Pre-War Vintage Beauties: 3800 N. Lake Shore Drive
We’ve been chattering about a lot of new construction concrete units lately. These vintage beauties at 3800 N. Lake Shore Drive in Lakeview are about as far away from that as you can get.
The building has 95 units and was built in 1927. It’s the standard type of layout for the period-with separate dining rooms and many have “maid quarters” off the kitchens.
This building has no pool but it does have parking. Washer/dryers appeared to be allowed in the unit and some of the units either have central air or spac pak.
Several of the listings refer to a special assessment but otherwise the assessments appear quite reasonable for a building of this era and for units of this size.
Why aren’t these selling?
Unit #14E is currently vacant (as you can see from the pictures below.) But I saw this unit at an open house TWO years ago when it was still fully furnished!
Unit #14E: 3 bedrooms, 2 baths, 2150 square feet
- Sold in January 2001 for $372,500
- Currently listed for $539,000
- Assessments of $1048 a month
- Taxes of $5794
- Listing doesn’t say it has a w/d but others in the building have one
- 2 car parking
- Original carved mantel
- Seller to pay special assessment
- Listing says central air
- @Properties has the listing
The listing for Unit #3G says it was renovated:
YOU MUST SEE THIS CLASSIC VINTAGE HOME WITH MODERN STYLE – 2BED/2 BATH-GRACIOUS, RENOVATED TURN-KEY RESIDENCE IN PRESTIGIOUS LSD BUILDING. TREE TOP VIEWS, WELL-PROPORTIONED ROOMS, COVE MOLDING DETAILS, RICH HERRINGBONE HDWD, LRG AMPLE CLOSETS AND STORAGE. NEWER KITCHEN WITH GRANITE,SS APPS. UPDATES INCL BOTH BATHS FULLY RENOVATED, NEW SPACE PAC 200AMP ELEC, WIRED FOR SOUND,W/D IN UNIT. PET-FRIENDLY!
Unit #3G: 2 bedrooms, 2 baths
- I couldn’t find a prior sales price
- It was recently reduced
- Currently listed for $524,900
- Assessments of $830 a month
- Taxes of $4145
- Has w/d in the unit
- 2 car parking included
- Prudential Preferred has the listing
assessments are still very high. hmmm.
new one went up today (for 1.1mill), one for 1mill, too. 5 total, out of 95 units — still not many at all.
gorgeous building, gorgeous windows, gorgeous views.
I think the building is rather ugly. Typical of buildings from this era: too massive for any sort of aesthetic appeal. Looks like someone tried to build a condo highrise in the shape of Ft. Sumpter.
Maybe the picture is just deceptive: looks like there could easily be 500 units in there vs. 100.
“I think the building is rather ugly. Typical of buildings from this era: too massive for any sort of aesthetic appeal. Looks like someone tried to build a condo highrise in the shape of Ft. Sumpter.”
Huh. Never thought I’d hear something like that. Does it change your thoughts to know that the building is U-shaped and not very deep? The parking is behind the building, surrounded on 3 sides by 3800. Look at an aerial and it doesn’t seem very massive, to me.
I wish the first place had herringbone floors. That’s my favorite feature of these old buildings on LSD. Alternatively, I’d love it if the second one hadn’t already been rehabbed and was around 400K. As much as I love these old places, I’m sure it’s a pain when friends with cars want to come visit…and I wonder how much owners typically wind up paying in special assessments over the course of five or ten years in buildings like this. I assume neither place has a lake view because I didn’t see it mentioned in either listing. Someone on here mentioned a while back that his/her friends who live on LSD can’t even open their windows because the car fumes are so bad…that certainly gives me pause, along with all the other usual reasons why old buildings on LSD are a bad investment.
This is a gorgeous building, but I can scarcely remember a time over the past 20 years when there wasn’t at least one special assessment. It seemed that it spent half the 90s having work done on the exterior. The building is well-known as a maintenance nightmare.
Most of the units have WB fireplaces.Working fireplaces may be charming, but they add steeply to maintenance AND insurance costs.
Given that a comparable unit (2 bed 2 bath 1600 sq ft) at 421 W Melrose, languished on the market for $349K for months until recently, the prices here seem out of line.
Almost all the units have a lake view. Only the units in the “annex”, which is really a separate, but attached, building on Grace St to the north of the main building, might not have lake views. The units in the main building all front on LSD, on the curve.
The unit with the herringbone floors is unique and looks, from the windows, like it is a unit in the “annex”, where the units have herringbone floors. The units in the main building all have wood plank floors.
You can have a fine herringbone parquet floor installed for about $25,000 or slightly more in one of these units. As an aside, I once dwelled in a grand old apt in another city that had flawless herringbone floors, which a DE-habber ripped out, if you can believe, to replace them with gray carpeting. There must be a Hall of Imfamy Award for a developer that would do this.
Believe me, I’d be totally capable of doing the opposite, of replacing a perfectly good plank floor with herringbone parquet if I could afford it after buying the place.
I could add that I believe that $350K is about right for the two bed, and $425K for the 3 bed.
