Selling a 3-Bedroom in Uptown 7 Years Later: 917 W. Belle Plaine
This 3-bedroom unit at 917 W. Belle Plaine in Uptown recently came on the market for the first time in 7 years.
The listing says it was a total gut rehab.
While the building is a vintage building, very little of the vintage finishes remain.
The unit has a bay window in the living room.
The kitchen has granite counter tops and stainless steel appliances.
There is hardwood floors throughout and a bay window in the living room.
It has the modern amenities of central air, washer/dryer in the unit and deeded parking.
Will this property command more than the 2004 purchase price in this Uptown location?
Jennifer Lane at Keller Williams has the listing. See the pictures here.
Unit #2: 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, no square footage listed
- Sold in July 2004 for $299,000
- Currently listed for $330,000
- Assessments of $246 a month
- Taxes of $4618
- Central Air
- In-unit washer/dryer
- Parking included
- Bedroom #1: 15×11
- Bedroom #2: 15×11
- Bedroom #3: 14×8
Price seems decent and it looks nice as well. Parking, Central Air, W/D in unit… only drawback is the 1 bath. If this was a total gut, I would have seriously considered turning it into a 2BR/2BA.
None the less, I’d expect this to sell by the end of the summer for no less then $299.
First, I realize that the boom is back. I can also see how some folks can justify why some of Chicago’s fringe neighborhoods are now more expensive then their West Coast city counterparts.
Having said that, this is wildly overpriced. Who is this marketed to?
How is the boom back?
“wildly overpriced”
Really? It doesn’t seem overpriced to me by much at all, and certainly not wildly. I think that a summer sale price above or very near the 2004 price is very realistic.
Those ceiling fans are comically small.
“If this was a total gut, I would have seriously considered turning it into a 2BR/2BA.”
Agreed. They could have worked an office nook into the master.
Taxes seem high.
man, I’ve gotta say, it’s getting really old seeing all these listings with people STILL trying to get 2007 pricing… $330k for a mediocre place way the heck up north in Uptwon…
They might as well not even list an asking price. It’s getting to the point that people will (or certainly should) pretty much ignore the asking price anyway.
This is Buena Park, not Uptown. Walking the street you get a completely different field from being north of Montrose.
I agree with JJJ and Wilson. I can believe this is a gut rehab. We looked at similar places in 2006 and there is no way it would have been priced even at $330k in this condition then. It probably would have listed and sold over $350k. I think $330 is a reasonable asking price, although it will likely sell around the last sale price. At least the owners got to enjoy the rehab for seven years since they won’t get the money back.
I saw similar 3brs in east rogers park last summer. Those at similar price points had no sales. Maybe Uptown can command this price IDK.
I am still saving hundreds a month by renting, and we have the ability to move as our needs change. We are pretty much settled in for the next couple years, but may jump on the right deal. Lots of forclosures in the rogers park market and prices are still headed down.
Judging by the fancy beamed ceiling and back door, the master bedroom used to be the dining room. So this apartment was originally Atwood bedroom. That combined with a single bath makes me feel like it is overpriced despite being fairly attractive.
Buena Park is part of Uptown, but the point stands. This is not “way the heck up north” in Uptown or in general.
Atwood is iPhone for two (bedroom)
This looks like a very nice city home for a small family. In the early 2000’s I lived at Kenmore & Buena and it was a nice area, really fell off a cliff north of Montrose but this pocket is very insulated. It’s close to the Sheridan L stop and just 5 minues to the lake front. There’s an underpass to the lake at Buena and the golf course/softball diamonds/tennis courts are all right there. This would be a decent option if a 2 income couple decided to have one parent stay home and raise 1 or 2 kids.
How much is parking worth?
This (http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/644-W-Briar-Pl-60657/unit-1F/home/12727460)
-also 3/1
-also vintage-stripped rehab
-also with small rooms (ok even smaller)
-also with graniteel
-but in Lakeview and Nettlehorst,*
-also sold in ’04 (per Redfin), for $337k.
Recently listed for $284k.
