Rehabbing a 4-Bedroom Vintage Brick Bungalow in Jefferson Park: 4879 N. Mason
This rehabbed 4-bedroom vintage brick bungalow at 4879 N. Mason in Jefferson Park came back on the market in July 2011.
It had been bank owned the summer before.
Built in 1922, the bungalow has been completely rehabbed from a 5-bedroom home into a 4-bedroom home with a finished basement.
The second story, which previously had only been the master bedroom, was raised and now houses not only the master bedroom but a complete “spa master suite” alongside 2 other bedrooms.
There is new electric, plumbing and HVAC.
The house now has 2 air conditioning units and 2 furnaces.
The walkout basement is completely finished.
The kitchen has cherry cabinets, granite counter tops and stainless steel appliances.
Built on a 30×125 lot, it has a 2 car garage.
Listed in mid-July for $439,000 it has been reduced $39,100 to $399,900.
Can a Jefferson Park rehab command a $400,000 price tag?
Regina Faktorovich at Century 21 M.B. Real Estate has the listing. See the pictures here.
You can also see a YouTube video of the property here.
I couldn’t find any pictures of the property’s interior from the bank owned listing- or “pre”-rehab.
4879 N. Mason: 4 bedrooms, 3 baths, about 3000 square feet, 2 car garage
- Sold in January 1993 for $152,500
- Sold in June 2000 for $236,000
- Lis pendens foreclosure filed in December 2009
- Bank owned in May 2010
- Sold in July 2010 for $135,000
- Originally listed in July 2011 for $439,000
- Reduced
- Currently listed for $399,900
- Taxes of $3637
- Central Air
- Bedroom #1: 19×14 (second floor)
- Bedroom #2: 15×11 (second floor)
- Bedroom #3: 10×10 (second floor)
- Bedroom #4: 16×9 (main floor)
- Family room: 26×54 (walk out basement)
Surprisingly bright for a bungalow. I don’t usually like this style of house, but this one was done well. I’m not familiar with this area, so I have no idea if the price is right or not.
Well, this place will certainly push the boundaries of the “people will pay more for totally rehabbed” concept.
The “raised” second floor still has too many low corners.
Kind of ugly if you ask me. New but ugly.
I agree HD.
U guys are unbelievable – you want a 1 million dollar type house for 400k? This place is VERY nice for the size/money. The comments on this thread are reflective of what is wrong with people today. They really DO expect to live a millionaire’s lifestyle on a pauper’s budget. Most people growing up in 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s would think this place is AWESOME and would be happy to live here. unfuckingbelievable.
I like it but it is priced at least $100K too high for the nabe. There are several rehabs nearby in the low 300s to compete with.
now would it be appropriate or inappropriate to post a reference link…i cannot keep up with the CC rules
How much would they pay for it in the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s? I would bet a lot less than $400,000.
I don’t like the color schemes or the set up. Looks very not bungalow. I’d rather have the smaller bungalow rooms than the open floor plan with a kitchen straight from home despot. It looks cheap
I dislike big 2nd story buildouts on bungalows. It just doesn’t look right.
How is that a gourmet kitchen? And what makes a “spa master suite”?
This is an OK reno, but they went beyond the market of this neighborhood. A nice $250k-$300k rehab will sell in this hood no problem, and from the July 2010 purchase price they could have done it.
Looks like a nice home to me, large rooms, 2 car garage, ac, basement, etc. I don’t know much about the location so no comment on pricing. Gotta love the complainers here.
nice house, decent schools, good area, big yard, new, I bet this sells within 10% of current asking price, 380k is my guess with 10% down
monthly nut of approx 1682 (withpmi)+ 303 taxes is $1985 a month, with a small tax benefit
not too shabby
I wonder if the flipper paid for part of the reno with city money allocated to the bungalow rehab project. I recall reading that the city was giving grants to people to rehab bungalows. If so, then the flippers costs are lower.
You can tell this is a dumber rehabber. Sales of home $350,000+ have been sparse during the last 24 months, but here’s some jefferson park competition that closed for only $11,000 more than the mason ask price
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/5903-W-Leland-Ave-60630/home/18935851
It is hard to add the second story without screwing up the architecture or look from the street. Doing it right typically means you lose functionality of the dormer room (it winds up being too small for a normal sized bedroom). It can be done, but I don’t think most developers want to pay for it (buyers won’t pay for architecture/design done right most of the time).
It wouldn’t look too bad if they chose better windows. The picture windows on the front are a no no for bungalows. They also picked a cheapo front door too that doesn’t work design wise.
Otherwise, it looks like a nice home. A lot of buyers just want to move in and paint. People will pay a premium for a truly turn key home. Most of the homes in neighborhoods like this are half-assed renovations, DIY jobs, or the homes are just plain out dated. However, I have no idea what the pricing is like in JP.
I know that Property is portage park but it’s only a few blocks away
Most of the $350k+ properties are east of the highway, not west.
just from the cheapo looking layout, ugly color scheme, and the removal of anything of the bungalow nature, I can see why no one is interested in this. Not impressed. Too expensive. TOo ugly for a bungalow. Dumb dumb flipper.
Here is another smart Jeff park flip. Faster turn around and priced closer to the hood’s demographic…
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/5744-W-Wilson-Ave-60630/home/13475960
4 month turnaround, wide lot + I would prefer a Georgian over a bungalow…
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/4936-N-Mango-Ave-60630/home/13501555
A local: I could be wrong but IIRC, that grant money has to be used to preserve or restore a bungalow to its original splendor. What this flipper did would be a violation of those conditions.
Chi, that 2nd place you listed is hideous, although i’m sure some trees in the yard would help hide its hideousness… also its 2/3’s the size and 75% of the price (and worse finishes IMO) so this place is actually cheaper
This is overpriced. Also, I’m familiar with that particular spot and the planes descend directly over this house all the time.
Yeah Clio, opining that a house may possibly be overpriced or overimproved FOR ITS LOCATION clearly shows that we expect to get million dollar homes for $400K.
Get a grip.
I agree that it may go for around 380K
It looks nice to me. Good Hood.
Regarding the Planes, its kind of a non issue as most of Jeff Park and Oriole Park has plane noise.
“Chi, that 2nd place you listed is hideous,…”
Doesn’t matter, it sold for close to original list.
“also its 2/3’s the size and 75% of the price (and worse finishes IMO) so this place is actually cheaper”
Exactly! This developer knew what would attract buyers for this neighborhood and priced it accordingly (see my first post).
I can see that it is “angry, condescending” clio who drew the short straw and has to troll CC today. My personal favorite is the thin skinned, “why does everyone pick on me” clio: he is still annoying, but at least he displays human emotions when responding to the inevitable shit storm that follows his outrageous-ness.
