Market Conditions: Is the Middle Class Being Priced Out of Chicago?
The Sun-Times took a look at the soaring single family home prices in the neighborhoods this week and wondered whether the middle class would be able to stay in Chicago and buy a home.
From the Sun-Times:
“It’s heartbreaking to an extent that even someone like myself is being priced out of the area as it relates to homeownership,” Bandera said. “We probably earn double the average salary for our household in the area and we would love to stay here, but it is becoming harder and harder to find a home within our price range.”
Bandera grew up on Chicago’s Northwest Side in Belmont Cragin, a neighborhood where, as in much of Chicago, the housing market is hot. Owning a home in the neighborhood she loves is, she fears, becoming a distant dream.
In June, the median list price of homes in Belmont Cragin was $360,000 — up 19% from June 2020, according to Realtor.com. But the median sale price in the neighborhood was even higher: $375,000, indicating people were willing to overpay to get the home they want.
To stay within their family’s budget, Bandera said she hopes to spend about $250,000 on a home. They could manage $300,000 — but it would be tight.
The hottest neighborhoods in Chicago in 2020-2021 haven’t been in the GreenZone. They have been in the south and west side neighborhoods.
This Institute for Housing Studies is for the 4th Quarter. It’s likely prices are even hotter in 2021.
The Institute for Housing Studies also monitors housing affordability. Its Cook County House Price Index measures the quarterly prices of single-family homes.
The report groups neighboring communities and suburbs into 33 submarket categories to see how prices are fluctuating. The latest report, issued in April, compared the fourth quarter of 2020 with the same period in 2019. It found the biggest annual price increases occurred on the South and West sides.
Despite having the bulk of the city’s new construction permits, the North Side’s annual single-family prices either remained flat or even decreased.
According to that index, the areas with the largest increase in single-family sale prices in that time frame were in the submarkets of Englewood/Greater Grand Crossing (23.7%), Humboldt Park/Garfield Park (20.1%) and Auburn Gresham/Chatham (17.3%).
Even with the lowest mortgage rates in history, a $300,000 or $350,000 home is still out of reach for many in the middle class.
Is the era of the $100,000 to $200,000 Chicago bungalow over forever?
Or can new homes be built to address this market?
Longtime Chicagoans fear hot housing market could drive them out [Chicago Sun-Times, by Manny Ramos, August 11, 2021]
“can new homes be built to address this market?”
as SFH? No. You’re not building a 1500 sf SFH for $120k, excluding land and soft costs, in Chicago.
The Skender ‘house factory’ was supposedly reducing costs for 3 unit condo buildings to $300k per unit–at about 1500 sf. That was absurd, too, but indicative of what’s possible.
You have got to be kidding me. Priced out of Chicago? If anything Chicago is (and remains) under-valued for a city of its magnitude. Pension deficits, crime, taxes, a whole set of reasons I suppose. Regardless, whoever wrote this needs to visit Seattle, Boston, Atlanta, Phoenix, LA, NY… sheesh, anywhere. Then come home and complain how priced out they are. And what the hell ever happened to starter homes? Or does everyone have to take their first step into the market with granite, 4BRs, in their first choice status neighborhood? If they’re feeling priced out of what they feel they’re entitled to, my reco would be to move to third tier (and perfectly nice) towns like Grand Rapids, Des Moines, etc. Just don’t expect to be in a big city, the sun belt or coastal. (End of old guy rant and stick shaking.)
“whoever wrote this needs to visit … sheesh, anywhere”
Berwyn? Joliet?
The people being discussed are looking to spend about $1500-1750/month on PITI (because that’s affordable to them), and want their own 4 walls and roof. They aren’t cross-shopping other cities, they’re cross-shopping close in and far out Chicago ‘burbs, where they can find that. And that’s where most of them will move, not Seattle or Boston.
“Regardless, whoever wrote this needs to visit Seattle, Boston, Atlanta, Phoenix, LA, NY… sheesh, anywhere.”
He’s not talking about other cities though. Who cares that the middle class can’t buy anything in LA? Obviously, they cannot. Has been true for years.
That’s meaningless to the couple in the article with 3 kids making under $90,000 and trying to buy in Belmont Cragin. She said $300,000 would be a “stretch” and she is correct. They shouldn’t be buying over $200,000, frankly. Even with the low rates.
A house isn’t worth that kind of financial stress.
There are some neighborhoods in Chicago where you can still get a SFH around $200,000 but not many.
All neighborhoods are up big in the last 18 months. The “deals” are gone. There is NO single family home inventory. Anywhere. Supply and demand will push up those prices.
But that means the middle class will be priced out.
Here’s a $300k Belmont-Cragin bungalow. Pretty much standard, basic bungalow, with a semi-separate basement unit (likely not legal rental, but still).
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/5219-W-Nelson-St-60641/home/13442257
Last sale was 1987, for $88k. Plus CPI, would be $210k now–which shows the fantasy of sub-$200k SFH being a real thing today.
But that near 50% increase over inflation–driven largely by the super low rates–is pinching the prudent potential buyers.
