“Multiple Offer Situation” Sells for $31,500 Over the List: 440 N. Wabash in River North
We last chattered about this bank owned 2-bedroom at Plaza 440 at 440 N. Wabash in River North in July 2011.
See our prior chatter here.
Listed at just $236,000, which included parking, the listing said it was a “multiple offer situation”
Several of you argued that this was indeed a deal at $236,000 because you easily rent it out for over $2000 a month.
The unit sold at the end of August for $31,500 over the list- or $267,500.
If you recall, the unit had white carpeting along with white kitchen and bathrooms.
It did have amenities many buyers are looking for, however, including central air, in-unit washer/dryer and parking.
The building has a pool and a doorman.
Makeda Smith at Royal Service Realty Chicago Metro had the listing. You can still see the pictures here.
Unit #2509: 2 bedrooms, 2 baths, 1120 square feet
- Sold in January 2005 for $463,500 (included the parking)
- Lis pendens filed in December 2008
- No record that it is bank owned but the listing says: “This property is eligible for Freddie Mac First Look Initiative thru 08/04/11?
- Was listed in July 2011 for $236,000 (parking included)
- Sold in August 2011 for $267,500 (parking included)
- Assessments of $568 a month (includes heat, a/c, doorman, pool)
- Taxes of $3858
- Central Air
- Washer/Dryer in the unit
- Bedroom #1: 16×11
- Bedroom #2: 14×11
Not really sure why this is such a deal from an investment point of view (the other property featured today seems like a better INVESTMENT). However, if you are talking about someone’s personal residence or an in-town, this makes some sense (although I probably would rather rent a unit like this than buy it).
42% decline in value over 5.5 years. What an awful, awful mistake to have ever bought in this building. (Though as I’ve said before, it’s still a good place to rent. Not sure rents are even that much higher than they were 10 years ago …)
Sad,
Don’t fret – it is an excellent location and I’m sure you can rent it out to cover your costs. Just do that (if you decide to move) and believe me, in 10 years, the values will come back nicely.
Downtown rents are at the highest on record. At least according to Appraisal Research Counselors.
because nobody wants to own, so rental land lords can jack you on rent… people have to live somewhere
its all about the free market, eventually (a decade or two from now?) rents will get high enough to where buying makes financial sense again
Regarding rents, there are some realtors who send me (and I assume all Plaza 440 residents) postcards with recent listings, sales, and rentals for the building. The rental info includes the monthy rent. I don’t know where they get the rental info, but assuming it’s correct the rent for my particular unit has not really increased over the past 8 or 9 years — indeed, it probably would be less than what I paid on my lease in 2004. I do understand that rents are up generally, so not sure what the issue with Plaza 440 is. Maybe desperation by the owners.
Thus, in my case, if I were to rent out my unit now I’d probably be losing around $450 a month. Also, I’m skeptical that home values will increase much over the next decade or more (though Plaza 440 may actually do better than average if rents continue to increase).
“eventually (a decade or two from now?) rents will get high enough to where buying makes financial sense again”
It makes financial sense now.
Agree…that in many cases it makes financial sense to buy now. If at parity or close but not quite parity (more expensive to buy…usually b/c its nicer than a rental) then it makes sense to buy b/c: 1)hedge against rising rents; 2) tax breaks though I understand those could go away; 3) taking out a low interest rate mortgage is a hedge against inflation in general; 4) long-term (7-10) investment (so you need to buy someplace you will stay).
“It makes financial sense now.”
True, I doubt I would be able to find a place as nice for the same monthly nut, but also I can’t move… not that I want to move, but that has to be worth something, since if I see a deal in the future that I like, I won’t be able to buy it
“Thus, in my case, if I were to rent out my unit now I’d probably be losing around $450 a month.”
I can’t believe this – are you including your principal payment? I have looked extensively at this building and buying is actually cheaper than renting. Although I know that you may have paid more for your unit than it is worth today, the differences in prices still isn’t that great…
Sad, do you still like living there? I guess that’s the most important thing.
“I can’t believe this – are you including your principal payment?”
I am. Excluding it, I’d be at just about break even.
“I have looked extensively at this building and buying is actually cheaper than renting.”
That may very well be true for those buying here now, but I made the awful mistake of buying here in 2005 and so have a much higher mortgage than someone buying the same property in 2011.