Pick a day and observe the new clio.
” a house may possibly be overpriced or overimproved FOR ITS LOCATION clearly shows that we expect to get million dollar homes for $400K.”
Where would this house have to be to be a $1mm house on a 30×125 lot (ie, no fair making the lot “buildable” in some suburb where buildable lots are $900k)?
Icarus: “I could be wrong but IIRC, that grant money has to be used to preserve or restore a bungalow to its original splendor. What this flipper did would be a violation of those conditions.”
Let’s hope your right. Otherwise, the program would be yet another waste of tax dollars.
no matter what it still is a waste of tax dollars
WARNING: SUBURBAN PROPERTY LINK (but literally across teh street from Chicago)
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Niles/6917-N-Concord-Ln-60714/home/13592600
“STUNNING, CUSTOM BUILT, ARCHITECTURAL GEM! MID-CENTURY HOME IN BUNKER HILL! BEAUTIFULLY SITUATED ON A LARGE, CORNER LOT. CONTEMPORARY DESIGN USING NATURAL MATERIALS BY ROBERT HARRY JESSEN BOWS TO FRANK LLOYD WRIGHT. OPEN FLOOR PLAN FOR STYLISH ENTERTAINING. 3 SIDES OF THE HOME OPEN TO LIGHT-FILLED ATRIUM. 3 BEDROOMS & 2 FULL BATHS. GREAT FLOW FOR TODAY’S LIVING. WELL-MAINTAINED. OVERSIZE 2 CAR ATTACHED GARAGE ”
For just $1,200 more a month than this dumpy bungalow, you can live in mid-century modern luxury….amazing, amazing home, right outside of teh city limits. TAKE THAT residency requirements!
what does this mean:
Information for Agents
Compensation paid on: Net Sale Price
Compensation paid on: Net Sale Price
Commission is based on sale price less any credits. Compared to commission on gross price.
Can I shoot you anyway?
“MacPhail on September 12th, 2011 at 1:27 pm
“WARNING: SUBURBAN PROPERTY LINK”
a Niles address? no thanks. Chicago is way, way more “cool”. Shoot me in the head if I end up in life saying “I live in Niles….””
Personally, I think the QOL in niles would be far better than jefferson park, and that home is a hell of a lot cooler than anything in jefferson park. and it’s right across the street from Chicago, literally across caldwell ave is Chicago.
I don’t like the Niles house at all. First there is the hideous carpet and then there is just too many windows for Chicago’s terrible winter. I wonder how much the gas bill is? Oh and the kitchen is too snug for my taste.
HD, that house is cool, but it definitely is sorely in need of some serious updating imho. It has the potential to be one of those Dwell houses. $595k seems a bit rich for you though… Don’t know how you are going to get your mid-century modern with your price constraints.
yeah 600k for a ranch house in niles, totally a deal compared to this place… NOT
miumiu: Gotta disagree. That place is spectacular. It is properties like that that make me want to move out of the city. I’d probably hate living in that area, but I’d love my house.
Also: compare this style and execution of mid-century design to that dump in Kenwood from last week. I realize the architect of the Kenwood place was famous and it had historical importance, but damn, it was ugly. Just in different leagues.
Haha! I don’t plan on moving to niles, but, the house is pretty cool and just barely outside the city.
I love the mid-century but it is a bit outside my price constraints … and there’s nothing wrong with that. According to cnn.com’s ‘how much can i afford calculator’ I can afford $550-$625k conservatively to aggressively, respectively, but that’s crazy talk in my mind. So this is not outside my league but I wouldn’t consider it.
I know I”m going to probably get banned for this but here are two more midcenturies in park ridge, on a lake, 14 miles NW of downtown Chicago…
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Park-Ridge/125-N-Talcott-Rd-60068/home/13647471
However, in lieu of the traditional midcentury
“Russ on September 12th, 2011 at 1:43 pm
HD, that house is cool, but it definitely is sorely in need of some serious updating imho. It has the potential to be one of those Dwell houses. $595k seems a bit rich for you though… Don’t know how you are going to get your mid-century modern with your price constraints.”
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Park-Ridge/230-N-Dee-Rd-60068/home/13647387
@ TftInChi, I like the style of the house as well, but somehow to me it is not for Chicago’s weather. I prefer the grey and brown stones for the weather we have, but it might be partly because I am always freezing : )
“I can afford $550-$625k conservatively to aggressively, respectively, but that’s crazy talk in my mind.”
HD, I know you’re financially conservative/careful, and I know you have a general max in mind when it comes to housing costs. That said, I also understand you to be someone who’s looking for a SFH, which (correct me if I’m wrong) also means that you plain to remain in the home longterm (at least until your kids are grown and gone, correct?). With that in mind, why not “aim for the stars” a bit more? Were you looking at places in which you’d plan to move out in 3 – 5 years, I could seen erring on the conservative side. But if you’re going to be there for upwards of 15+ years, why not buy the “most” house, in the “best” possible area your (agressive) budget can handle?
“and it’s right across the street from Chicago, literally across caldwell ave is Chicago.”
But HD –
Okay, right across the street is Chicago, but not the walkable Chicago with good public transportation. I do like that house, but it’s expensive. Not saying it isn’t worth it, but that’s a lot of money. Why not set your price ceiling lower?
Please don’t ban me Sabrina, at least these are just outside the city..
and Russ, in lieu of the mid-century, there are still some really cool 50’s and 60’s ranches with plenty of the mid-century elements – open floor plan, clean lines, etc; and some tri-levels are pretty interesting, and they are far cheaper and accessible than most of the mid-centuries which need a lot of work.
annony – the one thing i’ve learned in this job is that the good times will always come to an end. Either through forced retirement, health, layoffs, or in my firm’s case (mad men comparision) – we lose the lucky strikes as our client. So I don’t want to be too aggressive, take on too much debt, and be stuck holding the bag. I took on a lot of debt to get my degree, and while a significant amount has been paid off in the last 8 years, I still owe some money, and I’ve learned valuable life lessons from the callous attitude towards debt. The LAST thing on earth I want to do it take on more freaking debt after getting a law degree, and if i have to take on more debt, it better be a as little as possible, and I will sacrifice a big house or fancy car in order to keep that maxim.
milkter- i agree it’s not walkable chicago, but now taht I have a 10 month old, things have changed. I see kids all the time in niles/park ridge/etc running around the streets, riding bikes, unsupervised. You NEVER see that in the city, too many creeps around. I’m not saying suburbia is the panacea, but the prevailing attitude out there is far different than in the city.