I see. And you are both correct, the point of the article was the middle class being “priced out” of the market(s) they want to live in. So what do people do when they can’t afford the home they want in the neighborhood they want? They look elsewhere. To the above posters point, yes – Berwyn. Joliet. Is this a new dynamic somehow?
No, they may not be able to afford the home in Belmont Cragin they want. But there are plenty of other options in Chicago that won’t “price them out” of the market. Whiners. This (just an example) may not be the dream, but it sure is a foot in the door – and it’s 4 walls and a roof.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Berwyn/1224-Grove-Ave-60402/home/13246823
“Is this a new dynamic somehow?”
Yes, this IS a new dynamic.
The woman in the article has lived in Belmont Cragin for 25 years and was never priced out before. Now she is because prices have surged 20% in one year.
That would normally be an anomaly, right? At least in Chicago, prices don’t normally soar 20% in a single year, even during the housing boom years.
“Last sale was 1987, for $88k. Plus CPI, would be $210k now–which shows the fantasy of sub-$200k SFH being a real thing today.”
In this neighborhood, yes. But in others, it’s not a “fantasy.”
the “middle class” doesn’t want to live in the neighborhoods with the actual affordable housing because they are typically crime infested dumps with unusable public schools. Who the hell wants to raise a family in that environment? So they go to the burbs where the value proposition is much higher.
“The woman in the article has lived in Belmont Cragin for 25 years and was never priced out before. Now she is because prices have surged 20% in one year.”
So let me understand. Does she rent now in BC? I assume – or are you saying she wasn’t priced out before because… she already owns property there? She wasn’t priced out before but she just didn’t feel like buying? It’s not making sense to me. Anyway, I’ll assume she’s been renting in the neighborhood for 25 years and now wants to buy. She can’t afford it. Is she supposed to be entitled to buy because she’s rented for 25 years? What am I missing?
One needs to define middle class. Also # of kids is going to affect where ones at
I dont think HHI of <$100K qualifies (Maybe LMC if you really want granular)
Sonies is right – Many peoples expectations of where they should live doesn't jive with the financial reality.
The issue wont be fixed in major cities, any solution would require an area to gentrify, and thats not going to fly. So the woman in the article will have to migrate out to the city.
We’ve all seen this movie before and it ends with a third of the block in pre-foreclosure and another third as short sales. The Fed is buying the mortgages for homes in neighborhoods such as this to the tune of $40,000,000,000 A MONTH. We are watching a train wreck happening in real time. Grab your popcorn and keep your powder dry.
“Anyway, I’ll assume she’s been renting in the neighborhood for 25 years and now wants to buy.”
Her parents own or owned a home and she is comparing the price they paid 25 years ago to what the prices are now and thinks she is entitled to live in a certain neighborhood within the city…..
“How were her parents able to do it decades ago, when they first bought a home in Belmont Cragin?”
I’m not sure I know anyone that’s been able to afford a home in the neighborhood or town they originally grew up in at 25/30 years old. Thus people rent and buy their first place in a different area.
Someone should show her a map as Elmwood Park and Hermosa are next door. She will be able to find something <$300K there.
“Her parents own or owned a home and she is comparing the price they paid 25 years ago to what the prices are now and thinks she is entitled to live in a certain neighborhood within the city…..”
You have NO idea WP. Just stop.
“We’ve all seen this movie before and it ends with a third of the block in pre-foreclosure and another third as short sales.”
It does?
What movie was that HD?
The movie where the credit scores are the highest in a generation and you actually have a background check on your income and have to have a job? That movie?
Oh- and record low inventory to push prices up even higher?
Bears will be wrong on housing for another decade, I see.
“the “middle class” doesn’t want to live in the neighborhoods with the actual affordable housing because they are typically crime infested dumps with unusable public schools. Who the hell wants to raise a family in that environment? So they go to the burbs where the value proposition is much higher.”
Did you read the post?
Home values up double digits in neighborhoods like Englewood sonies.
And, according to Crain’s, neighborhood with the biggest gains is Chatham, which isn’t a “crime infested dump.” The schools haven’t been an issue for Chicago home buyers in years.
Speaking of which, Chicago actually added population in the 2020 census and remains the 3rd largest city in America. Everyone assumed Houston would surpass us in this census but it didn’t happen.
Most cities across the country actually gained population in the last decade as the era of the city came into its own. Millennials love city living, and GenZ does too. I expect this trend to continue even with working-from-home options.
Chicago’s hot real estate market every month this year even after the vaccine rolled out is another sign that the cities are as hot as ever.
“The schools haven’t been an issue for Chicago home buyers in years.”
The political party called the Chicago Teachers Union has changed it back into something parents/Chicago home buyers have to think about unless they have private school money.
“The political party called the Chicago Teachers Union has changed it back into something parents/Chicago home buyers have to think about unless they have private school money.”
Or are connected
“We’ve all seen this movie before and it ends with a third of the block in pre-foreclosure and another third as short sales. The Fed is buying the mortgages for homes in neighborhoods such as this to the tune of $40,000,000,000 A MONTH. We are watching a train wreck happening in real time. Grab your popcorn and keep your powder dry.”
Jerome Powell will keep the ponzi game going as long as he can, which is until inflation kicks in. Inflation is kicking in.