*don’t know why teh listing says it’s “close to Nettlehorst school distr” except they meant to say it’s IN the att boundaries and close to the actual school.
Used to live in this ‘hood about 10 years ago. Buena Park is certainly ‘in’ Uptown but is not ‘like’ Uptown. It’s close to Wrigleyville without getting game-day traffic chaos.
Street parking for your guests could be a tight on this street though. Nice park on Kenmore by the church. ‘Bar on Buena’ is a decent neighborhood place, and Dollop on Clarendon is awesome.
Here is something that bothers me; how is this ‘wildly overpriced?” Selling 101: list higher than what you will take. So listing this at $330k when you paid $299k seems spot-on, even in this market.
Some people are way too quick to hate.
dahliachi: Atwood is iPhone for two (bedroom)
http://damnyouautocorrect.com/
Haha, that website is hilarious…
Nice find Roma, I’d definitely take the Briar condo over this one for the school alone.
This is a terrific neighborhood: bus takes 20 minutes to mag mile or red line is a 3 minute hike. 10 minute walk to whole foods. 10 minute walk to target. Disney magnet basically takes all neighborhood kids in order to fulfill proximity weight of lottery.
This is a great price.
Thanks Madeline-that website is great!
few things less offensive than owners / associations
that refuse to replace missing cornices.
This is in Uptown. The low price reflects the 1 bath.
James-
I share your opinion. The cornice is a small detail that, when removed, really screws up the look of the building…it looks like there was an amputation of sorts.
Roma,
Interesting find but I’d have an easier time swallowing only one bath if I had parking, larger rooms and above the first floor. Not all of us in 3 bedrooms have kids and need the school. I’m sure Briar sells for closer to asking than this but I doubt above $275ish with one bath and no parking.
umm 300k you get 3br parking and w/d, i dont see a problem. is this uptown? even if it is last time i was in the area didnt feel like uptown at all so a huge positve.
If it were an investment, do you guys think this is rentable? If so, how much would you charge per month?
Anyone buying this as an investment and expecting it to cash flow as a rental is uninformed or betting on near-term hyperinflation.
I can’t find the thread where clio said he wanted to buy a house that I thought was a deal, but maybe he put in a bid because it’s under contract in less than five days
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/3734-N-Harding-Ave-60618/home/13457019
HD, i was looking for that thread as well. It seems like that is the second old home in the villa to go on the market recently — do you think a bunch of retirees are finally trying to cash in their home-401K policy?
Possibly, maybe an estate. I drove past this house, I didn’t see a single St. Viators sign anywhere in the neighborhood, so there are few children. I predicted this home would sell quickly and I was right. There’s a bungalow on avers similar to this that is for sale for $400,000 and is stale.
“Icarus on March 28th, 2011 at 3:28 pm
HD, i was looking for that thread as well. It seems like that is the second old home in the villa to go on the market recently — do you think a bunch of retirees are finally trying to cash in their home-401K policy?”
http://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/3811-N-Kilbourn-Ave-60641/home/13459077
This also went under contract in like 3 days. There is a tremendous amount of demand for cheaper housing with plenty of people scouring the market looking to find a deal. It’s annoying actually.
” I didn’t see a single St. Viators sign anywhere in the neighborhood, so there are few children”
My nurons are not firing all the way across my brain, please explain. Catholic priest joke?
“My nurons are not firing all the way across my brain, please explain.”
The kids in the neighborhood mainly (mostly?) go to Viator’s, and they hand out/sell stickers/signs/flags by the pallet full. The absence of stickers/signs/flags indicates that there aren’t many school-aged kids on those blocks.
1 bath = in case of emergency pee in the ficus
HD. Looks like a great house at a great price.
New owner could rehab kitchen to suit.
Do you think that houses like this at this price will cease to go under contract so quickly?
“HD. Looks like a great house at a great price.
New owner could rehab kitchen to suit.
Do you think that houses like this at this price will cease to go under contract so quickly?”
I fear the electric and plumbing in a place like that.
And, when HD can’t offer a view of the freeway, he offers a view of the RR tracks.