That Niles house is about as good as it get’s. Imagine the acoustics in that space with all of that wood and sloping ceiling (I have a grand piano). I think the location is great and the house is the bomb!
” I see kids all the time in niles/park ridge/etc running around the streets, riding bikes, unsupervised. You NEVER see that in the city”
I see it in the city, and no, I’m not talking about the hoodlum element.
Anyone who thinks this is a reasonable price for the area hasn’t looked at any comps. This is more expensive than just about everything out there.
Additionally I wouldn’t call this a rehab, I’d call is to mutilation. It’s completely hideous and has ruined all of the original charm of the Bungalow structure.
“I see it in the city, and no, I’m not talking about the hoodlum element.”
Me too, I see it everyday.
Only in sliver areas where SFH cost an arm and a leg…
“Vlajos on September 12th, 2011 at 2:50 pm
“I see it in the city, and no, I’m not talking about the hoodlum element.”
Me too, I see it everyday.”
Really, that’s news to me.
Jefferson Park is littered with these hump-back bungalows with the huge, tacky dormer addition. Sooooooo ugly.
And, for what it’s worth, the Historic Bungalow Association has to approve pre-approve all plans for grant funding. Any dormer addition that is obvious from the curb is a historic “fail” by their standards. It does not qualify for inclusion in the program, or funding (present or future).
I know becaause I used their grant funding at one time. Their goal is to not “mulilate” bungalows. This one has been mulilated.
I’m very glad not to live in J Park (live there for a bit). It is city living by a technicality. It feels as boring and lame as Niles.
“Only in sliver areas where SFH cost an arm and a leg…”
Dude…c’mon. We know you’re hot for the suburbs right now, but we all know the NW side and other areas, such as Beverly, are family friendly areas where SFHs are priced comparably to Park Ridge, Niles, etc.
I see lots of kids with bikes playing in Edgewater.
“Dude…c’mon. We know you’re hot for the suburbs right now, but we all know the NW side and other areas, such as Beverly, are family friendly areas where SFHs are priced comparably to Park Ridge, Niles, etc.”
this x 10
Whatever.
“Vlajos on September 12th, 2011 at 3:08 pm
“Dude…c’mon. We know you’re hot for the suburbs right now, but we all know the NW side and other areas, such as Beverly, are family friendly areas where SFHs are priced comparably to Park Ridge, Niles, etc.”
this x 10”
homedelete on September 12th, 2011 at 1:14 pm
WARNING: SUBURBAN PROPERTY LINK (but literally across teh street from Chicago)
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Niles/6917-N-Concord-Ln-60714/home/13592600
“STUNNING, CUSTOM BUILT, ARCHITECTURAL GEM! MID-CENTURY HOME IN BUNKER HILL! BEAUTIFULLY SITUATED ON A LARGE, CORNER LOT. CONTEMPORARY DESIGN USING NATURAL MATERIALS BY ROBERT HARRY JESSEN BOWS TO FRANK LLOYD WRIGHT. OPEN FLOOR PLAN FOR STYLISH ENTERTAINING. 3 SIDES OF THE HOME OPEN TO LIGHT-FILLED ATRIUM. 3 BEDROOMS & 2 FULL BATHS. GREAT FLOW FOR TODAY’S LIVING. WELL-MAINTAINED. OVERSIZE 2 CAR ATTACHED GARAGE ”
For just $1,200 more a month than this dumpy bungalow, you can live in mid-century modern luxury….amazing, amazing home, right outside of teh city limits. TAKE THAT residency requirements!
———————
Its a totally different market!! When are you going to realize that some people HAVE to live in the city.
That is overpriced for Niles too by the way.
milkter- i agree it’s not walkable chicago, but now taht I have a 10 month old, things have changed. I see kids all the time in niles/park ridge/etc running around the streets, riding bikes, unsupervised. You NEVER see that in the city, too many creeps around. I’m not saying suburbia is the panacea, but the prevailing attitude out there is far different than in the city.
———
Ever heard of Beverly, Old Norwood, Edison Park, Oriole Park
You see tons of kids running around. Nice the fact that every other house has a cop living there though. Park Ridge and Niles border Chicago. Its the same element at Edison Park and Norwood in Park Ridge and Niles.
homedelete on September 12th, 2011 at 2:57 pm
Only in sliver areas where SFH cost an arm and a leg…
—-
True That I think us residents in the far out reaching neighborhoods prefer the lack of diversity in crime.
Just Sayin
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/7103-N-Melvina-Ave-60646/home/13591880
This chicago house is just a short walk from the niles house.
The niles house is $253 psf; the wildwood house is $496 psf….
and cribchatters wonder why anyone would want to leave chicago..
“Its a totally different market!! When are you going to realize that some people HAVE to live in the city. ”
Move to wildwood and pay $398,000 for this 803 sq ft GEM! New on the market, just listed today!
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/7103-N-Melvina-Ave-60646/home/13591880
You city owners will eventually realize that there aren’t enough young monied buyers willing to buy your 2000’s era 3,500 sq ft luxury home in north…. This younger generation is having trouble paying student loans…
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-12/u-s-college-loan-defaults-highest-since-1997.html
please start “NilesChatter.com” or “I haveAkidNowChatter.com”
No one gives a shit
HD, are you surprised college loan defaults are the highest since 1997? We are also just out of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression.
NilesChatter.com would be great!
TB definitely wins all CC threads today. I agree that at the very least, very few people here give a shit.
And HD: if the economic outlook for home buyers is as bleak as you make it sound, all of us CC renters will be sitting pretty. How long can the 400+ per sq. ft. party last when no-one has the money to buy those properties? And don’t think for a second that suburbia will be spared in such a scenario. Out there, it might even be worse.
“I’m very glad not to live in J Park (live there for a bit). It is city living by a technicality. It feels as boring and lame as Niles.”
Well TB I hope that you can indulge those of us that would like to live in Jeff Park. Whenever Sabrina posts about LP or Gold Coast or Lakeview, I tend to ignore those threads because I’m not interested in those places and have to wait for the one or two bones she throws per week for non Green Zone homes
“And don’t think for a second that suburbia will be spared in such a scenario. Out there, it might even be worse.”
It already is, and will only get far worse as the boomers advance in greater numbers into their late 60’s and mid 70’s. Many (perhaps most) will want and/or need to get out of their suburban houses and move into more practical (and for less affluent boomers, more affordable) homes, and they’re eager to stop paying their high real estate taxes (now that the kids are grown and gone). Think there’s a shortage of buyers for condos in the best parts of the city? Try finding a suitable number of affluent and/or move-up buyers to acquire the aging properties in the vast Chicagoland sprawl. I still have no plans to ever move to the burbs, but if those plans change, I’m confident that the suburban deals will be even better 5 – 10 years from now. Contrariwise, I would submit that prices – yes, even on…gasp…condos – in the premium city hoods will have increased by that same point in time.
WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG
Contrary to what you may all believe, it is NOT easy for older people to just pick up and move – it is the LAST resort for most of them. This is for a multitude of reasons:
1. The are not as mobile as the younger generation – remember, their own parents probably bought only one house and lived there until they died. They, themselves are not used to moving around as much as younger generations.
2. Their memories are tied to their homes. This counts for A LOT.
3. Many want to be able to pass down their homes to their children (they are worried that their children won’t be able to afford a home, etc.).
4. Many feel as though their children will be mad if they sell their home and they like having a “central place” for family gatherings.
5. They are smart and know that with a new place comes many new expenses (ie furnishing, etc.)
6. They are already comfortable where they are – they are smart and know that with moving comes many new headaches (changing mailing addresses, finding new grocery stores, settling in to a new routine, dealing with new neighbors, etc,)
7. They are lazy (everybody is lazy) – it takes a LOT of work to downsize, throw away things, clean out the boxes and boxes of shit in the attic/garage, etc. Hell, I would move tomorrow to a smaller place but I have about 10,000 sq feet of furniture that I wouldn’t know what to do with, oil paintings that I would never find places floor – even a grand piano that may not fit where I would want it to go…etc.)
So, while in theory, your thoughts are sound, in reality they don’t play out quite as nicely as you think…….There is not going to be any mass exodus of empty nesters into the city – no way (the few that will downsize, usually don’t move more than a stones throw from their house – that is a fact).
“There is not going to be any mass exodus of empty nesters into the city – no way (the few that will downsize, usually don’t move more than a stones throw from their house – that is a fact).”
Clio, while I generally agree with all seven of your points, I’ll nonetheless cling to my outlook, for a couple of reasons.
First, do you seriously envision hundreds of thousands of suburban house owners remaining in their houses until they die (and for a fairly big portion of owners in the nicest burbs, that’s within the next decade or so)? I don’t – especially not in the most expensive burbs. I could see alot of working and middle class house owners remaining in their homes, but many folks of means will happily trade in the big house on the north shore for a nice luxury two bedroom condo – one with a big enough living and dining area to remain the central gathering place.
Second, as noted above, I do envision many affluent suburban retirees (i.e., those with homes in the $1.5 – $2 million + range) moving down to the city. Additionally, even for the merely upper-middle-class (say, those with houses currently worth $1 million or less), many grew up in Chicago and plan to return once their kids are gone (e.g., Dan #2, on whose wealth/home value I am only guessing). That said, contrary to your comment (quoted above), my outlook does not rely on everybody packing up and moving down to the big, expensive, wild city. Plenty of folks in the nice Chicago burbs will seek to ameliorate the injuries to their retirement funds and home values by picking up and moving to a warm state where housing has seen huge building booms and even greater downturns (and, while a lot of kids who grow up in the Chicago area tend to return after college and settle down – perhaps more than most bigger cities – plenty of them do not, which means their parents can move anywhere with an airport). Others will simply buy a townhome or condo in or near their current burb (which is consistent with your view).
anonny, again- in theory, you make a lot of sense and boomers may even agree with you (hell, I agree with you) – but when it comes down to actually doing it, most people will stay put. I think people underestimate the financial and psychological toll moving puts on someone (especially from a house to a condo). Remember, people like to bitch and moan but when it comes to action, very few actually follow through.
As an example, take a couple in their late 50s or early 60s – they have a 1.5 million dollar house with a 23k tax bill and maint. costs. Where are these people going to move? 10 e ontario – I think not. They are going to end up in a 700k condo/townhouse in lincoln park with a tax bill of 10k and assessments of 1k. So they figure they save 13k in taxes. When they calculate it, if they live another 20 years in their house, that is only a savings of 260k (plus lost opportunities). These people likely have over 1 million in savings – a loss of 260k to ensure continuity of their lifestyle and peace of mind is worth it – that money would just go to their greedy little kids anyway!!!
This is the way most people think.
Well two of my neighbors in our condo are older couples who have moved from the burbs after their kids moved out. Obviously this is a biased sample as I only see the outcomes for one side of the hypothesis.
” to ensure continuity of their lifestyle and peace of mind is worth it ”
This is where I disagree. My neighbors love living in down town and being able to walk around and travel without worrying about their homes maintenance.
“Whenever Sabrina posts about LP or Gold Coast or Lakeview, I tend to ignore those threads because I’m not interested in those places and have to wait for the one or two bones she throws per week for non Green Zone homes”
Icarus and Sabrina – me too! I love those threads. I might be the only CCer who knows my way around the red and yellow-zones better than the green zone.
did you step into the redzone?
Hey,
F- you all the niles BS. Show me a real midcentury modern home in Chicago for that price. Because you can’t.
But I can show you a 803 sq ft GEM for $398,000.
I don’t care for niles, not one bit. I have no affinity for the place. But it’s across the street from Chicago and it seems to be a hell of a lot cheaper and reasonable than some areas in Chicago, where properties just sit, and languish, and rot, etc.
“but when it comes down to actually doing it, most people will stay put. I think people underestimate the financial and psychological toll moving puts on someone (especially from a house to a condo).”
The boomers have to sell to Generation X- which is currently living in a smaller house/condo/townhouse which they also can’t sell. So the boomers are stuck in their houses unless they get a LOT less than they think they should get.
Also- anonny underestimates the community part of it that most people enjoy. I agree with Clio- that on its face- many WANT to move downtown and downsize and enjoy the city. But their friends, and in many cases, the grandkids, are all in the suburbs. So they move downtown- then who do they go out with? What place of worship do they go to? Will the chefs in the restaurants know their names?
Most people stay with what they know. There will be some that move- or some that buy the smaller condo downtown but keep the house in the burbs as well.
That’s the point of the niles post. a nice midcentury, across the street from chicago.
“Move to wildwood and pay $398,000 for this 803 sq ft GEM! New on the market, just listed today!”
But HD, it was completely updated in 1998!
“Please don’t ban me Sabrina, at least these are just outside the city..”
I don’t ban someone for posting links outside the city if it’s relevant to the conversation. If the linked to property is right down the street but is technically outside of the city- then I would consider that very relevant.
But if I’m posting about North Center and you post a link to Oak Brook- I WILL delete the post.
“The boomers have to sell to Generation X- which is currently living in a smaller house/condo/townhouse which they also can’t sell. So the boomers are stuck in their houses unless they get a LOT less than they think they should get.”