People Jerome Powell’s age won’t be able to continue to screw over younger generations with excess debt and Jerome Powell won’t be able to keep screwing over his generational peers who live off of savings and fixed income forever.
I truly cannot fathom what has happened to America the past 16 years or so with the student loan burden booming, the fed creating seven trillion dollars and the Debt-to-GDP ratio exploding. This has to end and it MUST end at some point before we’re Venezuela.
“The political party called the Chicago Teachers Union has changed it back into something parents/Chicago home buyers have to think about unless they have private school money.”
Ba ha ha ha.
You CLEARLY don’t have children, WP.
That’s laughable.
Chicago has some of the best schools in the state, if not the country. And many of the second in line schools rock too. I urge you to look around at what is going on.
Ba ha ha ha.
More gaslighting from people with NO clue.
Others have already said it above but her problem is the way she’s thinking about her situation. She states it at the end of the article ““Our goal is to stay here because this is all we know and this is where all our family is at,”
I know this is a common perspective but the financially successful people I know don’t think like this. They go to where the opportunies are. I haven’t lived near family since I was in my early 20s. My kids don’t live near family either.
I know of a few exceptions but that has to do with people that have a lot of flexibility in their job and they have aging parents or they have some unique family situation that requires the support of other family members.
“ I haven’t lived near family since I was in my early 20s. My kids don’t live near family either.”
Facebook helps you keep in touch while you stay estranged from your blood relatives!
“I know this is a common perspective but the financially successful people I know don’t think like this. They go to where the opportunies are. I haven’t lived near family since I was in my early 20s. My kids don’t live near family either.”
Yeah just dump your elderly parents off on the other siblings or in a nursing home.
Gary I see a lot of mental problems in the cohort a little ahead of mine whose parents get to that age, it’s usually people in their 50s/parents in their 80s. By that age its quite apparent to our opportunity seekers that the world is not their oyster afterall and is not full of boundless opportunity.
Maybe in your world you expect the government to take care of them with our fraudulent non-funded inter-generational wealth transfer programs but this is an artificial outlook on life that has only been shoved down society’s throat the past 80 years or so.
It used to be a woman had to choose a good provider to procreate with or there would be consequences and also that parents had to be good parents so that their children would take care of them later in life. The “Great Society” tried to transform society to take familial responsibilities out of the picture and it’s been an unmitigated disaster.
“Yeah just dump your elderly parents off on the other siblings or in a nursing home.”
1) Go back and reread what I wrote. I carved out an exception for the aging parents situation.
2) The couple in the article are not old enought to have “aging parents”
3) When my parents were in that situation, yes my siblings were in Dallas to deal with the hands on stuff but I flew back as necessary to deal with stuff and I did a ton of legwork on the phone. I also managed all the financial matters and I was on the phone with doctors and nursing staff at the nursing home. In fact, I often was able to alert the nursing staff that my mother had an infection just by talking to her on the phone. (Yeah, probably one of the best nursing homes in Dallas but I had to alert them.)
4) There comes a point where a nursing home is the only option
5) We are faced with a similar situation now with my mother in law when we move. Either my wife will fly back to Chicago frequently or we will move my mother in law.
“Chicago has some of the best schools in the state, if not the country. And many of the second in line schools rock too. I urge you to look around at what is going on.”
Are we talking public, private, or charter?
We aren’t entitled to live anywhere we please. I would like to live someplace else, but feel like I’m priced out of single family homes for a variety of reasons. I understand people’s frustrations, but in our society you don’t just get to demand to live anywhere you want. It’s depressing, but this is life and there’s nothing we can do about it except to try to find a higher paying job.
“I’m not sure I know anyone that’s been able to afford a home in the neighborhood or town they originally grew up in at 25/30 years old.”
I could have. Had less than zero interest in that, but could have.
“Are we talking public, private, or charter?”
The Chicago public schools have some of the best high schools in the state and the country.
“The Chicago public schools have some of the best high schools in the state and the country.”
AND some of the worst!
“Chicago Public Schools, the largest district in the state, also has the most schools in the lowest performing category. The city is home to 95 of the state’s 205 worst schools.”
https://www.rrstar.com/news/20181221/states-worst-schools-challenge-large-illinois-districts-to-change
Chicago has ~15% of the schools in the state, and ~45% of the worst ~5%, so about 3x more than expected.
“The Chicago public schools have some of the best high schools in the state and the country”
If you’re lucky or connected
“Chicago has ~15% of the schools in the state, and ~45% of the worst ~5%, so about 3x more than expected.”
The poors & minorities dont matter to Sabrina
“The Chicago public schools have some of the best high schools in the state and the country.”
yet enrollment is down 15% from 2013….
From USA Today’s National Public High School 2021 rankings. Here are the CPS schools in the top 500
– Payton (#4)
– Northside (#26)
– Jones (#57)
– Young (#70)
– Lane Tech (#79)
– Hancock (#238)
– Brooks (#351)
– Lindblom (#406)
– Phoenix (#472)
I think the majority if not all of these are selective enrollment magnet schools.
Good luck getting in. When you don’t you can learn how great CPS really is.
https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/search?state-urlname=illinois&ranked=true
“Good luck getting in. When you don’t you can learn how great CPS really is.”
