Under Contract In a Month and Now Sold: 2002 N. Howe in Lincoln Park
In June, we chattered about this 2-bedroom unit at 2002 N. Howe in Lincoln Park that had gone under contract in less than a month on the market.
See our prior chatter here.
It had all the bells and whistles including central air, in-unit washer/dryer and a parking spot. It also was in a prime location near the lake and the Armitage/Halsted shopping district.
The seller originally priced it to sell- bringing it to market under the 2006 purchase price.
It closed in July 2009 for $44,000 under the 2006 purchase price.
Did someone get a deal or is this the new pricing reality in Lincoln Park?
Eric Rojas at Rubloff had the listing. You can read his real estate blog here.
Unit #2N: 2 bedrooms, 2 baths, plus den, no square footage listed
- Sold in May 1991 for $200,000
- Sold in September 1996 for $220,000
- Sold in August 2001 for $354,000
- Sold in May 2006 for $459,000
- Originally listed in May 2009 for $440,000 (parking included)
- Reduced
- Was listed in June 2009 for $434,900 (parking included)
- Sold in July 2009 for $415,000 (parking included)
- Assessments of $239 a month
- Taxes of $5443
- Central Air
- Washer/Dryer in the unit
- Bedroom #1: 13×11
- Bedroom #2: 11×9
- Den: 11×8
- Living room: 24×12
- Kitchen: 9×9
boring. id rather take the other lincoln park property a few posts earlier.
“Did someone get a deal or is this the new pricing reality in Lincoln Park?”
very good question, it all depends how motivated/desperate the sellers were.
I think if we start seeing more and more sales in LP where the prices are below the 2006 price then it will be a scary reality and Steve H will soon take a long walk off a short bridge.
Damn. No good (obsurd) comments from last post we can mock today…
Not a bad spot. too rich for my blood on a 2/2, but seems like a deal for a great area.
It’s a reality for micro-units in 100 year old buildings. I would not extrapolate anything more than that.
And BTW, rooms with one side at 8 or 9 ft. are walk in closets, computer geek caves or baby rooms, not adult bedrooms.
I was the Realtor for this home with my partner Julie Varones. If anyone actually goes and looks at condos east of Halsted in Lincoln Park that have actually sold, it becomes pretty obvious this was a good deal for the buyers.
The condo was a two bed with sizable third room for an office and utility needs. 2 baths, parking, central air, in-unit washer dryer, huge storage room in basement, plus open areas for bikes, and great location (minus the high school).
The owner (our client) bought this unit a the top of the market a few years ago for LIST price without a Realtor (this could have easily been negotiated down $15-20K at the time).
For $410K, this person has a large enough condo for a small family if needed (Abraham Lincoln grade school district) and has the luxury of living in East Lincoln Park near anything you could want in Chicago. They are also building huge new decks and getting rid of the covered staircase.
People don’t realize the value in the school district alone and how desperate parents are for an affordable place just big enough in a good school district. Not to mention the sexy address itself for the singles and DINKs (and parents who have a life).
No one, and I do mean no one, buys a 2/2 condo in East Lincoln Park for the Lincoln school district. Not to mention the location on the commercial / arterial section of Armitage — this is not a family location (despite the pretend frontage on Howe).
Same building, same price West of Orchard for sure.
“No one, and I do mean no one, buys a 2/2 condo in East Lincoln Park for the Lincoln school district.”
Really? Done some polling on that? Seems to me that there are some single parents around who might do so.
Now, if you mean someone w/o kids buying it b/c they think it will help on re-sale, that’s admittedly pretty remote.
“Really? Done some polling on that? Seems to me that there are some single parents around who might do so.”
How many yuppie single parents are there in East Lincoln Park with kids over the age of 5? That is a ridiculous notion if you know the community at all. East Lincoln Park is not high on single parent radar screens, if for no other reason that living in the absolute highest cost area of Chicago is a challenge raising one or more kids on one normal income. There are plenty of fine school districts all over the city at a fraction of the cost of living (Bell, etc.)… Not to mention reasonable parochial options for those that want it.