I visited a home this past weekend in a very near suburb, and the basement was completely gutted. I asked why. The realtor told me that the owner was put into a nursing home and he refused to let his children sell the home. So it sat vacant for two years until last summer the children forgot to pay the electrical bill, there was hard rain, the sump pump wasn’t working because there was no juice, and the basement flooded….bad. The entire basement of this 1,100 sq ft structure had to be gutted. And it still sat vacant for another year after that.
Now this smelly nasty 1,100 foot home on a 50′ lot is for sale for the incredibly low price of $314,000. Nearly $300 psf for this dump. hahahahah! The realtor was wearing shorts and didn’t seem like he even wanted to sell the home. What a joke. No mortgage on the home, gutted basement (moldy too) and they want $314,000….
Languish…?
Did I mention the $9,000 tax bill on the $314,000 home, with no real ability to appeal?
Or how about the boomer trying to sell his colonial for $439,000 – with no air conditioning! It was last updated in 1992….wow, same with the 1992 carpet too. 530 day on the market now. $8,400 in taxes, nice home, nice lot. Great location….530 days, and they haven’t even bothered to play the list/relist game…no mortgage (actually there is a recent mortage which I presume was used to buy the lake house where they now live) but other than that, no mortgage.
HD – you are NOT going to own a SFH in a decent area close to the city and avoid paying pretty high taxes. You just aren’t – 5-10k for a 400-500k place is standard. Get used to it – good God, look at houses in elmhurst or west chicago (crappy areas). A 400k house there has 7-10k in taxes. You are living in a fantasy land and probably should look to moving out of the chicago area. You can’t change an entire city to fit your needs.
You might accept it, but the next generation of real estate buyers is getting fed up with your acceptance of high taxes. Things WILL change, slowly, but they will.
“clio on September 12th, 2011 at 8:08 pm
HD – you are NOT going to own a SFH in a decent area close to the city and avoid paying pretty high taxes. You just aren’t – 5-10k for a 400-500k place is standard. Get used to it – good God, look at houses in elmhurst or west chicago (crappy areas). A 400k house there has 7-10k in taxes. You are living in a fantasy land and probably should look to moving out of the chicago area. You can’t change an entire city to fit your needs.”
clio – using video game parlance, it’s “game over” and the sooner you realize this the better off you will be in the long run. Quite a few people get it; but a lot of folks, both those older and heavily invested in real estate, they just don’t get it.
The realtors in 2 of the 4 homes I saw kept talking about lot size as it realated to builders. They haven’t built more than a dozen new homes in this suburbs in 3 years! It’s like they’re still pushing buttons on the control but the game is over.
“You might accept it, but the next generation of real estate buyers is getting fed up with your acceptance of high taxes.”
IT DOESN’T MATTER IF YOU OR ANYONE ELSE IS “FED UP” WITH IT – IT DOESN’T CHANGE ANYTHING, MORON!!! You are acting as if taxes and high prices are something new. This has been going on for centuries!! Who do you think pays for your beloved CPS, teachers, firemen, police, street cleaning, etc. – obviously they are paid through taxes and taxes NEVER NEVER go down. Instead of posting on cribchatter, do some research and you will see we are going to see a spike in income taxes in the next 10-20 years – there is no avoiding it. Real estate taxes are also going up – either make more money or accept that you are not going to live in a sfh in a good area. Good God – the choices are right in front of you and nothing is going to change – NO MATTER HOW HARD YOU WISH. Good Lord, please also save some money for alimony because I can’t understand how someone could actually live with you!!!
LMFAO lets listen to Clio: the idiot who so leveraged up in RE he admitted to being willing to lose ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS on one of hos properties to unload it. Know why? clio knows why: his rents aren’t covering his costs of ownership and he wants the piece of mind of stemming the bleeding from this wound
You’re toast Clio. Your opinions on here represent how you wish the world was not how it is. You know why you want to sell your lakeview condo at a 100k loss & so do we.
The saying from big financial windfalls and losses from speculating is “easy come, easy go”. Guess what kiddo its easy go time for you these days.
my newest neighbor just moved from schaumburg, 8 months preggers, so in my opinion, everyone is going to downsize and move to river north to be able to spend more time with their kids after they are born!
yeah, thats it
HD, not every house in Chicago has such high $/sq ft prices….
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/4047-N-Harding-Ave-60618/home/13484814
It may not be the fanciest house, but is “updated” and supposedly only $150/sq ft. (If you believe the 3000 sq ft figure)
“Move to wildwood and pay $398,000 for this 803 sq ft GEM! New on the market, just listed today!”
“Now this smelly nasty 1,100 foot home on a 50? lot is for sale for the incredibly low price of $314,000. Nearly $300 psf for this dump. hahahahah! The realtor was wearing shorts and didn’t seem like he even wanted to sell the home. What a joke. No mortgage on the home, gutted basement (moldy too) and they want $314,000….”
Wow. Crazy story. But it all depends on what suburb and what location.
My uncle had the family homestead on the market in the south suburbs for 3 years (no one was living in it.) Rented it out briefly to a “friend” who proceeded to nearly burn the house down (had to re-do the kitchen ceiling and cabinets after the fire.) Then it sat vacant after that. He had to hire someone to mow the lawn and check on the house for vandalism etc. He complained about having to pay about $12,000 a year between taxes and a small mortgage.
In this case- originally listed for $189,000. I told him to lower the price and he would find a buyer. But he wasn’t going to “give it away.” He blamed the “awful” real estate market.
Finally sold 3 years later for just $105,000.
Regarding the taxes- Clio is right about them going up because they have to to pay the huge pensions obligations that Chicago and many suburban cities find themselves in. (Someone in Evanston told me, and I don’t know if this is true, but that every citizen of Evanston would have to pay $40,000 just to get rid of the pension obligations there.)
So you can’t escape it.
But if taxes go skyhigh, then that means people will need to pay less for their houses in order to afford the taxes. To me, it just means that prices will continue to come down.
benjamon9- that house you posted a link to on Harding has been on and off the market since 2006! Wow.
Yes, I had seen. My guess is they started off pricing like the house in Wildwood. At least one seller has perhaps decided to try to lure buyers like HD…
“I don’t care for niles, not one bit. I have no affinity for the place. But it’s across the street from Chicago”
HD, you could lawyer-in one of the first instances of some area that wanted to annex INTO the city of Chicago and not vice-versa!
