ontario, 30 E. Huron, 600 N. Kingsbury or 653 N. Kingsbury no matter the price. Those are the buildings with major problems that come to mind. Some of the better buildings are 55 E. Erie, 25 E. Superior, 21 E. Huron, 520 W. huron and a few of the new buildings.
501 N Clinton – Nice building but not very walkable. Feels like the suburbs. $365k – $385k including parking. The unit rents for around $2,300 – $2,500 with parking. Comps show around $420k but I would not pay a penny over $385K with the parking space.
330 w Grand – $340k – $350k tops w/prk
720 w Randolph – $340k – $360k tops w/prk
“And I can’t stand my shitty rental apartment anymore, I need to get out and live somewhere nice.”
So why don’t you rent a nicer place and wait it out? Renting does not have to mean living in the dump with milk crates for furniture.
Exactly Linda!
I only rent condos because the quality is so much better. Why buy it when you can rent it for so much cheaper?
I’m also agreeing with Steve on his assessment of the River North market. Some buildings are seeing 50% reductions due to massive numbers of foreclosures.
Other buildings aren’t selling because assessments have skyrocketed and are no longer attractive to lots of buyers.
It all depends on where you buy.
I love when Sabrina agrees with me 🙂
Sonies: Regarding your 1:39 p.m. post, stating the price was good and that you won’t have trouble selling in 5-10 years, my advice is to go for it IF you want to improve your quality of life. I am convinced that residential real estate is a mediocre investment, but can be a lifestyle boon. If you wait and wiat and wait, you could be dead or disabled by the time you are ready to buy. On the other hand, you are obviously not a “flipper”, and so if you need a place at what now is a fair price, going for it makes sense. In 5-10 years you may lose your shirt, but why obsess about that now. I am too looking for a “deal” on a 2-2 green zone condo, and don’t want to overpay, but if I find a place I love that is low priced for the market today, I will go for it, knowing the risk of it going lower — but having the place will (hopefully) be the reward.
“Which building? I would like to tell you today if you made a good move, or if you just made a terrible mistake. Are you a Kingsbury guy or a Dearbourn, Delaware, Wabash guy? There are big problems in some of the buildings over there. Be careful…”
Its a new building on Franklin. That’s all I’m going to say.
“I love when Sabrina agrees with me”
Steve: We should mark this day so we can remember this rare occasion. ha!
Sonies, don’t be impulsive. It will cloud your decision making abilites. I too want to buy but the time isn’t right due to factors totally beyond my control, primarily high pricing and a bad economy. Like G says, there will be better deals tomorrow. If you have the resources, security and the ability to not regret your decision and to never look back, then by all means buy. I’ve never once said not to buy, I’ve always said to buy within your means and be prudent in your decisions. I don’t think the market is at the point where most people can observe my advice but if your individual situation is different then forge ahead. I’m not waiting for the proverbial ‘bottom’ but I am waiting until the market makes sense for my individual situation, and my situation is profoundly better than the lot many people were given in life.
Sonies,
849 N. Franklin is a good building so far. Only one short sale (#805) listed out of 19 units. I hope you get your deal. Also, many of the floor plans have great views. Views always add huge value. The condo board seems to be doing well in this building which will also be valuable in the future.
Ok maybe my lot isn’t profoundly better than most peoples but it is significantly better. And I’m extremely thankful for the lot I’ve been given in life. I don’t see the point in putting it all at risk with the purchase of a small sfh at a price that stretches my budget.
849 N. Franklin
#401 1215 s.f. closed 11/05/08 $382,000 includes 1 parking space 2/2 west view $314 price per s.f. Paid $345,261
#1217 1335 s.f. closed 11/21/08 $427,000 includes 1 parking space 2/2 South East view (higher floor & more upgrades) $319 price per s.f. do not know the original sale price.
Hope this helps!!!!
It isnt that building Vb but thanks for the help. we have done much vetting on the place and we love it. The good thing is that i can be a real ball buster with the price due to market conditions.
Sonnies – Look to what the units rent for. You should be able to find comparables in your tier. Ask your realtor. Back into your monthly housing expense using an 80% loan to value and only using the interest at 5.5%. Add in the assessments and real estate taxes for a total monthly housing expense. Compare this to the rental rates and adjust the sales price until they are close to the same. That is your back of the napkin conservative valuation.