“How many yuppie single parents are there in East Lincoln Park with kids over the age of 5?”
I would bet more than zero. Which was your contention.
Any other takers of the under with an over/under of .5?
anon(tfo) was schooled…
Kimo,
“There are plenty of fine school districts all over the city at a fraction of the cost of living..Not to mention reasonable parochial options for those that want it”
you say plenty? i say one good school districts, districts meaning k-12. and say only on handful of acceptable k-8 schools in chicago. all the others are test in schools.
now if i was a single parent worked downtown i would look at a place like this.
I really do think there are zero single parents (or couples with children) looking for a 2/2 in East Lincoln Park right now. And even if there were one or two, it represents such a miniscule outlier demographic for the product, it isnt even worth mentioning.
As for other schools options: Bell, Blaine, Sauganash, Oriole Park, Edgebrook, Norwood, Burley… more than a few good ones to speak of. Plus fewer drunk idiots fighting outside the Store to the contend with in those neighborhoods (not to mention beating up off duty firemen).
“And even if there were one or two, it represents such a miniscule outlier demographic for the product, it isnt even worth mentioning.”
I agree with you on that, which was implicit in my “if you mean someone w/o kids buying it b/c they think it will help on re-sale, that’s admittedly pretty remote” qualifier.
But you stated an absolute, and I doubted that. And we have teh Groove saying if his circumstances matched the hypo, he might be interested, further belying your absolute.
HD: How so? You’d love it if every argument were “it *never* happens”, because it’s soooo easy to refute.
Kimo, you are wrong. Just stop.
I live in old town/East LP and can attest that I know many single parents (mostly moms). A large majority of them are divorced and want to be in the area and schools are important to them. Seems that a place like this would also work for a family with one child. I think people seem to forget that years ago people did not live in the kind of square foot per person world we live in now and that sharing a room was more the norm than the exception.
With respect to my last comment, I mean to say that kids sharing a room was common. I shared a room with my brother until I left for college and that was not unusual in the neighborhood I grew up in.
“I live in old town/East LP and can attest that I know many single parents (mostly moms). A large majority of them are divorced and want to be in the area and schools are important to them.”
Be in the area or STAY in the area? And we’re talking about the ones who didn’t get the SFH in the ensuing court battle right?
Given all the unerutilized RE agents on this site, let’s see someone chime in with a single parent (hopefully MILF) client who is currently looking to BUY a 2/2 condo in ELP. If so, I have a condo to sell them for $415k…
“Bell, Blaine, Sauganash, Oriole Park, Edgebrook, Norwood, Burley”
All great schools Oriole and Edgebrook better the abraham lincoln but these districts dont have a good district HS also. Plus these hoods are pricey too!
the argument i am trying to make is lincoln school district not only provides a very good education k-12 but it also provides Culture, walking proximity to many many things, provides great amenities for the parents, plus close to transportation.
Oriole Park, top school, close to public transport, but restaurants well you got Bakers Square or a DRIVE to edison park.
Norwood, Beautiful hood, wide streets, Beautiful houses, same thing as oriole, but its like living in the northshore.
Sauganash ummm who wants to live in sauganash?
in the school districts you have mentioned you are Car reliant to get places and are very suburban like! thats the reason those areas are mostly cops, firemen, teachers and city workrs.
I can see a Single Working Urban Profesional with a Kid a Social life and no car looking for a 2/2 in lincoln district.
Chicago is much bigger than I thought or even the ‘hoods we discuss here. Over the weekend I found out about Norwood Park and sub areas like Oriole Park and have added that to the list of places where I might settle one day.
I consider it a perk not living around these D party idiots who are responsible for the current state of the city.