I think Clio has a point about RE taxes and SFH prices. We’ll just morph into the situation like the Bay Area or Marin county where housing prices are high and people cut back on other expenses to pay, there is no choice. If Clio is right, then the casualties will be the upper-scale malls’ (Old Orchard, Oak Brook, NBK Court, etc.) sales-psf numbers. That’s where the cuts will be made, if housing expenses continue to rise.
hey… Wake up and I can agree with Clio… What a wonderful and harmonious way to start a day!!! Oh are they going to tax you Clio. Attach it right to your electric bill like they did in Greece. Then you can go, next time you need some docs from the city, and breathe in the pleasant service that you are paying for.
What I no mention of aging Boomers selling their homestead and moving to a “senior community” like Del Webb’s in Huntley, Carrilon in Plainfield or the Martha Washington complex in North Center/St. Ben’s?
this is for HD
http://www.coldwellbankeronline.com/property/details/2274114/MLS-07899508/1912-Old-Briar-Road-Highland-Park-IL-60035.aspx
This house went under contract today apparently…
homedelete on September 12th, 2011 at 1:54 pm
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Park-Ridge/230-N-Dee-Rd-60068/home/13647
—–
Backs to a lake – the price is supported
homedelete on September 12th, 2011 at 3:23 pm
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/7103-N-Melvina-Ave-60646/home/13591880
This chicago house is just a short walk from the niles house.
The niles house is $253 psf; the wildwood house is $496 psf….
and cribchatters wonder why anyone would want to leave chicago..
———-
The Wildwood house is overpriced by about 100K. No real lot to expand on.
However, still can’t compare Wildwood to Niles.
“However, still can’t compare Wildwood to Niles.”
yes I can and I did. they’re across the street from each other.
Under contract: the cribchatter effect. for the most part, they go under contract pretty quickly after being on cribchatter.
in re highland park midcentury: awesome house. no interest in highland park though, but awesome house. needs a little updating though, but totally cool on a half acre.
Here is an article on Evanston’s unfunded pension obligations:
http://www.evanstonroundtable.com/main.asp?SectionID=15&SubSectionID=26&ArticleID=2966&TM=58295.73
“However, still can’t compare Wildwood to Niles.”
The latter has Niles West High School, which I think would command a premium.
anyone: What are the GZ boundaries in oak park? I know that you need to be west of austin but that’s all i know. Thanks
“anyone: What are the GZ boundaries in oak park? I know that you need to be west of austin but that’s all i know. Thanks”
Used to be south of Ike and east of Ridgeland, but I would say the that has changed. SE and NE corners, along with the first street or two west of Austin, tend to be the most affordable, so maybe that’s the answer you’re looking for.
As a non-Oak Parker who house hunted a bit out there, the Ultra Green Zone to me was west of Ridgeland, north of Chicago (because of the school zoning).
But really, anything north of the train and west of Ridgeland. The slightly lighter Green Zone went south to the highway. Couldn’t figure out what to make of houses south of the highway. Good elementary schools there, it seemed.
wow there seems to be a whole lot of nothing cheap for sale, and consequently, a whole lot of nothing is selling.
HD-updating? heck, I even like the matted shag carpeting. I’d be looking to buy it as-is furnished, if only we hadn’t decided to relocate out of state.
The neighbors have definitely screwed the tax base upwards, though.
“wow there seems to be a whole lot of nothing cheap for sale, and consequently, a whole lot of nothing is selling.”
Got a 100%cash offer within 10 % of my asking price within hours of listing my property yesterday. Anecdotal observations are NOT data.
IMHO the nicest part of Oak Park is north of Chicago and West of Ridgeland, however, you are also talking some of the most expensive properties in the village too.
There really isn’t a “bad” part of Oak Park though but I’d definitely avoid bumping right up against Austin Blvd north of Lake Street imho. Just depends on your budget and needs.
The northeast corner is mostly bungalows and craftsmans similar to this property. The middle of the village Ridgeland west to Harlem tends to have the more stately properties. The monster Victorians/FLW homes are around Chicago Avenue. South of Madison and down to highway and to Roosevelt tend to be similar to this property as well.
Most prefer to be north of 290 but people who live south of 290 seem to like it a lot. IMHO the highway just makes it feel cut off from the rest of the village though.
Sold my condo in 75 days and got my list price.
“but people who live south of 290 seem to like it a lot. IMHO the highway just makes it feel cut off from the rest of the village though.”
But the houses south of eisenhower are generally more affordable, right? And the western portion of that is in Holmes elementary, which I think is very good. So good for HD and close to blue line and close to expressway, which he likes.
RE: near suburbs
I never understood why people love the near suburbs (oak park, evanston, etc.). They think they are getting the best of both worlds – but, in reality they are getting the worst of both worlds – high taxes (and going higher), high crime (in relation to other suburbs) and not-that great schools (in relation to other suburbs). Proximity to the city doesn’t matter one bit if you don’t actually go in to the city. If you only go a few times a month, the extra 30 minute drive to naperville, downers grove, etc. is well worth it!!!
My personal feeling is that there are a lot of 30 something year olds who are so terrified of moving to the suburbs, that they are clinging on to every last hope of remaining city dwellers. If you find yourself in this category, do yourself a favor, bite the bullet and move to the real burbs. Then take the extra money you save and splurge on a weekend in the city every month. Trust me – your life will be better.
You can also just stay in the City.
“But the houses south of eisenhower are generally more affordable, right? And the western portion of that is in Holmes elementary, which I think is very good. So good for HD and close to blue line and close to expressway, which he likes.”
SW corner is Lincoln Elem. And I’m not sure why HD is asking, since he’s made it clear he’s not interested in Oak Park. Which leads me to the question:
Why are you asking, HD?
Also, for the record, I described the “less desirable” parts of OP, rather than the “GZ” (though that’s hardly applicable to Oak Park).
“SW corner is Lincoln Elem”
Yeah, sorry, that’s what I meant. I forgot which was which. Never paid a lot of attention to OP. My rough OP school taxonomy is Mann good, Holmes so so, Lincoln good but not sure I want to live there.
Also, OT, Chris M, you prob know, but for anyone else interested, you can buy single croissants (and other items) at Boulangerie now. My life may be complete (although frankly the croissant I had recently was not as good as in the past).
“Yeah, sorry, that’s what I meant. I forgot which was which. Never paid a lot of attention to OP. My rough OP school taxonomy is Mann good, Holmes so so, Lincoln good but not sure I want to live there.
Also, OT, Chris M, you prob know, but for anyone else interested, you can buy single croissants (and other items) at Boulangerie now. My life may be complete (although frankly the croissant I had recently was not as good as in the past).”