Yes Anon
But still a good price for a place you can update over time.
“I can’t find the thread where clio said he wanted to buy a house that I thought was a deal, but maybe he put in a bid because it’s under contract in less than five days”
I called the next morning to put a full cash offer and it was already under contract and I suspect that it is going to go for much higher than listed price.
Also, if you take a look at redfin, there has been a ridiculous number of places that have gone under contract in the past 3-4 weeks. It is crazy and there doesn’t seem to be any rhyme or reason to the places that are going under contract – many of them seem really expensive to me. I know that I have always been a bull on the real estate market but I have to say I am in a panic and secretly really disappointed that the housing market has taken off because I really wanted to buy more property. I am really beginning to think that bottom (for most areas) was this past winter.
“I called the next morning to put a full cash offer and it was already under contract and I suspect that it is going to go for much higher than listed price.’
This is the house in the Villa that HD linked to that was $158,000.
“I know that I have always been a bull on the real estate market but I have to say I am in a panic and secretly really disappointed that the housing market has taken off because I really wanted to buy more property.”
The housing market has “taken off”? Where?
All data- both locally and nationally shows continued slowdown in both prices and sales.
Yes- properties are going under contract. Some are even selling (gasp.) But it is nearly April. This happens every year in the spring. Sales are still well under last year (yes- the stimulus helped.)
First time buyers are nearly non-existant. You don’t have a healthy market without first time buyers. Distress sales also make up far too much of the market. So that’s not normal either. And shortly, banks will require 20% down on all properties that aren’t FHA, Fannie and Freddie further squeezing the $500,000 to $800,000 price range down. All of this before interest rates rise- which will crush prices down further. We’ll hit the bottom when people can afford housing without it being 40% or more of their income. So they can actually invest in productive areas of their lives (vacations, retirement, college etc.)
“This also went under contract in like 3 days.”
HD- that house doesn’t seem that cheap to me (even for that neighborhood.) It’s just a basic bungalow. Not much you can do with it even if you fix it up.
Those are a dime a dozen for like $125k just a little further west in Portage Park. Yes- I know- different neighborhood. But same house.
“The housing market has “taken off”? Where?”
Everywhere. You will see when the march data comes out in a couple of weeks. Yes, I know that the spring market always brings out buyers -but I am seeing buyers go for more than just the cheap places – people ARE buying more expensive places (and I am talking about Chicago – not the suburbs).
Sure- with the stock market at 2 year highs- some of the more expensive properties are moving again. But not nearly enough to wipe away the years of inventory that is out there.
And the stock market does nothing to help the $700,000 buyers (for the most part.) They still have to have the cash for the downpayment simply from saving.
Clio- you are simply feeling the spring buying and think it’s an actual uptick- when it is nothing more than spring buying. It happens every year.
I do have to say, however, that we haven’t yet seen a surge of people looking to sell (which I thought we’d see by now.) They must be heeding Mario Greco’s recent advice which was if you don’t have to sell (as in REALLY have to sell)- then you shouldn’t be listing it in this market.
By the way- if I had lots of time on my hands I’m sure I could find similar comments from last March and April here on Crib Chatter from various people saying that that was the “turn” and the “bottom” and look at all the people buying blah, blah, blah.
Location, big yard 50×137, being an arts & craftsman home in the villa I’m sure the woodwork on the inside is amazing. Everyone of those villa homes has a history, even the smaller ones. I’ll met up with your for a group tour this summer if you’re interested, I can walk there is 5 mins! I took the tour last year, pretty amazing place. I personally prefer the Victorians the next neighborhood over, but everybody is different. (I’m a big fan of the gingerbread and folk victorians not shared by everyone!)
I’m sure it needs *work* but given that a similar home sold a year ago for $360k in the villa, this to me is a deal. As a comp it’s also going to help lower the price for other bungalows in the near vicinity.
Its not a deal I want to buy, and I am definitely and I hate the idea of competing against multi-bids. No deal is so good that I have to outbid countless others and play those realtor games. I don’t make large purchases under pressure.