I LOVE the hypothetical single parent who is going out to bars every night, doesnt own a car yet has the means to pay over $400,000 for a vintage apartment (versus renting something). Assuming they can leave the child at home, its probably an older child, so this hypothetical parent is probably in their 40’s living in a LP 2/2. Without a car.
Not sure where Groove is from but none of the places listed are AT ALL like the North Shore. Though I have heard mythical reports of cops, firemen and city workers in Kenilworth… Just like our hypothetical single ELP parent.
Also, Lincoln Park HS is not considered by the community (including Lincoln Elem parents) to be a good HS at all. Most Lincoln Elem kids go private, parochial or test (or clout) into Payton.
“No one, and I do mean no one, buys a 2/2 condo in East Lincoln Park for the Lincoln school district.”
“a single parent … who is currently looking to BUY a 2/2 condo in ELP”
So, we were supposed to read “buys” in the first quote as “is currently looking to buy”? That rather changes things from my prior reading of “no one … buys” as “no one *ever* buys”, which I think is the most likely reading.
Of course that demo (admittedly small) isn’t looking *now*; to the extent they were looking this year, they bought and closed already–in time for the start of school. I suspect that small market is completely dead until spring, for next school year.
Ever hear of this thing called divorce? You know, the bitch gets half?
Kimo,
“Not sure where Groove is from but none of the places listed are AT ALL like the North Shore”
lets take a walk around Norwood Park then drive over to winetka!
let got edgebrook/wildwood then go over to wilmette!
btw the groove family is from the “hood” pappa groove grew up all around chicago from West to NW to North.
Bob,
Skip oriole park, too many small georgians and some streets will give you the public housing feel cause one block of all shared wall georgians all the same, square with same color brick.
Don’t any of you get it? There is no premium for a 2/2 in LP for one school vs. another (Lincoln vs. Oscar Mayer across Orchard). Look at the comps, you all have free time on your hands. Why? Parents of school age kids dont buy 2/2’s.
That the RE agent suggested their was, I think, was unfounded and wrong. And misleading. But he is a Realtor(TM) so what do I know.
Kimo,
now you called me out with “Not sure where Groove is from but none of the places listed are AT ALL like the North Shore” and i responded. and see you have no response to that 🙂
“Look at the comps, you all have free time on your hands” i will check next week when i have more free time.
“Parents of school age kids dont buy 2/2” i dont know why you state this as fact. you may live in a strange bubble where this is true, outside said bubble it is not fact. i can say i would be in a 2/2 with my kid if i was single and worked in the loop.
“That the RE agent suggested their was, I think, was unfounded and wrong. And misleading”
i will agree with most agents being used car salesmen misleading and bending ethics. but if you were the seller of this place would you be mad at your snake oil salesmen for stretching the facts?
I didn’t bother to respond because you made no point.
oh kimo, kimo
apparently you dont know chicago and really never leave your bubble do you. come on a little windex will help you see past your two block viewing area.
“a little windex will help you see past your two block viewing area”
You shouldn’t advise people to drink that stuff; if you aren’t used to it, it can do baaaad things.
I lived in both areas, moron.
Papa groove apparently lived in Winnetka but didnt see fit to leave little groove a trust fund sufficient for him to actually buy his own place. Pobre cito.
btw chicago area is bigger than “both areas” (East lincoln Park and Glencoe). get out more, hey even lets hang out in the grooves back yard talk about it with a few beers and see where the day takes us 🙂
“Papa groove apparently lived in Winnetka but didnt see fit to leave little groove a trust fund sufficient for him to actually buy his own place”
Old poppa groove was working class who grew up in chicago and helped with 3k for down payment on my SFH. unfortunatly no trust funds for the groove family just working class stiffs
oh wait i just realized why Kimo is so 7 year old kid angry, he/she is stuck in a 2/2 that he/she cant sell and used he/she’s trust fund to pay for it and daddy wont bail them out.
the kimo i feel for ya its going to be ok things will turn around just have a coke and a smile
3k downpayment for a SFH. LMFAO. Sorry to see your construction job aint what is used to be.