Lol.
My kids actually WENT to CPS, did yours WP?
You have NO clue what you are even talking about.
You do know that a lot of kids, and their parents, actually prefer the non-magnet schools now, right? Not because their kids can’t get in, but because those magnet schools just aren’t a good match for some kids who have other interests outside of school work (drama, sports, creative pursuits.) Plenty of other non-magnet high schools which are excellent educations.
Harvard isn’t a good match for many kids and neither is Payton.
Again, the schools are NOT the issue in Chicago anymore. Please move on.
“Chicago has ~15% of the schools in the state, and ~45% of the worst ~5%, so about 3x more than expected.”
Chicago has some excellent schools, some good and some still not-so-good. It is NOT the CPS of 20 or 30 years ago.
You all are stuck in an old person’s time warp. For real.
Additionally, it’s the third largest school district in the country, I believe. If you took a comparable sized suburban districts and lumped them all together, you would also get a cross section of quality. Heck, in some suburbs with 2 high schools, one is often “better” than the other one.
Again, unless you’ve experienced CPS yourself, then I don’t see how you can comment at all. Linking to US News rankings, which are done solely on test scores, really tells you almost nothing.
“ You do know that a lot of kids, and their parents, actually prefer the non-magnet schools now, right? Not because their kids can’t get in, but because those magnet schools just aren’t a good match for some kids who have other interests outside of school work (drama, sports, creative pursuits.) Plenty of other non-magnet high schools which are excellent educations.”
Because 0.0013% of students/parents would be better off not in a magnet school, nobody wants a magnet school education. A great test would be to have the top 5 be 100% minority and see the effects
Which Non- magnet schools offer an “excellent education”?
“Heck, in some suburbs with 2 high schools, one is often “better” than the other one.”
Sure Glenbard West is better than East, but East is decent. Bogan on the other hand…
Jenny said: “ We aren’t entitled to live anywhere we please.”
You are a closet Republican, I’ve suspected it all along. Expand your dating pool. Just accept who you are, we are way cooler than you think. Anon(tfo) is a closest Republican too, we can all have our cribchatter holiday party, Republicans only. It won’t be Woke but it will be fun! Edison park 2021, Nonno Pinos or zias for dinner and Emerald Isle after that! Still within city limits too!
“Which Non- magnet schools offer an “excellent education”?”
Lincoln Park High School, just to begin. Plenty of others.
“Lincoln Park High School, just to begin. Plenty of others.”
Plenty doesn’t = 1
“You all are stuck in an old person’s time warp.”
Someone just wants everyone to argue with her. And she’s trapped in a bubble.
Schools ARE an issue, for those who can’t afford above average housing costs.
“Plenty of others.”
Anyone who actually lives here, believes there are good neighborhood HS options, and pays attention can do better than naming just LPHS.
BTW, as LPHS sez on their own site ( https://www.lincolnparkhs.org/apps/pages/index.jsp?uREC_ID=922387&type=d&pREC_ID=1258877 ):
“The majority of our students are enrolled in one of our magnet programs and reside all over the city.”
So it doesn’t even actually count as “not-magnet”. Anyone who lives here and had kids who applied to CPS HS’s could have told you that. Having you kids go to CPS until 3d grade or something doesn’t give one true credibility.
“Anon(tfo) is a closest Republican too”
Now listen you …, quit calling me a crypto-Nazi or I’ll sock you in the goddamn face and you’ll stay plastered
anon(tfo),
After the ongoing debacle in afghanistan right, you should be ashamed to have ever been associated with, or voted for, or supported, Biden and the Democrat party. You no longer have any moral authority to say anything to anybody about anything.
But don’t worry, you’ll be welcome with the Republican party. We are a big tent! .
Buncha people with no knowledge of history. Did I need to leave in ‘queer’ to make the reference understandable?
“the Democrat party”
Well, if you insist on doing that…No, I don’t think that the nationalist-christianist party is for me.
“You no longer have any moral authority to say anything to anybody about anything.”
At least I once did, unlike you.
“So it doesn’t even actually count as “not-magnet”. Anyone who lives here and had kids who applied to CPS HS’s could have told you that. Having you kids go to CPS until 3d grade or something doesn’t give one true credibility.”
Just stop anon(tfo). You have no clue.
Yes- there are plenty of others. My kids didn’t go to them, okay? CPS is a HUGE system. I have friends whose kids went to Kenwood and they went to U of I just like the kids at Lane Tech. They got a perfectly fine education there.
It’s really all up to the kid at most high schools, anyway.
So, yeah, CPS is NOT the problem.
Move on suburbanites and Indiana residents.
“Schools ARE an issue, for those who can’t afford above average housing costs.”
No, they’re not. Not in the way you keep framing it. That all the Millennials are going to leave like it’s 1985 because of “the schools.”
Those are the GreenZone Millennials you are referring to, by the way. Because they’re the ones that have the option of leaving, right?
But that is bullshit. Hasn’t been happening for over a decade now.
Again, you’re all living in a time warp that isn’t the reality in the city today. Almost like saying the Sox still play at old Comiskey Park.