If your housing exp is more than you are over paying for this market.
Don’t forget to deduct vacancy and repair/reserve expenses. Also, discount current rents in order to reflect the declining rental market.
The market is certain to overshoot below the currently perceived “rental” value since the bubble deflation is happening during a nasty recession.
Doing a quick check There’s 3 studios attempting to rent in the building for 1075, 1100, 1150
And one 2br 1 ba for 1600
The place i’m looking at is a 2br/2ba and our monthly housing expense is looking to be about 2450 which includes AC and gas bill and doesn’t include tax savings, so it seems like a good deal to me.
Repairs/reserves are great, the building already has 500k in reserves in only 2 years of existance (it was finished in 06). I will double check the books if I can.
Hey G, I’m already using Stevo’s conservative valuation model and it’s showing that the Wayne townhouse is a screamin’ deal (~12% below value). I’m thinking about moving.
Of course, his model is an owner-occupant model, so you don’t really need to consider vacancy, and he will say that repairs, etc. are offset by the tax benefits which are both left out of the calculation b/c it’s supposed to be reasonable simple and a guide, rather than a complete picture (and he’s basically right about that).
Using your formula steve it should rent for 2100 (without parking) so add $200 for parking and its at $2300 a mo. We’re doing a FHA loan so with the added PMI and increased loan size it appears we are getting a deal.
Sonies,
15pct under 2006 new constrction pricing is definitely knife catching. How many current owners will be underwater with your new comp?
Like I said before, buy whatever you want but you are almost assured of seeing better deals in this building in the future. As long as you can live with that, good luck and enjoy.
Sonies:
You can’t use Stevo’s formula to calculate what it “should” rent for–you need to have actual rental values to calculate what it’s “worth”. Doing the reverse calculation just tells you what you’d need to rent it for in order to (mostly) cover carrying costs. You can figure out if it’s nuts if, say, the implied rent is $4000 for a 2/2, but w/o knowing (real, not fantasy, like on the Wayne TH) rental values, using Stevo’s formula is using a hammer to fix a leak–it might work, but your most likely going to cause yourself more trouble.
Steve H. Thanks. Disappointed about 501 N. Clinton because the views are beautiful. We do want to walk places, so that’s important. We’ll be in Chicago at the end of the month to take a look at some units.
I’ve written about this before, but there are those of us who are approaching buying in Chicago from a different perspective. We have already owned five homes in our thirty plus years of marriage, and we have benefited greatly, and still have a nice nest egg from our last sale in NoVA, from the real estate bubble beginning in the 1970s. As desteve noted yesterday, it’s about lifestyle. We are looking for a weekend place where we can enjoy everything that a large city has to offer, and we can invite all are relatives (individually, not collectively) to come into town and visit us. Overpaying isn’t as much concern to us as trying to out guess the market and not having enough years left to enjoy it all.
SteveA,
Interesting perspective. I just saw on techticker today they had a bearish economist saying we’re really at the end of a credit expansion cycle that began in 1982 and that many adults today don’t have a point of reference for living in a prolonged market slump. He said you’d have to go back to the 70s to experience this stalled economy/stalled market scenario. So if you recall back to your memories of the 1970s that seems where the economy is heading today.
For the record, borrowing money to buy a home in the early 1970s was a brilliant trade.
“For the record, borrowing money to buy a home in the early 1970s was a brilliant trade.”
And it’s just possible that we are now going to live through the “unwinding” of that trade.
anon(tfo),
Exactly. There aren’t enough generation Y & X’ers with enough money (or even overall) and desire for as much house to unload all of the housing inventory the baby boomers are currently sitting on at lofty valuations.
Sorry baby boomers looking to downgrade soon, your house isn’t worth what zillow, redfin, trulia, etc say it is. Its worth what someone else will pay for it.
Do empty nester baby boomers really need a 3,000sf house? Probably not. They’re in for a shocker when they need to sell.
SteveA, if overpaying isn’t a problem, then what are you waiting for? Prices will decline and bounce along the bottom for years. Spend some of your “hard-earned” bubble gains and enjoy.