“3k downpayment for a SFH. LMFAO. Sorry to see your construction job aint what is used to be.”
Wow. Even if there were single parents looking at your 2/2, they’d probably be turned off by the lingering stench of your disapproval.
3k was from my pops and the rest of the huge % down was from me myself and i.
So now after the RE crash poor ol groove only has around 47% or so equity in his SFH.
Oh btw the groove is a desk jockey now, sr cost accountant now, the kicker is I got paid more doing construction
oh kimo how far are you upside down in your 2/2?
Kimo, if we planned to have only one kid or if I knew the second baby would be the same sex as the first one we would be moving to 2/2 in East LP literally tomorrow.
Actually I know professional couple with one kid and they live in 2/2 in ELP because of the school district and totally happy.
Plus this flat has a den – can be used as a nursery or study room for kid/kids.
Oh and that 3k my pops pitched in meant more than you can ever imagine. It wasn’t the dollar amount it’s that fact he gave more than he could afford and would not take it back. His words “use it for gas and don’t tell mom” (our little thing when he would give me 10 spot when I was a teen)
you can laugh at his 3k cause you a punk! But that jesture shows more class and caring than you will ever have.
“So now after the RE crash poor ol groove only has around 47% or so equity in his SFH.”
Groovester if you are as old as I think you are (judging by the number in your namesake) you are way, way, way, way, way ahead of the game vs. your peers.
Most people don’t hit 47% equity until their late 40s in Chicagoland is my guess. Or later because the housing prices here are ridiculous relative to incomes.
bob, i doubt may even let it get that high. don’t worry groove were here for ya. i wish i had that kind of equity, i could start my north/southside empire.
*many
Your paper equity via 2006 was just an imaginary number that made it extremely difficult for most first time home buyers to get into the market with sustainable housing payment. The record number of foreclosures is a testament to this fact.
Bob,
“Most people don’t hit 47% equity until their late 40s in Chicagoland is my guess”
the 77 was supposed to be groove7 but goofed up, but I am in my late thirties. ( good guess).
Revassal and bob,
the equity built is nothing until I sell the place. Plus the place is in the “hood” and only 2 br when we bought so it was sort of not outrageously priced. I was in the camp of you ain’t grown up until you are married and have your own sfh. The wifey didn’t want a huge mortgage payment messin with the social/nightlife so we both busted butt working two jobs had a very small wedding cut back on a lot (very easy when you grow up without $$$) so we can have a huge down payment.
Ok that was groove pushin out the modest now end it with the braggin
flash to 2009 groove is sitting in his media/family room he built himself in the attic watch Troy polumolu smash every running back and wide reciever in his path will make is mortgage payment of $821 (that includes taxes and ins) next week and during half time will finish the shopping list for the BBQ in the groove huge yard on almost by a few feet double lot this weekend for the bears game
so suck it kimo 🙂
It is amusing to say the least how mentioning a family might consider this condo would set some one off.
Kimmo, first I would agree that few families are looking specifically for a 2/2 anywhere.
I have a lot of experience with families looking for homes in Chicago in top elementary school districts. Although a smaller demographic than DINKs, my clients with small kids or expecting a kid ARE looking for condos. It boggles the mind why anyone would be so passionate to make unsubstantiated claims that a small family would not look for a 2/2 in East Lincoln Park in a top public school district. Kids live in downtown high-rises too. A close former professor of mine lives in a condo building on Lincoln park West where neighbors raised two kids in a 2/2 and went to Lincoln.