“Although I know that you may have paid more for your unit than it is worth today, the differences in prices still isn’t that great.”
There’s about a 35 to 40% drop in prices from 2005 to now for Plaza 440, which I think most people would consider to be a great difference.
“I am. Excluding it, I’d be at just about break even.”
Well, you shouldn’t be including it. You are paying yourself with the principal payment.
“Well, you shouldn’t be including it. You are paying yourself with the principal payment.”
not if he’s lost 40% since he bought
really? given the large price declines in this building and with more declines to be expected, today’s principal payments are more akin to money being flushed down the toilet because it’s going towards equity which is no longer there….
“#chukdotcom on September 19th, 2011 at 11:45 am
“I am. Excluding it, I’d be at just about break even.”
Well, you shouldn’t be including it. You are paying yourself with the principal payment.”
“
“with more declines to be expected”
Really? By who?
“today’s principal payments are more akin to money being flushed down the toilet”
So, if you buy a place today, you think don’t think it will be worth the same in 30 years?
You people are funny. Clueless. But funny.
“You people are funny. Clueless. But funny.”
Pretty much.
HD –
How long does it take for a typical unit to be repossessed if you stop payment?
well then chuk snap them up!!! you’re the guy who let a REO deal fall though because you didn’t want to pay an extra few thousand bucks to the 2nd mortgage. Why let that stand in the way of $profit$? over 30 years who cares? i’m clueless, hahahaa!!
“chukdotcom on September 19th, 2011 at 12:14 pm
“with more declines to be expected”
Really? By who?
“today’s principal payments are more akin to money being flushed down the toilet”
So, if you buy a place today, you think don’t think it will be worth the same in 30 years?
You people are funny. Clueless. But funny.
#
Vlajos on September 19th, 2011 at 12:16 pm
“You people are funny. Clueless. But funny.”
Pretty much.
“well then chuk snap them up!!! you’re the guy who let a REO deal fall though because you didn’t want to pay an extra few thousand bucks to the 2nd mortgage.”
Sorry, it was a short sale. And I have something else under contract now.
Usually years. The average for a B of A loan is over 500 days from first missed payment to repossession in judicial states and we are a judicial state.
“#Clio on September 19th, 2011 at 12:28 pm
HD –
How long does it take for a typical unit to be repossessed if you stop payment?”
BofA is a disaster of a bank.
that’s a strawman argument. stand it up and knock him down, to prove a point which no one was arguing.
The question you SHOULD be asking is after 30 years of special assesessments, maintenance, vacancy, taxes on profits, whether you will be able to take away more than you put into it, and whether or not it beats inflation. It all depends.
“So, if you buy a place today, you think don’t think it will be worth the same in 30 years?
You people are funny. Clueless. But funny.”
“Usually years. The average for a B of A loan is over 500”
You mean “usually less than 1.5 years”.
“that’s a strawman argument. stand it up and knock him down, to prove a point which no one was arguing.”
Wrong. You are just don’t understand how to calculate.
“The question you SHOULD be asking is after 30 years of special assesessments, maintenance, vacancy, taxes on profits, whether you will be able to take away more than you put into it, and whether or not it beats inflation. It all depends.”
You are very confused.
what a nice day out… just perfect.
“given the large price declines in this building and with more declines to be expected”
Obviously I’m talking my book here, but because the declines in the building already have been so steep (35-40%+) and because the building will be supported by rental values, I don’t think value will decline much more from where they are now.
This thread is just a bunch of underwater owners saying it’s time to buy. Nothing new.
“This thread is just a bunch of underwater owners saying it’s time to buy. Nothing new.”
It’s not about whether its time to buy or not. It’s about how to calculate real estate returns. Good or bad.
“It’s about how to calculate real estate returns”
Too many other things.. “special assesessments, maintenance, vacancy” all fair… too much work.
““It’s about how to calculate real estate returns””
People were talkin ROA.. you decide to make it ROE… same diff anyway.
“People were talkin ROA.. you decide to make it ROE… same diff anyway.”
Not really when you are using OPM.
Thanks HD!!
Sad,
I know this goes against everything I have stated before, but…. why don’t you just stop paying your mortgage and stay there until they kick you out? You could save tens of thousands of dollars in the meantime and just rent for a few years before you buy again. Or better yet, take those tens of thousands of dollars and find an owner that will do seller financing.