“Yes- there are plenty of others. My kids didn’t go to them, okay? CPS is a HUGE system. I have friends whose kids went to Kenwood and they went to U of I just like the kids at Lane Tech. They got a perfectly fine education there.”
I thought we we’re talking about an excellent education? A perfectly fine education isnt the same thing
See this is your MO. Make a totally outrageous, stupid and easily refuted false statement and then move the goal posts and hope no one notices
Have you no shame?
“Again, you’re all living in a time warp that isn’t the reality in the city today. Almost like saying the Sox still play at old Comiskey Park.”
You’re living in an alternate universe if you think a Sox fan gives a flying fuck what a Cub fan “thinks”.
“Lincoln Park High School, just to begin. Plenty of others.”
Ranked #12 CPS school and 34th in the State. Ranked #24 in the State for College Readiness.
Graduation Rate Rank: Tied for 419th in the State. Yes 419 in Illinois…. below the States median.
https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/illinois/districts/chicago-public-schools/lincoln-park-high-school-6591
“Linking to US News rankings, which are done solely on test scores, really tells you almost nothing.”
Huh? Let’s look at how they come up with these rankings. Per their FAQ’s:
– College Readiness (30%)
– College Curriculum Breadth (10%)
– Math and Reading Proficiency (20%)
– Math and Reading Performance (20%)
– Under-severed Student Population (10%)
– Graduation Rate (10%)
What are the data sources they use in calculating these scores:
“Statewide math and reading level assessment tests and high school graduation rates data used in the 2021 rankings in almost all cases is from the 2018-2019 school year. This data in most cases is from each state’s education agency website or directly from state education agencies.”
I guess the Illinois State Board of Education also should stop relying on testing scores and graduation rates…..
https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings
“Just stop anon(tfo). You have no clue.”
GTFO. How many of your kids went to CPS k-12?
“That all the Millennials are going to leave like it’s 1985 because of “the schools.””
I’m not framing shit like that; take back your BS, Sabrina–I’ve NEVER said that, in any way.
YOU are the one who deals in bizarre absolutes (like a couple commenters here, btw).
“Graduation Rate Rank: Tied for 419th”
Well, yes, the ~60% of the school that is “magnet” admissions (and *many* of the neighborhood kids go as “magnet” students) is pretty darn good. And the rest of it is pretty darn CPS-average.
“Well, yes, the ~60% of the school that is “magnet” admissions (and *many* of the neighborhood kids go as “magnet” students) is pretty darn good. And the rest of it is pretty darn CPS-average.”
Every school is “average”. Sorry. Some kid at Payton finishes last in their class there. Public schools have to take all kids. They don’t all graduate. They all don’t go to Harvard from the magnets. Not every kid wants or needs to go to the magnets. That’s where you guys are all messed up on this blog. But we’ve discussed this over and over and over again.
Your kid isn’t special! There- I said it. Your kid is likely “average” even if you’re rich and DID go to Harvard. It’s likely they’ll go to University of Illinois with thousands of others who don’t go to Payton.
Lol.
Get over yourself and your obsession. The rest of parents aren’t obsessed in this way. Every child is different. The “best” schools aren’t always the best fit for every kid.
Each of my kids is so different and has different school needs.
I’m not going to argue this with someone who has had NO experience with it.
And yes, my kids ended up at the University of Illinois. Hooray! They loved it.
“Ranked #12 CPS school and 34th in the State. Ranked #24 in the State for College Readiness.”
It’s a good school. Your child will have a good time there and be prepared for college.
“You’re living in an alternate universe if you think a Sox fan gives a flying fuck what a Cub fan “thinks”.”
Huh? Okay- I’ll give the other example: It’s like saying the Blackhawks still play in old Chicago Stadium.
That’s how out of touch most of you on this blog are about what is going on in Chicago, it’s neighborhoods, it’s real estate.
Sorry to be blunt.
You haven’t lived in Chicago in DECADES. You have no idea just because you come to town on a Saturday to visit the bean.
“I thought we we’re talking about an excellent education? A perfectly fine education isnt the same thing”
For most people on this blog, the point of high school is to prepare them for college, no?
CPS is fine. It does that just the same as the suburban schools.
The whole “Chicago public schools suck” thing is SO 1985. Truly. I beg of you. Get into this CENTURY. My god.
So sad.
We’ve had this “discussion” on this blog over and over and over again in the last 10 years. Meanwhile, thousands of CPS kids have graduated, gone to college, come home, got great jobs.
It’s not perfect. There are some schools that under perform. It’s the third biggest system in the nation. It’s a big ship to move.
But the fact remains the same: CPS was NOT a campaign issue in the campaign. The schools are greatly improved from 35 years ago. The city has attracted families. There is demand for single family homes all over the city. And that population is greater than all the private schools in the city, so all those kids are going to school somewhere.
Families are NOT moving to the suburbs like 1985.
Because it’s NOT 1985.
Time to move on.
“The whole “Chicago public schools suck” thing is SO 1985. Truly. I beg of you. Get into this CENTURY. My god.”
I would agree that it’s been better this century compared to the 80’s. However, with the passage of recent laws at the State level expanding collective bargaining back to where it was in the 80’s along with the CTU organizing to become a quazi political party in Chicago over the past 10 years the winds seem to be shifting that we will have 1980’s style strikes coming back.
