Million Dollar Penthouse 60% Off: 40 E. 9th in the South Loop
We chattered about reductions on the penthouses at the Burnham Park Plaza Condos at 40 E. 9th in the South Loop in July 2008.
At that time, this 2-bedroom penthouse duplex, Unit #1902, was on the market for $1.2 million after having sold for $1.1 million the year before.
It has since been reduced by 60%.
Is this a deal now?
See our prior chatter about the building and pictures here.
Harold Dawson at Sudler Sotheby’s has the listing. See all of the pictures here.
Unit #1902: 2 bedrooms, 2 baths, 2500 square feet, rooftop terrace, duplex
- Sold in April 2007 for $1.1 million
- Was listed in July 2008 for $1.2 million (parking included)
- Reduced multiple times
- Currently listed at $440,000 (parking included)
- Assessments of $541 a month
- Taxes of $2659
Very spacious for the price. Vetro lovers, how does this compare to the 3/2s that sold at the auction?
How did this place ever sell for $1.1 million? Is this an example of mortgage fraud or just reckless spending?
With those $540 assessments, this place still seems overpriced at $440,000. For what it’s worth, other two-bedroom, two-bathroom units are renting for about $2,000 with parking. I assume they’re smaller, but still…
Very roomy, but hum-ho finishes. They layout is a bit wierd. Also, if that’s the master bathroom, very disappointing it’s not a double bowl sink and a little bigger.
Jackpot – a top floor penthouse unit at 2500 sqft is worth 440K, quit being a complete idiot. I think a total moron paid for this, as it looks like they had approximately 990K worth of mortgage on it in 1997, 220K of that being a HELOC the day it closed. They are still on the note, so I’m guessing it is a terrible investment. HELLO! Have you seen the taxes at 2659? This is the top floor unit, and unless the floor is about to fall through, this is a steal. Sudler offering 2% commission? No wonder they’re struggling.
A little harsh, but your point is well taken. It isn’t very nice, but it is a lot of space for the money.
Sorry Jackpot – I havent had my coffee yet!
vs. Vetro, this unit appears MUCH more spacious than the Vetro, but Vetro has nicer finishes. For my dough if it had to be one or the other, I’d go with this one and gut it. 2500 square feet with an open floorplan and a largish outdoor space is a nice canvas to paint on. Even a hundred grand would go a long way in that space if you play your cards right.
No worries, Iron Fist.
I hadn’t had my coffee either, and my post was idiotic.
Cheap conversion of an old bldg with numerous distressed units.
Have the special assessments started?
This seems to be a trend in the South Loop. Over price your property by 80% and then make buyers think they are getting a deal by reducing the price 60%. If I was looking for a 7 figure property and my realtor showed me this place, I would be offended. Nice view, nice layout but the half-ass kitchen and bathroom are a joke.
There’s got to be a catch I just don’t know what it is.
Ok there’s the catch!
“#G on March 20th, 2009 at 7:35 am
Cheap conversion of an old bldg with numerous distressed units.
Have the special assessments started?”
I just looked at this place last week. This is a so so location with cheap finishes inside. There is no way this place was ever worth 1mm! $440,000 sounds like a good starting price for negotiations. The entire unit needs to be upgraded.
Catch? The banks lead the decline. Developers follow and the current FBs start to fold and create more REOs.
Lather, rinse, repeat.
Seems very reasonable and will probably sell for 421k, although the building must be a huge POS. Those taxes are super cheap, I wonder if they include the parking space taxes?
Sonies, $421? Why not $422?
Because I said so!
I’ve been in this building many times and its finishes, etc. are about average for the South Loop. There are definitely problems with the elevator, though: the last time I was there, only one was working and we waited maybe 15 minutes, including time crammed in the elevator, to move fifteen floors.
As I recall there used to be a common outdoor space built into the roof above these penthouse units. It was shut down after a crane collapse but that was years ago. Listening to hot tub voices from above could get annoying at some point.
I’m guessing from the photos that this unit may face northeast. If so, most of the city views have been blocked by 41 E 8th.
All that said, the pricing seems suspiciously cheap.