But lets focus on THIS place, as that’s the property in question and the one I suggested a small family could enjoy. This is a two bedroom condo with a den (the third room is about 8×12, no closet and door goes to the deck). The condo also has a large, sort of “double parlor” living room. There is a 10x12ish area behind the large couch that would be great space for an area rug and kid toys for a toddler before they are school age. The second bedroom is adequate for a kid and the private storage in the basement is over 12×12, not to mention the open common areas in the walk-out basement, are great for strollers, bikes and almost any equipment you would need. The “parents” bedroom is a good size with organized full wall closet. Kitchen/dining layout is great for a family.
There is OZ park a block away and a large patio in the back of the building to all importantly drink wine and let the kid(s) play and burn energy on premises. Plus, there is the parking space included.
Of course it is worth mentioning that this unit is in the attendance boundaries of Abraham Lincoln Elementary…it would be irresponsible not to. As a parent of two (with both parents more than interested in staying in the city for their careers and sanity), IT IS NOT EASY to find a place “large enough” for a family in a good public school attendance boundary under $500K with attractive city amenities. Non-religious private schools (and most religious private schools) are very expensive, and can also be hard to get in to. Mortgaging more on the house is cheaper than paying property taxes and private school tuition for years.
So, people make compromises. Comparing the expensive Bell School’s area further northwest in Northcenter and East Lincoln Park in Abraham is not apples to apples… these are people with different ways of life. Even though I know there are a handful of good attendance boundary schools such as Burley, Hamilton, Alcott and others, it’s still not easy to find a place under $450K that you’d actually like to have a family in and actually like the location. And it doesn’t matter what anybody thinks accept for the individual buyer who values a particular location more than other.
2000-2002 N Howe in fact has an owner who has raised their kid there. There are elementary aged kids who live in the adjacent identical buildings to the north. One couple that viewed this condo when it was for sale was expecting their first child (they bought a different condo). My neighbor in my building in Ravenswood lives in a 2/2 with a family room is a single mom that chooses to send her kid to private school (we will too). The condo was not that much less than the $415K and she would have saved in the long run and cut her work commute living in a place like 2002 N Howe with a great public school.
I have clients right now looking in Lincoln Park/Lakeview no further than 1400 West up to $500K in a good attendance school district (location is very important because of their work situation). I think they would have really considered this property as they’d have everything they wanted (location, space, great storage, new big decks, school district, parking) and money to make material renovations. We are having a hell of a time finding something.
You cannot underestimate how important and how difficult the housing/schools situation can be when it comes to YOUR OWN kids and careers unless you have money to burn.
i will give it to you kimo you pushed the grooves button and got him posting on cribchatter at home.
now if you ever want to sit down have a few beers and talk about it, friday nights i am at Leo’s Den over on 71st and stoney tell the bartender your looking for groove7.
Eric Rojas,
glad to see a Realtor holdin his own on CC, i know alot of us would aperciate, especially me, your insights in the biz and help many of us out on what to look for and what to avoid.
“You cannot underestimate how important and how difficult the housing/schools situation can be when it comes to YOUR OWN kids”
that statement is so true, the argument in our household is should we sell for less and go to the burbs. we know what side of that argument i am on.
i think its a HUGE factor for familys when buying a home, upgrading or just moving.
oh and another thing Kimo……… Have a wonderful weekend 🙂
“the argument in our household is should we sell for less and go to the burbs”
Where, groove? OP/RF or further afield?
Just remember, as much as the city sucks sometimes, the suburbs suck worse.
anon,
all depends on what well sell the house for that will dictate how far out we move. if we leave chicago at all, every month i lose a position in the battle to stay in the city.
her list of burbs are; Naperville, Elmhurst, OP/RV
my list; OP/RV, Lincolnshire, Deerfield, something in New trier, Mt Prospect.
as you can tell i see it if i will be in the burbs it will be the best schools, so each day as i commute to work or my soul dies a little inside i can at least tell myself “i am doing this for my kids”
sonies its all a trade off somewhere 🙂
“Just remember, as much as the city sucks sometimes, the suburbs suck worse”
we should change the title of this housing post to…..