A precursor to this is the 2019 strike and subsequently their negotiating style and rhetoric throughout Covid last year and this year.
“But the fact remains the same: CPS was NOT a campaign issue in the campaign.”
An elected school board was not a “campaign issue” in the 2019 mayoral race?
Rahm’s school closures were not a “campaign issue” that people wanted to know what Lori and Toni would do as there were/are plenty of schools with low enrollment. Resource allocation and staffing wasn’t a campaign issue with the CTU contract expiring in the fall of 2019?
LOL. It might not have been THE ISSUE but it was and is always one of the top issues in the mayoral race.
“Families are NOT moving to the suburbs like 1985.”
But are they starting to move to the suburbs more than they were previously? That is more complicated.
“Gamboa is one of many Chicago Public Schools parents who say they feel worn out by the fighting between Chicago Public Schools and the Chicago Teachers Union.
Some say the failure by school district and union leaders to work together is making them lose faith in the city’s public school system.”
“Parents like Dunn and Gamboa worry the district may be entering another era of regular strikes, like in the 1970s and 1980s when teachers walked nine times.”
https://www.wbez.org/stories/parents-say-the-feud-between-cps-and-the-teachers-union-is-pushing-families-away/67067d70-a23d-4d4f-aa5f-ce24627644c0
Guys we’re not going back to the 1980s. We’re going back to the 1970s so Saigon Joe can relive his formative years with all of the moral malaise and societal decline that that decade brought.
Ol’ Joe thinks the way to expand big government is to repeat the same practices of yesteryear until people just tune out but he will be mistaken. He is a giant turd whose destruction on the country is just now being seen.
“ Huh? Okay- I’ll give the other example: It’s like saying the Blackhawks still play in old Chicago Stadium.”
A real Chicagoan would refer to it as the Barn, but I’m sure you spent lots of time in the 300 level. As usual, you don’t know anything about Chicago.
Embarrassing
“A real Chicagoan would refer to it as the Barn,”
Huh?
I’ve never heard it referred to that. But then, you’re MUCH older than me. At least a generation. So that could be why.
Each generation has its own cultural markers.
Rock on from Indiana JohnnyU.
Memories…like the corner of my mind…
“Ol’ Joe thinks the way to expand big government is to repeat the same practices of yesteryear until people just tune out but he will be mistaken.”
Bob, I hate to tell you, but we’ve had “socialism” for about 80 years now.
“ I’ve never heard it referred to that. But then, you’re MUCH older than me. At least a generation. So that could be why.”
So you’ve been a Blackhawk fan since 2009. You being a millennial makes a lot of sense
“ Each generation has its own cultural markers.”
Enjoy your Avocado toast
You deleted my comment?
When you’ve been responding to me making up shit that I supposedly said here?
WHY??
“When you’ve been responding to me making up shit that I supposedly said here?”
I’ll delete any comment where people are using abusive language towards me. I’m sick of it.
Go verbally abuse someone you know.
“So you’ve been a Blackhawk fan since 2009.”
Huh?
United Center was built in the 1990s.
They won the Cup in 09-10
Do you even live in Chicago?
“They won the Cup in 09-10”
And?
What does that have to do with me calling Chicago Stadium, Chicago Stadium (which is what it was called)?
It was never called “The Barn” by anyone I knew. But maybe the older fans called it that? I don’t know.
“ What does that have to do with me calling Chicago Stadium, Chicago Stadium (which is what it was called)?”
It was called the Old Barn by fans and people who were from Chicago
“It was never called “The Barn” by anyone I knew. But maybe the older fans called it that? I don’t know.”
Not shocking. Bandwagon fans and millennials have no sense of history.
Keep being ignorant about the city and enjoy your avocado toast
“It was called the Old Barn by fans and people who were from Chicago”
Like I said, I’m sure older generations might have called it other things. It was a different scene in the 1950s and 60s.
It was later just the Madhouse on Madison and was really referred to as “the Stadium” or its full name “Chicago Stadium” by young fans.
Each generation has different cultural markers.
“I’ll delete any comment where people are using abusive language towards me. I’m sick of it.”
What did I write that was abusive?
Calling out your BS high horse nonsense about experience with CPS??
When you freely lie about others (me, in particular) on the topic?
The barn moniker for Chicago Stadium is a weird marker.
Are you more “Chicago” if you call it Soldier or Soldier’s Field?
If you call it Marshall Field or Marshall Fields?
If you think of Englewood as jewish or black?
Pilsen as bohemian or mexican?
Now, you want to rip on a Hawks ‘fan’ for knowing nothing about the team before Rocky died and they were on TV again, or Wrigley fans who don’t know anything about baseball, or Sox fans just because, or Bulls 30-year-plus season ticket holders hoping for the next MJ (he ain’t coming!), that’s all fine, but it’s not a test of Chicagoan-ness.
Now, you want to rip on a Hawks ‘fan’ for knowing nothing about the team before Rocky died and they were on TV again”
Think you mean $Bill
“or Wrigley fans who don’t know anything about baseball”
Lee Elia was right
“That’s all fine, but it’s not a test of Chicagoan-ness”
Disagree. Its a big part of the City culture.