Ay caramba! That’s gotta be a nasty hangover for the original purchaser. I’m astounded that unit ever sold for 1.1.
The new price seems reasonable, taxes are fair and the finishes are easily changed. If you’ve got cash or can get financing, I suppose this may be something to consider.
Speaking of financing, anyone know where I can get a decent rate for an investment condo w/an LTV of 50%, 30 year fixed?
I’d also like to know how this place sold for $1.1MM considering it doesn’t even have dual vanities!?!
What do you need a decent rate for? Just sit tight and your cash will be all you need.
I am not sure I see where the 2500 square feet are. The listed room dimensions only add up to 1600 and from the pictures it’s clearly a roomy two bedroom, but 2500 sqft roomy? I don’t see 2500 sqft in those pictures, yet they would seem to show all the rooms. Maybe they are counting the outdoor space in the square footage?
G, does outdoor space count for tax assessment purposes? I’ve heard different things.
I think for 2500 sq/ft (if it really is) and the private roof top for 440K is a steal. Even if it needs upgrades, were else can you get this much space for the price? How can some of you guys say that you would pay 450K for a 2/2 1500 sq/ft condo in Lincoln Park, but think a 2/2 penthouse, two floor condo with a out door private roof deck that has partial lake views is nuts?
People – you are paying for a 2500 sqft place ON TOP of a building, who cares about the finishes? The building is not that bad, I lived in there in the early 90s when it was just converted from the old YMCA. I’m gonna buy this SOB, and have all of you over!
Im in Iron Fist!
I’d totally buy it too, if I had more money! And if it was actually 2500sqft, not including the deck, god that’s a lame realtor tactic!
K, the Assessor looks at the % ownership assigned to each unit as part of initially determining AV. So your ? is best answered as yes, but that it depends on the accuracy of the developer’s ownership distribution.
Additional improvements (new deck or other construction allowable under “rights” to roof, etc) would likely be caught by the AO’s review of bldg permits. That would likely be the case for that Vetro ultra-terrace.
Thanks, G. Very helpful.
The only way this is 2500 sf is to include the deck AND the parking space.
“The only way this is 2500 sf is to include the deck AND the parking space.”
Agreed. No way the unit is more than 2200, and I doubt it’s much more than 2000, even counting the 2 sqft per step.
Unless it has a 20 x 20 storage unit they forgot to mention.
My guess is the 2500 sqft includes the deck, and they have maybe double counted the kitchen. Just estimating from the pictures I would say it may be something more like 1800 sqft. In which case it prices at about $245/sqft. Compare that to the Vetro’s pricing of $230-$290/sqft and it may not really be such a great deal.
it may not be 2500 sqft and yes, it may be in the south loop, but i think this is a steal. if i only didnt have to pay for a mortgage already, i’d jump on this.
question, to the east of this building, google maps says that it is “east west university”. assuming that the university doesnt build a highrise, does that mean that the views are semi-protected?
Actually there is a parking lot just east of the building that was slated to have a giant condo tower built on it. Last I heard the project was canceled, but I would say that the views are definitely not protected.
Bunt,
Can’t answer your question directly, but if it helps I think the Ebony/JET building (maybe 10-12 floors tall) is the one that obstructs the views the most (although probably not so much from this floor) and that the building itself is not too much taller than its neighbors on Michigan Avenue.
Was in it – there is no way it is 2500sqft. It has an unobstructed view facing east, very nice lake view, museum campus, navy pier, decent terrace. The kitchen sucks, living area is OK, old carpet, Master is upstairs, almost like a dormer. Needs TLC, but is probably worth 440K. I am baffled someone would pay 1.1 for this, y’all must be crazy.
How many sqft do you think it is? 1500?
“How many sqft do you think it is? 1500?”
The listed room areas total over 1600. Add bathrooms and closets, it’s at least 1800 sqft.
someone who taught me appraisals said that her thumbnail approach to ballparking square footage was to take the total SF of the rooms and multiply by 1.3 to account for closets, interior walls, bathrooms, hallways, etc.