The RE gains you attained over the last 30 years will not be repeated in your lifetime, nor your childrens’ (if you have any.)
Those gains came at a very high cost to everyone else, so overpaying some lucky seller could be considered good karma to balance the “unwinding” as noted by anon above.
Our initial down payment was $13,000 on a (poorly) renovated $50,000 row house in the NE portion of DC’s Capitol Hill in 1975. It was one block away from some of the worst of the 1968 riots. We were the first white folks to live on that block since 1949. The DC Metrorail has just started with about six stops. This is the only time we ever had any problems borrowing money. I suspect it was because the neighborhood was African-American.
We moved to two other houses in DC, making money on each. The third house we bought for $260,000 and sold for $310,000 a year later in 1988, after winning a zoning battle against a private school. In 1989 we moved to Fairfax County Virginia and bought down. Our house showed no appreciation for a decade, and then took off for reasons that I still don’t understand. Even in a declining market we sold the house in 2007 for well over twice what we paid for it, and along the way we probably pulled out $25,000 in refinancing. Meanwhile, the DC market went insane and there was no way we could have bought back in even if we had wanted to.
Now in our dotage (Warning–unconscionable bragging follows) we are collecting two Federal retirements, social security (me, based on being at full retirement age and current employment), and both have state government jobs (based on our Federal careers) in a part of the country much less expensive than DC with non-contributory retirement. We have a condo in one of the best small cities in the Midwest overlooking a downtown lake, lots of money in the bank, untouched IRAs, and my wife thinks I’m a genius. Not so. I just was able to ride over thirty years of ups and downs by being very lucky and pretty cautious. Not bad for a couple of student leftists.
So now we want to enjoy Chicago, and do not want to wait for the bottom of the market.
I agree with G about the costs, but we just rode the wave. We thought some of our buyers had more money than brains, but that was their problem.
What are we waiting for? We are looking. We have already seen 12 units and will visit 8 more in a couple of weeks, We want the best combination of view, size, location, building, and price. We do realize that we will not be able to get everything.
You can get everything you list….by renting. Then when you get a better feel for Chicago you can get a better price and still maintain the “genius.”
Steve A,
400 W. Ontario, 500 W. Superior & 520 W. Huron are all good buildings in River North. You should be able to buy a 2/2 with skyline views in these buildings for under $400,000. Good luck with your search.
Anon – Sonies:
You can’t use Stevo’s formula to calculate what it “should” rent for–you need to have actual rental values to calculate what it’s “worth”. Doing the reverse calculation just tells you what you’d need to rent it for in order to (mostly) cover carrying costs. You can figure out if it’s nuts if, say, the implied rent is $4000 for a 2/2, but w/o knowing (real, not fantasy, like on the Wayne TH) rental values, using Stevo’s formula is using a hammer to fix a leak–it might work, but your most likely going to cause yourself more trouble.
My formula was using rents and backing into what it should be worth. You really need to go back and take a simply 101 class before you post. You are not a smart person…
From the moron’s perspective “Don’t forget to deduct vacancy and repair/reserve expenses. Also, discount current rents in order to reflect the declining rental market.
The market is certain to overshoot below the currently perceived “rental” value since the bubble deflation is happening during a nasty recession.”
Thanks G! We are a little dubmer after reading your post…
Stevo: “My formula was using rents and backing into what it should be worth. ”
Maybe you should read before shooting your pixels off. I completely acknowledged that, and just pointed out that doing the reverse–using the purchase price and backing into rent–doesn’t really work. This is the *most* unpleasant part of your posting persona–attacking everyone who disagrees with you sometimes as stupid, whether they are actaully disagreeing with you or not.
He’s so unpleasant b/c he’s losing money in real estate. He probably hasn’t had a paycheck in like 12 months.
Like 90% of the general population could be considered stupid. I am just generalizing…
HD – My renters are still paying so cash flow is solid. Thanks guys 🙂
I’ll take that as an apology Stevo–your CC persona doesn’t seem like enough of a man to admit he was wrong.
It was an apology. That is as close as you will get so don;t get used to it…
So long as you don’t get used to me agreeing with you, done.
Who cares abouth the SHill’s insults? It’s not like he has gotten anything else right around here. Why would that be different?