@ Laura. We moved here acouple of years ago from Manhattan and are renting while we see how the market shakes out, but I have loved this building from afar since I first saw some units in the A line (?) on the market for $1m+ (with assessments in the $1700/mo. range) last year. The words “maintenance nightmare” make me think I should get over it. It reminds me of some of the lovely buildings on Central Park West. I take it you wouldn’t consider buying here even if the prices in the A line came down?
aren’t these coops? the monthly maintenance covering heat and taxes?
No- this building does not appear to be a co-op (like some of the others on LSD.) Or, if it is, taxes are NOT included in assessments.
Love the herringbone parquet,reminds me my high school and my old home back in far-far away country. But requires too much attention and special care, no way I would want it in my home now.
Ceilings don’t look very high, or this is just the way pictures were taken?
These units are definitely NOT co-ops.
I would never compare 421 melrose to this building. The units in the main part of this building (as opposed to the annex) are much grander than the Melrose units. The Melrose units do NOT have parking. The assessments in high rises are always high, but to have to pay such high assessments and NOT have parking is a deal killer for many many buyers, which is why the Melrose units are so cheap. You can get more than one spot and there is guest parking as well.
Furthermore, the lake views in the main part of the building vary widely. The A and B tiers are full lake views, and the C tier has decent views. By the time you get to D and especially E, the lake views are partial at best.
I have never heard that this building is maintenance nightmare, although they have a history of special assessments. In fact i’ve heard it’s in good shape as far as major building components including tuckpointing, roof, elevators, etc. I think many of the wood-burning fireplaces are no longer functional.
Just to be clear, i do not own a unit in this building (i have a friend who just bought here). But I would buy in this building in a nanosecond if i felt i was getting a good deal. It has a very strong sale record versus the other 1920’s buidligs in its immediate vicinity, which tend to be co-ops or lack parking (deal killers in both cases).
It has no doormen (which helps keep assessments low relative to other buildings as well). Window replacment or repair is the responsibility of unit owners, not the association.
I’d buy here for the right price, because I am contemplating the purchase of a smaller, far less expensive unit that is similar- except my target unit is in Edgewater and has half as much space.
But it is otherwise similar- a 1920s vintage Maintenance Imbroglio in a building that has lots of ongoing issues. I’m buying because these are the buildings that I love, and you’ll do a lot for love. Given that ownership always brings headaches, I am only interested in buying for love, because there really isn’t a lot of economic justification for buying a place I know I’m going to need to do $25K worth of work to walking in the door. But I don’t care, because I’m nuts about the place.
The assessments and ongoing maintenance,therefore, don’t need to stop you from buying, but you should count on always having a special assessment, and figure that into your monthly cost.
3800 has always been a coveted building despite it’s known problems, and you’ll enjoy living there IF you can truly afford it.
421 W Melrose is also a wonderful building, and the B unit I saw is massive. The B &C units are huge. The A & D units are much smaller. But, as one poster pointed out, it has no parking. Also, it doesn’t have the views 3800 has.
Ah Laura, you are such a romantic! Buying for love…. I see little birds tweeting…..
First of all, I want to clear up all of the misconceptions about 3800 Lake Shore Drive. Yes, it was built in the 1920’s, which is actually a PLUS, considering the amount of detail, architectural character, and quality of craftmanship that went into buildings of that era. It certainly trumps 90% of the new construction nightmares that so-called “developers” have erected in this city as of late. And, new buildings don’t safeguard you from design flaws, or special assessments, by the way.
The special assessments that have occurred at 3800 Lake Shore Drive were for remodeling all the lobbies, tuckpointing (which needs to be done to EVERY brick building), complete re-construction of the parking garage, parking lot, boiler room, new windows, life safety issues (which all high-rises will need to do,–they were PRO-ACTIVE in taking care of it sooner than later), as well as to build up the reserves.
The assessments are not out of line at all for a Lake Shore Building, and although there is no doorman, there is 24 hour valet parking, free guest parking, they wash your car once a week, an on-site engineer, on-site management (Mon-Fri), on-site receiving room where someone delivers your mail to your front door Mon-Sat, as well as someone who takes out your trash daily. It includes all your standard stuff like ext.maintence, snow removal, common insurance, etc, as well as cable tv, internet, water, and heat.
Each tier has its’ own private elevator, the “A” tier has 1 condo per floor, and the other tiers have only 2 condos per floor. The room sizes are very gracious, and the detailing of the units (if the owner hasn’t ruined them by trying to make it look like every other cookie-cutter condo on the market) is breathtaking.
The average market time for this building is higher than most because not everyone likes vintage, and not everyone can afford it(or appreciate it). It’s a shame that the average buyer would overlook buildings like this, to live in a typical 1400 sq.ft. new construction, “ss appl, granite countertops..blah blah blah” space that everyone else in Chicago has.
I saw 14E as well, and know that it had been rented up until the last 6 months. If you look at the history of the sales prices of units in this building, they more than hold their value, which says a lot.