“#Sabrina on March 28th, 2011 at 8:03 pm
“This also went under contract in like 3 days.”
HD- that house doesn’t seem that cheap to me (even for that neighborhood.) It’s just a basic bungalow. Not much you can do with it even if you fix it up.
Those are a dime a dozen for like $125k just a little further west in Portage Park. Yes- I know- different neighborhood. But same house.”
“And the stock market does nothing to help the $700,000 buyers (for the most part.) They still have to have the cash for the downpayment simply from saving.”
Sabrina, you underestimate the VAST numbers of people out there that have at least 140k to put down for a 700k house. Just because everyone on this site seems to be in their 20s/early 30s and just starting out, there are MANY MANY more people in chicago (and not on cribchatter) that have a lot of money. Don’t be naiive…. (and I am not talking about multi millionaires – but people that are in their 40s and 50s who have been making over 150k for 15-25 years.
“Just because everyone on this site seems to be in their 20s/early 30s and just starting out”
I’ll bet
less than 20%
That brick bungalow was in the villa HD? I didn’t look at the address closely when I clicked on the listing. (I’m not talking about the $158,000 house- but the $249,000 house.)
Clio- look around at the financing of all the $600,000 to $800,000 houses from the last 10 years. The majority were 100% financing (or close to that.) People were putting down $50k to move into the $700k house. We see it all the time on Crib Chatter- but it happened all over the suburbs as well.
But now- the banks are requiring you to actually have skin in the game (for the most part.) Who has that much skin? Not many people. And, as I’ve said before, it will take a buyer (no matter what their age) conservatively 4 to 6 years to even save $100,000- not to mention more than that (that is the upper middle class income buyer making $150k or so.) For those making less- it will take even longer.
Whereas 5 years ago the couple making $150k could move right into the $500k property- now- not so much.
So it wipes out a ton of the buyers.
The average amount in a 401k, Clio, is like $40k. Even if you go up to the 50 and over age bracket (where they SHOULD have more)- it’s only like $70k on average. Sure- this is ALL income brackets. But you’re naive if you think Americans actually have savings of any kind. Even the upper middle class ones.
This is why the housing market has stalled in the upper income neighborhoods. Generation X cannot afford to buy there anymore. Those are people ages 32 to about 45 or 46.
And also Clio- the 50 year olds are NOT buying the $600,000 to $700,000 house. They are probably trying to sell it though.
“House price will come out tomorrow & show precipitous decline, Clio to remain defiant”
“Clio- look around at the financing of all the $600,000 to $800,000 houses from the last 10 years. The majority were 100% financing (or close to that.)”
Just because the trend showed full financing at that price range, does not imply that the people who bought those homes did not have a higher down payment available to them. Hey, if I don’t have to cough up 20% why should I right- just a matter of basis points? Many people chose to exercise that liquidity elsewhere and go with the bank deals (or scams however you like to look at it).
I’m with Clio in terms of people on this board underestimating how many people actually DO have a 25% down payment in the $700- 1.5mm purchase range. I just turned 30 and I had it for my sf purchase. I can name 8 people (and having recently moved here, I don’t know many people in general) under 40 in my neighborhood who also purchased above $700k in the last year. I also agree that the bottom is still far away, and think that a lot of educated buyers are waiting it out.
“Clio- look around at the financing of all the $600,000 to $800,000 houses from the last 10 years. The majority were 100% financing (or close to that.) ”
There are SO many things misleading about your statement:
1. The VAST majority of housing priced between 600-800k (or any price range for that matter) was NOT bought in the last 10 years – meaning that there are millions of people that bought housing in this price range more than 10 years ago.
2. Many people that bought in that range definitely put down quite a bit of money (or have money) – you are being fooled by the market now because, when you think about it, who are the people selling now – only those that are in financial difficulty (ie those that bit more than they could chew) THESE are the people that financed 100% or close to that. I would be that the majority of people that bought or own houses in that price range did NOT finance 100% – we are just not seeing those properties because those sellers don’t need to sell (or even if they want to sell, they are smart enough or financially stable enough to wait a few years).