“Not really when you are using OPM”
Won’t change ROA – just ROE (which is why everyone else was using ROA).
“I know this goes against everything I have stated before, but…. why don’t you just stop paying your mortgage and stay there until they kick you out? You could save tens of thousands of dollars in the meantime and just rent for a few years before you buy again. Or better yet, take those tens of thousands of dollars and find an owner that will do seller financing.”
My condo is small and so the mortgage is not too terrible, my current income and savings are high (though I assume nowhere near yours), I’m a libertarian who respects contracts I made, don’t really want to take the hit to my credit rating, don’t particularly want to move, really like the layout of my condo, like the location, etc. If I found another place I wanted to move to, then I might buy the hypothetical other place first and stop paying my mortgage on the Plaza 440 place, so that any credit rating hit happens after I lock in my other mortgage. Also, I briefly explored trying to do a short sale, and likely would investigate that option more thoroughly if I needed to sell the Plaza 440 place.
“Won’t change ROA”
No it won’t, but it’s not the “same diff”. If you are getting a return on OPM, it is not the same as you owning the entire asset.
“…..my current income and savings are high (though I assume nowhere near yours), I’m a libertarian who respects contracts I made, don’t really want to take the hit to my credit rating, don’t particularly want to move, really like the layout of my condo, like the location, etc…..”
uhhhh – so what’s the frickin’ problem?!!!! That is like a healthy 20 year old saying they are depressed because they are going to die one day.
“but it’s not the “same diff””
Risk adjust it. same-diff!
Sad you aren’t going anywhere. You might as well enjoy where you live afterall it’s YOU who bought it.
Its like when my friends make fun of my underpowered econobox car that gets great MPG. Yeah it’s no muscle car and driving ain’t fun (but is it ever really in Chicagoland)? And I could have bought something with more power and lesser MPG. But I know all this going into it and when I made the purchase.
You aren’t doing any sort of short sale. You’re staying the CONDO you BOUGHT and you’re gonna pay the mortgage. You are like Private Pile forced to eat the donut after caught with it while the other privates are punished for his misbehavior.
“Yeah it’s no muscle car and driving ain’t fun (but is it ever really in Chicagoland)?”
uhhhh – I have a blast!!!
“Its like when my friends make fun of my underpowered econobox car that gets great MPG. Yeah it’s no muscle car and driving ain’t fun (but is it ever really in Chicagoland)?”
Well, the same year I bought my condo I also bought a $70k sportscar that I still own, so I could go either way!
“uhhhh – so what’s the frickin’ problem?!!!! That is like a healthy 20 year old saying they are depressed because they are going to die one day.”
Problem is that my current condo will be a headache if I do decide to move. My original point was simply that rents in Plaza 440 have been surprisingly flat over the last several years.
“uhhhh – I have a blast!!!”
Yeah I’m sure you do in the Chicagoland stop and go traffic, with more stop of course. r do you mean the few times you pay through the nose for autocross and have to wait around for a few hours for a few measly minutes on the track?
Not many sportscars on the highways during rush hour. The corvette/370z is the rare exception. Most people that like cars and commute have functional luxury cars like IS250s and 335s because in real sportscars it would totally freaking suck.
“Well, the same year I bought my condo I also bought a $70k sportscar that I still own, so I could go either way!’
huh? what does a car have to do with being bisexual?
Clio.. Am I trippin, or are you suddenly human?
“what does a car have to do with being bisexual”
Bob, I love how you rationalize shit to yourself. I know so well how you yearn for a nice new MANLY S series every time you come off the red light, instead of that Prius with a flower in the cup holder.
ze-he’s a closet you know what so he has to rationalize everything gay he does
Just for the record, my comment to Bob had nothing to do with sexual orientation. I read Bob’s comment as saying that I was basically a risk-averse person, would pay off my debts, not move, etc. He backed this implication with how he could have a got a sports car but instead drives an econobox. My response was that I do in fact own a nice sports car, and so am not necessarily so risk averse as Bob might think. The “go either way” meant I either could be risk averse by continuing to pay down the debt or take the risks of a short sale or deed-in-lieu.
Whatever its faults, this building has an amazingly high “cool factor” for young (20s-30s) renters. They are enamored with the fact that this building shares health-club facilities (including a really nice pool) with the neighboring hotel, plus on the upper floors you do get a fantastic view of the city, especially at night.