Mann in the wealthiest and has the highest test scores but least amount of diversity, so it would be Bob’s choice if he lived in Oak Park. Lincoln has popular (and difficult to get into) Spanish immersion program and is generally the #2 most in-demand after Mann. Holmes is in prime OP but draws from more apartments/condos, so has more income diversity and isn’t all money. Hatch, Whittier, Beye, Longfellow, and Irving are all on the east side of town and all are good, but I think Beye and Longfellow are in the center and I believe most in demand among the 5 east schools. When we lived there, we were in Beye and I wanted to send our daughter there–it seemed like a fantastic school. But I would be happy with any of them.
And, no, I wasn’t aware of the change. So the terms of the lease were modified I take it?
“And, no, I wasn’t aware of the change. So the terms of the lease were modified I take it?”
Must have been but I don’t know the details. I still wish they would open before 9am on weekends (I realize now that I’ve prob complained about this before and posted about the croissant policy change–what can I say? it’s a big part of my life).
“If you only go a few times a month, the extra 30 minute drive to naperville, downers grove, etc. is well worth it!!!”
Clio, I realize this may come as a shock to you, but there are actually lots of folks who like Oak Park and Evanston because those areas actually offer some semblance of racial diversity and integration. My sense is that Oak Park actually gets the racial integration part better than Evanston (i.e., more middle and upper-middle class racial minorites), and Evanston obviously has the lake front advantage.
People also like the village/small city feel, and the history and charm of the areas. With all due respect to juliana, “history” and “charm” don’t come rushing to mind when I think of Naperville.
Plus, think about that extra 30 minute drive that you’re advocating people accept in order to live in the “real” burbs. No thanks. Oak Park and Evanston are practically in the city. I’ve run to Evanston and back – it’s absolutely beautiful, except for a stretch of Rogers Park. Can you imagine running to Downers Grove? (I have no idea where Downers Grove is, so perhaps it would be a lovely experience.)
DZ – Carry out a pizza from the new pizzeria (Dante’s) at Armitage and Whipple. Just opened last week and it’s good stuff.
“Carry out a pizza from the new pizzeria (Dante’s) at Armitage and Whipple.”
Ha, one of the neighbors just mentioned Dante’s. Said it was NY style. I’m a little dubious about people saying NY style but still sounds v good. And thanks for rundown of OP elems.
“Can you imagine running to Downers Grove? (I have no idea where Downers Grove is, so perhaps it would be a lovely experience.)”
No, you got it right, it wouldn’t be a lovely experience.
As one that grew up in Oak Park, I think it is goofy to segregate Oak Park into good/bad areas. I knew people who wouldn’t go east of Ridgeland or south of Lake Street and think that south of 290 is no man’s land, but I find that they are missing some of the best things of Oak Park. Personally, I wouldn’t want to live too close to Austin, but it is easier to get a deal there. On the schools, I think Chris summed it up VERY well. I grew up west of Ridgeland but still went to Hatch and many friends went to Whittier, and I don’t think we were any worse off than the “west” schools.
“Sold my condo in 75 days and got my list price.”
Hi Vlajos – Congratulations!
Any advice for CCers trying to sell right now?
annony: “With all due respect to juliana, “history” and “charm” don’t come rushing to mind when I think of Naperville.”
Actually, Naperville has a shit load of history, pioneer settlement structures, old downtown buildings, etc.
As someone who recently bought in OP (& moved from Old Town), we just wanted to stay west of Lombard (2 blocks west of Austin). South of the Ike is OK, but the lots are MUCH smaller and it wasn’t our thing. Why OP? We wanted good schools (no kids yet, but we’re in Beye & all of the neighbors love it), be close to an El (we both work downtown & love access to the City/Green line), and the architecture.
The only thing we don’t like are the uber-high taxes and lack of political diversity…
annony: “Can you imagine running to Downers Grove? (I have no idea where Downers Grove is, so perhaps it would be a lovely experience.)”:
I recently went to see Poi Dog Pondering do a show at the Tivoli Theater in Downers Grove. It’s quite a stunning old theater, of which only a few still exist in the suburbs.
I live in Evanston, and get what you’re saying though.
“Why are you asking, HD?”
Just wondering. The problem is that many CPS elementaries sucks, even in the GZ; and I don’t want to pay taxes AND private school; and the SFH or large condo in the GZ is just way out of what I feel comfortable paying (i.e. living within my means, unheard of today, i know)….and I want a relatively short commute driving or public trans (and for my wife who must drive b/c daycare, school, etc)
And the way Chicago is set up is that, like most older industrial cities, is that there are a handful of ‘good’ neighborhoods outside of downtown, and due to income and racial segregation, vast areas of land in between the downtown and the suburbs which are more or less uninhabitiable. there’s nowhere in between Oak park and the west loop i could live with a decent public school. there’s even fewer area heading south; and going NW it gets better but beyond elementary school there aren’t a lot of options. The inner suburbs like evanston or oak park/RF are good but still has a heck of a commute. if you have kids don’t want to spend half a million for a living space, in Chicago, you’re pretty much forced into a 45 minute commute every morning in that god damn rat race. Even this morning I had to drive, and there aer so many assholes on the road, and everybody trying to one up everybody just to get on the highway, so that you can do the whole stop and go thing for 45 minutes…it’s poor poor urban planning. in europe they put the bad areas on the outskirts of town, not inside the city limits with price public transit real estate…
HD – the wife and I have 35 minute commutes (chair-to-chair) from Oak Park on the Green Line. This involves an 8 minute walk to the train, 20 minutes on the train, and 7 minutes to the office. That’s the best thing about Oak Park – you’re so close.
“The only thing we don’t like are the uber-high taxes and lack of political diversity…”
That’s my issue with oak park too. not that i’d fit in any better in wheaton, but oak park is a people’s republic unto itself.
“but oak park is a people’s republic unto itself.”
I do appreciate its for sale/rent sign restrictions.
“but oak park is a people’s republic unto itself”
How true. It’s similar to where I grew up & I’m used to being in the minority (politically), so it feels like home.
“The only thing we don’t like are the uber-high taxes and lack of political diversity…”
The two are very closely connected. And those taxes are only gonna go up…
Live in Andersonville on a great street. Duplex down, I know they are hated here.
Pretty much every place worth living in this country is a high tax bastion of political liberalism. Still waiting for any of the right-leaning folks on here to name a single awesome place to live in this country that is politically conservative (other than, as stated, San Diego, but I’m not even sure it’s the conservative stronghold it once was).
Jupiter Island Florida?
“The only thing we don’t like are the uber-high taxes and lack of political diversity…”
I didn’t mind the political leanings of the town, even though I consider myself libertarian at this point. It’s those taxes and their trend that concerned me. Nonetheless, we may move back there in a few years when we need the schools.