““House price will come out tomorrow & show precipitous decline, Clio to remain defiant”
Bob – you are an idiot – average home prices from february or january mean nothing to the average CC reader. WTF do any of us care if some moronic invester bought a 10,000 house in Englewood? Good grief, are you that dense that you can’t figure out that real estate is so property and neighborhood specific? Sorry about the harsh tones – but I am so frustrated reading CC and all of you idiots predicting price declines and regurgitating nonsense data about how prices are falling all over WHEN I CANT FIND A FRICKIN GOOD DEAL ANYWHERE IN THE CITY!!! (again, I don’t want a 10k house in Englewood or a 50k condo in Uptown). Show me the good deals in the gold coast, old town, or east lincoln park (yeah – I thought so….)
“Show me the good deals in the gold coast, old town, or east lincoln park (yeah – I thought so….)”
I’m already seeing better deals today than a year ago. And a year from now they will be even better deals to come. Last night I posted followups on several properties featured on the near north side over the years after seeing many new listings on the MLS at lower prices than have been seen in awhile.
Rest assured we’ll continue to chronicle this bust and poke fun at your disassociation from reality along the way.
“And also Clio- the 50 year olds are NOT buying the $600,000 to $700,000 house. They are probably trying to sell it though.”
Please try and not have such a myopic view of the world. Most 50 year olds I know are downsizing to 600-800k places. Lake Forest, Kenilworth, Winnetka, Oak Brook, Hinsdale, and even chicago have thousands of people that live in large homes that may want to downsize to 600-1000k homes. Many of these people own their homes outright, have lived in them for 20+ years and, although they may have been worth 2.5-3 million a few years ago, these people purchased these places for 1 million in the 70s and 80s. They would gladly sell for 1.5 million now, and take that money and downsize to a 700k place and pocket 800k. Again, not everyone that buys a 600-1000k place is a move-up buyer, several are down-sizers.
“Last night I posted followups on several properties featured on the near north side over the years after seeing many new listings on the MLS at lower prices than have been seen in awhile.”
Bob – I am not talking about 1/1 or 2/2 with a view of costco or the kennedy – I am talking about decent places in prime areas – there is NOT ONE SINGLE “DEAL THAT I CAN FIND – and I have looked at EVERY SINGLE LISTING in 60610, 60611, and 60614 (ok also 60654 – have to include sonies)
“Bob – I am not talking about 1/1 or 2/2 with a view of costco or the kennedy – I am talking about decent places in prime areas”
None of the properties I posted were near the Kennedy or had a view of costco. I’m talking about prime River North newer buildings built within the past 10 years. I still wouldn’t call them deals but they were down 10-20% from peak pricing.
“Please try and not have such a myopic view of the world. Most 50 year olds I know are downsizing to 600-800k places. Lake Forest, Kenilworth, Winnetka, Oak Brook, Hinsdale, and even chicago have thousands of people that live in large homes that may want to downsize to 600-1000k homes. Many of these people own their homes outright, have lived in them for 20+ years and, although they may have been worth 2.5-3 million a few years ago, these people purchased these places for 1 million in the 70s and 80s. They would gladly sell for 1.5 million now, and take that money and downsize to a 700k place and pocket 800k. Again, not everyone that buys a 600-1000k place is a move-up buyer, several are down-sizers.”
That’s what I keep telling people about you, clio. You definitely represent the median and your insights are definitely crucial to understanding the nuts and bolts of the majority of the market. You bring such a keen and unbiased viewpoint that your insights are prescient.
You find me someone “downsizing to a $600,000 to $800,000 house”, and I’ll give you a nice River Forest house.
“Who has that much skin? Not many people. And, as I’ve said before, it will take a buyer (no matter what their age) conservatively 4 to 6 years to even save $100,000- not to mention more than that (that is the upper middle class income buyer making $150k or so.)”
“historically” that has been accomplished in no small part by buying a “starter” home and using the forced savings + appreciation + inflation to get enough together for a larger down payment. $600k-$800k is still a move-up house price range for most. Still took ~6+ years, but also kept the housing churn going.