“Think you mean $Bill”
Duh, before bill died/rocky took over–flipped my tense.
“Its a big part of the City culture.”
Says the guy living just outside of Muncie.
Sports are a big thing–but it’s college and pro and ancestral v. current. Not knowing thing X about Chicago team Y ain’t a good test *unless* someone claims to be a fan of that team. Then fire away.
Not fun when its YOU getting censored is it…
Sports are a big thing–but it’s college and pro and ancestral v. current. Not knowing thing X about Chicago team Y ain’t a good test *unless* someone claims to be a fan of that team. Then fire away.
Chicago isnt much of a College Sports town Yeah you’ve got your various university bars but there’s not much of a city team. Loyola’s run in the NCAA was probably bigger than anything NW.
Kinda like someone saying that its at least $100k for a pergola?
“there’s not much of a city team”
There’s not a city team at all. ND (and whoever is playing against them) is the closest thing.
“Not fun when its YOU getting censored”
Have I engaged with the comment deletion topic? I don’t think so, apart from noting I got deleted for using the second word of the title of the TV show about the adventures of the Clampetts of Beverly Hills.
Here, I suspect I know what the trigger was, but want to try to figure it out, so I’m not pulling it accidentally.
“There’s not a city team at all. ND (and whoever is playing against them) is the closest thing.”
I try and block out ND There fandom is much like Cub fans 90% are mouth breathing, window licking chuds
“I don’t think so, apart from noting I got deleted for using the second word of the title of the TV show about the adventures of the Clampetts of Beverly Hills.”
No you didn’t, you used a horribly racist and bigoted term, to slander a race of people based upon the color of their skin and their culture. HH would have been proud of your disgraceful comment.
Anon(tfo), Hate has no home here.
“HH would have been proud of your disgraceful comment.”
No he wouldn’t, he thinks they are the folks to be memorialize in song and show. And I don’t mean a bizarro minstrel show.
Anyway, my comment was deleted for using that word, and I’ve not used the word again here, as it clearly offends the sensibilities of our host. It is what it is. Dunno what the issue was on this one, tho.
From a 1958 Tribune series, as quoted in a NewCity article occasioned by the closing of “Sharon’s [h-slur] Heaven”
“Skid row dives, opium parlors, and assorted other dens of inequity collectively are as safe as a Sunday school picnic compared with the joints taken over by the clan’s fightin’, feudin’ southern [h-slur]s and their shootin’ cousins, who today constitute one of the most dangerous and lawless elements of Chicago’s fastest growing migrant population…. Authorities are reluctant to point a finger at any one segment of the population or nationality group, but they agree that the southern [h-slur] migrants, who have descended on Chicago like a plague of locusts in the last few years, have the lowest standard of living and moral code [if any] of all, the biggest capacity for liquor, and the most savage and vicious tactics when drunk, which is most of the time.”
https://www.newcity.com/2012/06/21/hillbilly-heaven-chicagos-other-migration-from-the-south/
Sabrina still thinks Chicago is “hip”. “Hip” as in a place with big government deep blue tendencies: women-centric, high taxes, bloated non-responsive government & regulations.
Except all of the problems from Chicago’s history of single party rule have already manifested themselves and few want to stay that are able to leave.
The younger generation that is as deluded as she is that is able to get out are getting out and they are fleeing en masse to the Austins and Nashville’s in flyover country.
These are basically completely emasculated men who are just used as sp3rm donors in their relationships with their woman being led around on a short leash by them for a better quality of life to Nashville & Austin to turn those areas into the same shitholes where it’s damn hard to raise a middle class family from the areas they fled from and the cycle repeats itself.
I look forward to Larry Elder being the next governor of California next month which will be a wake up call to the tuned out feelings-based voters who are easily manipulated by the mainstream media to continue the charade.
The entire leftist status quo regulatory state crumbles once people wake up that it doesn’t have to be this way.
“Except all of the problems from Chicago’s history of single party rule have already manifested themselves and few want to stay that are able to leave.”
Yet somehow you are living nearby Bob. And Helmethofer, allegedly, says he is too.
In this hell on earth that everyone wants to flee.
Why?
The country is a big place. Just move. My gosh. You only have one life. Austin awaits.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/austin-is-capital-of-homes-selling-at-super-premiums-11629279001?mod=searchresults_pos1&page=1
A homebuying frenzy is gripping much of the U.S., but Austin takes the prize for the biggest increase in homes selling well above the asking price.
Nearly 2,700 homes in the Texas capital have sold this year for $100,000 or more above their initial listing price, according to an analysis by Redfin Corp. that examined sales through Aug. 11. While a few other U.S. cities have had more properties sell at that premium to the asking price, none have experienced as big a percent rise in homes transacting at that lofty an increase, Redfin said.
“As a consumer, it seems scary to be in a housing market where the home you’re looking at [is] priced at $400,000, then, when you go to put in an offer, you realize the true price is $500,000,” Redfin chief economist Daryl Fairweather said.