As far as it being a “maintenance nightmare” that is simply untrue. If you are looking for a “maintenance free” building, why in the hell would you buy in a mid-high rise? The bigger the building, the higher the cost to maintain, PERIOD. I live in a building with 89 units, new construction, smaller sq.footage, parking garage, “luxury finishes”, etc for $500,000 and all the owners bitch about is how much everything costs to maintain. HELLO, and welcome to the wonderful world of ownership. If you can’t afford to pay to maintain a building, then RENT.
re: mezzgirl
The average market time for this building is higher than most because not everyone likes vintage, and not everyone can afford it(or appreciate it). It’s a shame that the average buyer would overlook buildings like this, to live in a typical 1400 sq.ft. new construction, “ss appl, granite countertops..blah blah blah” space that everyone else in Chicago has.
AGREED- The new buildings going up are architectural dissasters with their “juliet balconies,” plant shelves, and the same old granite and stainless noise. As with everything cheap and trendy, they’ll go out of favor as quickly as they were built.
I would much rather pay a little more for high style vintage than save a few bucks with plastic Pergo floors.
Note To Pre-War Owners (god love ya): Sponge painting the walls ala 1990-something and cheap, home depo’esque fixtures are an insult to Pre-War architecture.
Rejuvination Hardware or even Restoration Hardware are the appropriate solution.
Mike-
Thank God someone on here actually makes sense. A more neutral palette of colors would be preferred but, lighting fixtures and paint are all cosmetic things that can be easily fixed…and negotiated. (What developer puts high end fixtures in condos these days, without upcharging the buyer a ridiculous amount of money for them?) Those look like Crest Lighting fixtures, not Home Depot–believe me, I had the Home Depot fixtures in my new place, which I looked past, and ripped out immediately after moving in. (despite the fact that my place was brand new construction, & “luxury” finishes!!) The problem is there are very few buyers that have the capacity to look past cosmetic flaws and, unfortunately, there are a lot of agents that suffer from the same problem. I would rather re-paint a place and replace a few light fixtures, than buy something constucted cheaply, with no character whatsoever.
We placed a 500K off on 3G. The owner did not even counter. My husband fell in love with this unit in the Annex. Quiet, lovely, for sure. The ‘hood however is way out of the metromix and on a cloudy summer day I didn’t feel quite as safe as in other areas of Lakeview. The closets are a big gripe (petty though it may seem) as there is old, torn/ripped wall paper falling off the sides of each closet wall. The owner didn’t even take time to put handles or pulls on the kitchen cabinets and shelves. They are impossible to open. Odd. The windows are not new and need replacement. Huge expense. There were only 3 window scrreens on all those windows. Don’t know where the others might be. We were told “someone” would put up the storms prior to winter. Hmmmm. 900/mo. assessment now means an annual increase of about 10%. Guarantee. We have been living “it” for 8 years. Specials. You bet. No question. Found a lovely unit on Aldine and can’t wait to get out of the money pit! P.S. The Unit owner is being transferred and currently commuting to LAX. Don’t think he’ll hold out much longer.
wait, you made an offer for $500K on something that is only listed at $524K, and he didn’t even counter? Wha? Or did you place it when it was listed higher? (And if so, how much higher?)
If you are serious about the unit, get a bid on replacing the windows before you buy. A friend who lived there said that due to building regulations on appearance of windows, and fire regulations for windows that were by a fire escape, replacing the windows on a larger unit costs tens of thousands of dollars since every window has to be custom made and, in some cases, fire resistant.
Margo- I’m with kenworthey. You made an offer only $24k under asking and the seller didn’t even counter?
In this market?
Wow.
Hi Guys ‘Tis I Again,
What can I say…the husbandman loved the place hence the 500k bid. The only requirements were that the Bose surroundsound speakers remain. Oh and the W/D in the closet. I guess that was a gift for me…LOL. What can I tell you but I’m in love with a caveman. No metros here! Again, we placed our bid at the current listing price. Alas and alack…no counter made he.
And so I see, just today, that my man’s favorite Unit 3G has been reduced to 509K. This after having opened at 574,900. This after our having offerred 500K, no financing needed, ASAP close which was never countered. Any lessons here?
I cannot understand why a seller would not counter all offers in this market! Good luck to the seller.
To add to what a couple of respondents have said–I just saw this unit. No lake views and a number of north-facing ones so there’s little direct sun, but so many windows that it feels light. Fireplace is gorgeous. Rooms v. spacious, around kitchen there are a bunch of cut up little spaces which could be renovated. Other than that, a lot of cosmetic work because it’s decorated c. 1980s cheesy, but around the kitchen seemed the only place where you would need an architect. And kitchen itself was livable. Building was, in my opinion, tacky compared to others I’ve seen–really off putting. Seller seems VERY motivated.
I love this building and I have looked at a unit on the market. The only negative I can say is that there is no need to make a unit what it is not. If you have a 2 bedroom and a tiny room big enough for a closet you need not put it on the market as a 3 bedroom. But everything else is great about the building. Looking for an older, with charm, big living areas and sleeping area. The view is important. I am waiting now for a unit to come on the market that has more of a front view. This build is a charm. The assessments are high and what you get for it ,,,well. But it is a great building and I can not wait for the right one to come on the market. LOve it, Love it, LOve it