“Bob – you are an idiot – average home prices from february or january mean nothing to the average CC reader. WTF do any of us care if some moronic invester bought a 10,000 house in Englewood? Good grief, are you that dense that you can’t figure out that real estate is so property and neighborhood specific? Sorry about the harsh tones – but I am so frustrated reading CC and all of you idiots predicting price declines and regurgitating nonsense data about how prices are falling all over WHEN I CANT FIND A FRICKIN GOOD DEAL ANYWHERE IN THE CITY!!! (again, I don’t want a 10k house in Englewood or a 50k condo in Uptown). Show me the good deals in the gold coast, old town, or east lincoln park (yeah – I thought so….)”
“Please try and not have such a myopic view of the world. Most 50 year olds I know are downsizing to 600-800k places. Lake Forest, Kenilworth, Winnetka, Oak Brook, Hinsdale, and even chicago have thousands of people that live in large homes that may want to downsize to 600-1000k homes. Many of these people own their homes outright, have lived in them for 20+ years and, although they may have been worth 2.5-3 million a few years ago, these people purchased these places for 1 million in the 70s and 80s. They would gladly sell for 1.5 million now, and take that money and downsize to a 700k place and pocket 800k. Again, not everyone that buys a 600-1000k place is a move-up buyer, several are down-sizers.”
Clio–
We understand that you haven’t found your ideal investment place and that some people are moving down from multi-million dollar homes in the suburbs. However, the other view is no more myopic than yours. While there are SOME in your ballpark, many are not. For MOST 600-800k IS a move up home. While YOU have a requirement for GZ, many people are looking for a home at $X and if they can’t afford what they want, they look outside the GZ. That is why CC doesn’t only look at the GZ. I think Sabrina tries to accommodate everyone….not just your perspective nor just the person trying to move up or that bought in 2006 thinking they’d make money…
benji,
I actually completely understand everyone else’s view/perspective/situation. Most people DON’T earn over 100k and cannot afford anything more than 250-300k (for a house). I get it – but what I don’t understand and cannot tolerate are the people who sit there and think that NOBODY can afford these more expensive properties and therefore they have to come down in price. My point is that there ARE people out there who can and WILL afford these places – they are NOT coming down in price so don’t get your hopes up – you will be disappointed.
Clio- what are you talking about? Nearly every property I see has come down in price all over the city. Down by 20% to 30% (and more) depending on location. Yes- even in, gasp, East Lincoln Park. How many examples do I need to provide on CribChatter? I get tired of showing all the $1 million properties that are down 30%.
Yeah- they’re not down 50% (not yet anyway.) And maybe they won’t be because of the location. But to say prices are not coming down is, simply, wrong.
Sabrina, you are right – prices ARE coming down on some undesirable units – but the condos and buildings in the most sought after areas are NOT coming down. It is frustrating. Seriously, who cares if the units at 2535 N. clark (or whatever that address was) are 119k – most people don’t want to live there.
Hegewisch! We need more properties in Hegewisch!
“but the condos and buildings in the most sought after areas are NOT coming down.”
Again- WRONG.
I’m not talking about the foreclosure buildings. Perfectly beautiful units in vintage co-ops in the Gold Coast are selling for 30% less than just 5 or 6 years ago. And that is IF they are selling at all. I could give you dozens of examples of properties in great areas of the Gold Coast, RN, Streeterville, LP and Lakeview (not to mention Wicker Park and Bucktown) ALL listed for less than the last purchase price.
It’s the norm now. Not the exception. If you bought in 2000 or before- you have better odds of making some money. But even some of those are just barely breaking even now.
Clio- I don’t know what you’re talking about. Yeah- maybe someone in the Elysian is making some money. But owners in the Bristol are not. Neither are owners in the Palmolive (many of whom have lost big bucks when they went to re-sell). And I could go on and on in many buildings. But I would be too exhausted from it to try.
“Hegewisch! We need more properties in Hegewisch!”
What the hell is a “Hegewisch”?!!! Isn’t that where Harry Potter lives?
http://www.hegewisch.net/