“other than, as stated, San Diego, but I’m not even sure it’s the conservative stronghold it once was”
You missed/ignored my suggestion of tehOC, which is (1) pretty similar to SD and (2) still pretty darn conservative, albeit possibly open to charges of RINO-ism from the false prophets of “tru-conservatism”.
“Pretty much every place worth living in this country is a high tax bastion of political liberalism.”
NO REAL ESTATE TAXES IN OAK BROOK
I personally wouldn’t classify Jupiter Island as “awesome,” mainly because the weather from April through October would just be too hot and humid (the hurricanes don’t help either). And given the affluence of its “residents,” I’d venture that most don’t spend much, if any, time “living” there for those six months.
Also, while it’s no SF, it’s not exactly Dallas either: 42% in 04 voted for Kerry and 43% in 08 voted for Obama.
the image search pictures look awesome. celine dion has a water park in her back yard. but maybe she’s liberal, and she’s def a canuck.
is elp awesome? or does the weather, etc disqualify it
Clio, Oak Brook seems like a nice place to get a huge, beautiful home, with great public schools, within a reasonable commute to a major city. But I wouldn’t classify it as “awesome,” let alone live there.
anon(tfo), you may be right on that one, though it doesn’t seem like affluent liberals would be unwelcome there. There’s no way Sandy Cohen would have put up with that.
HD – I’m going to guess you’re giving OP some consideration. Since you’re child is still an infant I wouldn’t be in a rush to move but there are some great values in that town and I think you would really enjoy living there.
Parts of the OC are fantastic. I could live in the Raleigh-Durham area, which seemed pretty middle of the road politically to me. If push came to shove, I could live in Tennessee.
Ha; touche, CH. It is indeed hard to knock the weather of a vacation paradise as a Chicagoan. But I like the winter, hence the “personally” qualifier. But again, I’m sure things are extra quiet around Juniper Island all summer (I imagine at least a few Chicagoans have a place there). I’ll concede that it’s “seasonally awesome.”
And, yes, if I may brandish a bit of adopted hometown pride for a moment, I do consider Chicago to be at least minimally awesome, particularly in the nicest lakefront areas.
We chose Oak Park because:
1) Housing Stock: We like older homes with character. The tree line streets and parks are nice as well. Plus, there is housing for every budget. We got a really nice renovated bungalow for less than some Duplex Downs in the city.
2) Schools: All the schools are great. We haven’t heard anything bad about any school in Oak Park. Yes, there are some kids who don’t do well, but that is more on the parents than the schools. Any kid from a middle/upper income background with involved parents should do perfectly fine at any OP school. I don’t get why every parent thinks if their elementary school doesn’t have 99% on whatever stupid test is used, their kid is doomed to a life of mediocrity.
3) Commute: I live in North Oak Park and it takes me exactly 35-45 minutes to get to my office door to door. That includes either catching the bus to the Green line or riding my bike the 1 mile to the station and walking to my office in River North from clark/lake street station.
4) Diversity: I like the diversity of income, ethnicity, etc. Even though I tend to be libertarian, the liberal attitudes of the village are good for the arts, etc which makes a vibrant and creative community. Face it, too many conservatives in one area can be boring. It is about striking a balance.
5) Access to downtown. I can get to Bucktown faster than I could when I lived in Andersonville. We still go into the city several times a week for dinner, etc. At the end of the day, we get all the city has to offer amenity wise without the downsides – crime, cost of living, and schools.
6) Decent shopping in downtown Oak Park. Great summer farmers market. All of which is walking or biking distance.
I would probably leave IL entirely before I moved to any of the other suburbs. We would only consider moving back into the city.
“anon(tfo), you may be right on that one, though it doesn’t seem like affluent liberals would be unwelcome there.”
Are *affluent* liberals really unwelcome anyplace “awesome”? Ditto affluent *conservatives* (as opposed to bigots/racists/general idiots). Maybe the town’s attitude to education/publc services/etc doesn’t comport, but “not my preference in how to run town govt” =/= “unwelcome”.
I don’t think that, say, an active/outspoken advocate for marriage equality or the environment would feel unwelcome in OC. I wouldn’t want to be an active/outspoken opponent of marriage equality or environmental protections in, say, Aspen or the SF Bay area.
“I don’t think that, say, an active/outspoken advocate for marriage equality or the environment would feel unwelcome in OC. I wouldn’t want to be an active/outspoken opponent of marriage equality or environmental protections in, say, Aspen or the SF Bay area.”
That’s just about the degree of shamelessness + persecution complex. If you have no shame, and don’t presume that anyone who disagrees with you should still be totally polite and welcoming, then you either never feel unwelcome, or welcome an unwelcoming attitude.
And the *most* outspoken advocates for the environment are unwelcome in much of Cali, bc they live in trees, burn down houses and car dealerships and don’t bath enough. They aren’t too different from the Phelps family, also unwelcome even in most places generally sympathetic to their (supposed) motivations.
Right of center views in Oak Park are rarely welcome. Liberals are pretty intolerant of opposing view points from what I have seen in OP. Although, I have seen more and more moderate and right of center attitudes in OP lately.
Russ, what are the rules about the number of mortgages someone can take? Is it 4 or 5? and does a home equity line count as a mortgage? They keep changing the rules and it is hard to figure out.
“Right of center views in Oak Park are rarely welcome. Liberals are pretty intolerant of opposing view points from what I have seen in OP.”
It’s in part political NIMBY-ism–“if you don’t like [liberal policy X], why’d you move to OP, instead of DuPage; it’s not like it’s a mystery”.
I don’t know who wouldn’t count a HELOC as a mortgage. Any financial institution that takes a 3rd mortgage or lower is stupid.
Right, live in Wheaton if you don’t like liberals.
Vlajos: he’s asking about mortgages on different props, not all on one.
Clio, can’t have more than 4 mortgaged properties. Technically, you can go to 10 if you have decent equity, but most banks have an overlay that caps at 4 for conventional loans.
Portfolio lenders all vary on how many properties they will allow a borrower to own.
Thanks Russ!!!!
I knew many conservative people in Oak Park. They may not be as loud as the liberal people there, but I think there are just as many of them and some lean just as far right as others lean left in Oak Park.
At least when I lived there many of the right of center people could be found at Calvary church and others scattered around town.
SOld $390,000
10/17/2011
Lunker on September 12th, 2011 at 12:05 pm
I agree that it may go for around 380K
It looks nice to me. Good Hood.
Regarding the Planes, its kind of a non issue as most of Jeff Park and Oriole Park has plane noise.
Figures, Just sayin