“ Nearly 2,700 homes in the Texas capital have sold this year for $100,000 or more above their initial listing price, according to an analysis by Redfin Corp. that examined sales through Aug. 11”
Now that’s HAWT(tm)
We are looking at second homes in a rural area of Atlanta. Two properties in the community that sold just prior to Covid in Jan/Feb of 2020 are back on the market for $400k+ more than they closed for 1.5 years ago. As far as I can tell, no renovations or additional work done on the homes either. Ridiculous.
I guess people still think that they need to buy now or be priced out forever.
Prices here seem to be fairly stable. I’m not seeing many people “killing it” in Chicago proper. I wonder how much it has to do with property taxes. I was just reassessed up 20% for my small condo. I would really like a bigger space, but paying $10,000+ in property taxes is very unappealing. The city and state need to figure out a way to apply the covid money to fix the damn pensions.
I will stay here though because the city is liberal and we don’t have forest fires, hurricanes, a failing power grid, draught, etc.
Even car prices are way out of wack right now, I just sold my car for 5k less than I bought it for 5 years ago!!!!
Thats… Not normal for British cars
Try buying a pick up truck or sports car right now… lol good luck!
“a rural area of Atlanta”
??
Isn’t that just “Georgia”?
Anon, pretty much… but I wouldn’t call it truly rural. Far enough away from Atlanta to feel rural, but not quite Deliverance.
Prices on everything are out of whack. Inflation is rampant. Combination of too much money sloshing around and shortages.
Used car prices are starting to drop:
https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/used-car-price-drop-accelerating
A couple of months ago, I put the details on our car into one of those “how much is your vehicle worth” calculators and it was MORE than we paid for it (used) 3 years ago.
“The city and state need to figure out a way to apply the covid money to fix the damn pensions”
All of the covid money put into pensions wouldn’t make a real dent.
CPS pension deficit is about 2x annual budget
Chicago pension deficit (cops, fire, muni employees) is almost 3x annual budget
Illinois state pension deficit is over 3x annual budget (ex. medicaid, etc, passthru)
“Prices on everything are out of whack.”
Yup. Might consider a different house, but don’t want the capital risk at these valuations.
“A couple of months ago, I put the details on our car into one of those “how much is your vehicle worth” calculators and it was MORE than we paid for it (used) 3 years ago.”
Supply and demand. There aren’t enough used cars, but everyone wants one because they don’t want to take public transportation.
Additionally, new cars are impossible to get and now GM and Toyota (among others) are halting manufacturing due to the semiconductor shortage. If you buy “new” you probably can’t get it for months. Or maybe 2022.
There aren’t going to be deals on any autos for years until inventory stabilizes.
“I would really like a bigger space, but paying $10,000+ in property taxes is very unappealing.”
Look in Hyde Park/Kenwood Jenny. You can get a bigger space for less money in those neighborhoods so the property taxes aren’t that bad.
Otherwise, look further out in the suburbs and buy near a train station. I have a friend who just sold in Oak Park and is moving to Naperville. He’s cutting his taxes in half.
“Two properties in the community that sold just prior to Covid in Jan/Feb of 2020 are back on the market for $400k+ more than they closed for 1.5 years ago. As far as I can tell, no renovations or additional work done on the homes either. Ridiculous.”
Supply and demand. If you can work from “anywhere” there’s no need to be in city centers. Thousands of people moving to the hot Southeast cities all at the same time, including Millennials and Baby Boomers. Limited supply of houses/apartments.
Best to wait a few years until mortgage rates rise and the market cools.
used car prices probably aren’t dropping much till the chip shortage is sorted out https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58266794
and Russ is right, to much money chasing too few goods = inflation
but its mostly on interest rate sensitive things like housing and cars IMO
“its mostly on interest rate sensitive things like housing and cars IMO”
And anything with continuing supply chain issues. mainly (but not exclusively) chip-related. And, soon, anything where minimum wage labor was an over 10% component of the price.
“Look in Hyde Park/Kenwood Jenny. You can get a bigger space for less money in those neighborhoods so the property taxes aren’t that bad.”
I wish I could move there. It’s beautiful in that part of the city, but close friends all live north.
I’m tempted to make an offer on this place. It would just barely be in budget, but at least it’s under $500,000. Taxes will probably still be $10,000. The townhouses I’m considering are all $550,00+ though.
https://www.estately.com/listings/info/6588-n-waukesha-avenue–2
Is the county just re-assessing everyone 10%+? Everyone I know who’s being re-assessed is seeing at least a 10% increase in valuation. Will property taxes coincide exactly with the increased valuation? I thought it didn’t work exactly that way, but these new valuations are really jaw dropping.
“Taxes will probably still be $10,000.”
With the HO exemption, the 2020 bills (out now!) are about 2.125% of the Assessor’s Market Value–which does not always relate well to actual sales prices, or true FMV.
Reassessment is coming to the city for next year, so there is a good chance for a meaningful change from that percentage, and also everyone’s assessed values.
ON that particular house, why has it gone under contract 3 times, and fallen out? All in 4 months!
“Will property taxes coincide exactly with the increased valuation?”
No. Property taxes are driven by the budget. They basically divide the budget by the total of all assessed values to get the rate. If everyone’s valuations went up 20% nobody’s taxes would change – unless the budget changed.
“I’m tempted to make an offer on this place.”
Cute house Jenny. I love Edgebrook.