Using her method, and assuming the rooms actually total 1,600 SF, then the ballpark SF is 2,080 SF.
bubbleboi,
Not only is that totally stupid its downright fraudulent. Whatever happened to an appraiser getting out the measuring tape and actually coming up with an honest to god SF number? Am I not correct that it costs several hundred dollars for an appraisal? What exactly are they getting paid to do these days?
Bob, they go onto Zillow and print Ctrl+P.
What’s with the Malkovich windows?
“Not only is that totally stupid its downright fraudulent.”
C’mon, Bob, it’s a rule of thumb and a way to check BS claims of square footage. BB didn’t suggest that the appraiser used it as part of complete appraisals. You always want to have a quick method to check whether stated numbers are plausible or complete BS.
Like with this property: the listed rooms total exactly 1600, times 1.3 equals 2080 (as BB said). So the claim of 2500 sqft is nuts. Maybe the reality is it’s 2000 or 2175, doesn’t matter, b/c 2500 is clearly wrong, unless they forgot a room.
I lived in a 2br north facing unit in the building before the conversion. The building was older but I liked it. I would have continued to rent but I did decided not to purchase the unit (worried about special assessments related to building). When prices skyrocketed from 00-05, I kicked myself for not buying. Then I walked by it and saw that a building had gone up in the parking lot that had been to the immediate north of the building. The new buiding seemed about 20 ft from the unit I had rented. That made me laugh.
Iron Fist:
Where exactly is the terrace located? What is the exposure? I know it is private, but is there another terrace right next to it? Just trying to get my mind around it visually.
Also – how tall are the ceilings on both levels?
Any rumors of special assessments?
Thank you anon (tfo) for rising to my defense. I hadn’t realized that ballparking was such a difficult-to-comprehend term.
This person would never “ballpark” the square footage of properties she was appraisaling – she would just use it when she started looking at comps, etc.
Square footage estimates are a huge problem for appraisers. There are so many false numbers floating around. how can an appraiser, who can’t get in to measure every comp, possibly reach an accurate value if the comparable sale information is all inaccurate?
I took a look at this place over the weekend – the agent there said the place is now listed as 2000 sqft, but in my opinion it is probably closer to 1800 sqft. And not a very efficient 18000 sqft – there is fairly long hallway leading into the unit, which when combined with the entry space and the stairs probably eat up a couple hundred square feet. I also can’t see how the main room is 34×28 – the layout makes it possible to define the room several different ways, but I took some quick measurements of what I though was most representative of the actual usable square footage, and even including the kitchen it was only 24×28. Overall, I think the listing for this unit greatly misrepresents what it actually is. I looked at a couple 1400 sqft places the same day that seemed to me to have almost as much usable floor space as this unit did. Add in the fact that the place is a bit worn and it didn’t strike me as a particularly great deal.
On the up side it does have some nice views – east and south from the living room and the deck.
I can’t even begin to imagine how this place was ever sold for 1.1 million.
I’m beginning to think this 1.1 mil sell was for two units. If you look at the layout of the top floor, many of these units are connected, and I bet they took one large unit and made it into two(maybe 3). This place is a dump, and is grossly misrepresented, not to mention, it’s a Sudler listing offering only 2%cc, that’s shady right there.
Chucklehut:
The terrace faces due south, but you also have a bit of a North view. There are also terraces on the left and right of this unit. There was a special assessment for the heating and air in the building, but it’s been taken care of.
“I’m beginning to think this 1.1 mil sell was for two units. ”
Had the same thought; it isn’t the case. CCRD sez only one pin on the deed (directly from developer); 1st mtg for $770k; 2d mtg for $216,890. Both from WaMu. Buyer/borrower granted POA to (lawyer?), and appears to not have executed anything directly.
the space is still nice — the issue is that you can hear the el go by even when you’re that high up!
Ironfist: Thanks for the info!
I’d like to go by and have a look at the unit, but after everything I have read from those of you who have seen this place already, it seems to look better on paper and in the pictures.
Not to mention the realtor didn’t bother returning my email.
That’s not good for business. I mean, even if the place was under contract, you would think that a good realtor would see that as a lead for perhaps another property.