“Let groove talk all about his egocentric self”
“her list of burbs are; Naperville, Elmhurst, OP/RV
my list; OP/RV, Lincolnshire, Deerfield, something in New trier, Mt Prospect.”
Notwithstanding the considerable charms of OPRF, if we ever move out of the city, we’re leaving the county, too. If I can’t have the city’s benefits, I don’t want the county’s burdens.
And, being Loop workers, on your list, I’d lean hard toward Elmhurst–non-offensive and close to DT. Hinsdale would have to be another.
“If I can’t have the city’s benefits, I don’t want the county’s burdens”
good point crook county is rough. but mchenry county is mullets no seriously dont go to mchenry.
“being Loop workers” lady groove is a stay at home mommy and i dont work in the loop so it would be a car commute for me anywhere i go. its a car commute now.
who knows whats going to happen i will fight tooth and nail to stay in the city!!!!!!!
the only good thing on my side in this fight are all the foreclosures in my area….for us to sell we would have to price competitively and lady groove and i have put too much work and have to much pride in our home to sell it below $xx amount.
also what we have done with our immediate blocks and what we are trying to do with the school, our pride is keeping us in the ghetto. (we will se how long that lasts)
I love it when a Realtor (TM) gets worked up. But he misses the point.
Point #1 is there is no incremental value for a 2/2 in Lincoln vs. Mayer for identical properties. This is definitely true, and no one refutes that.
Point #2 is that no one with a 4 year old kid about to attend school at home (or one currently school age) goes shopping for a new purchase of a 2/2 in ELP because of the school. Rojas’ examples include people who owned a condo, then had the kid and (most likely) had to stay put for financial reasons. Or, someone who is expecting a child (5 years before school even starts — are they buying a condo for 10 years??). I am not defending the yuppie overpriced Lincoln Park neighborhood, but I do know that people with children in school don’t buy overpriced 2/2s in ELP. They either have the $ for a townhouse, SFH or at least a 3br or they don’t (in which case they move elsewhere — as the other idiots on this blog point out, there are plenty to go around). I feel bad for people who live in neighborhoods that are too expensive for them.
Rojas — I know you have a hard on for LP, but it’s overpriced and will definitely see challenging days long after the broader market recovers. City services are getting worse. Your point on proximity is great but do we forget that Chicago is too cold to walk anywhere about 4 months of the year? By the way, who bought your property? My bet is a 25 yo with some help from parent (but a real contribution not Groove’s broke father here).
Last point — where do you live with your kids? Roscoe Village? Exactly.
Yech, better trolls plz!!! Where is the SHill?!?!
Kimo I’m in total agreement with you, but you’re fighting an uphill battle here. These people have been drinking the LP kool-aid for years. Any anonymous poster who criticizes their beliefs is going get berated. To them LP is the best place on earth, the place where everyone would live, if only they could afford it, and some people, the thankless saints that they are, will pay top dollar for smallish condos just to live there because it is that great of a place to live.
And I agree with you, there probably are very few, if any, families looking for 2/2’s in ELP. My auntie used to live in LP in a 2/2 with kids…except that she rented for a short time to save a down payment for a townhouse. It’s sort of like an elderly people buying a mcmansion; i’m sure it happens once in a while but it doensn’t quite fit the demo.
“Kimo I’m in total agreement with you”
You totally agree that people who don’t have wealthy parents should be disparaged?
Come on anon(tfo), you took that sentence totally out of context; I know you have some bone to pick with me, but come on, play fair… you’re playing dirty and this ain’t politics
“#anon (tfo) on September 11th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
“Kimo I’m in total agreement with you”
You totally agree that people who don’t have wealthy parents should be disparaged?
“
“Come on anon(tfo), you took that sentence totally out of context”
Dude, you quoted nothing and look at the post from Kimo immediately above yours (and Kimo’s post before that). You got sucked into the Kimo-cane here.
“I know you have some bone to pick with me”
Nope. Just disagree with a lot of what you post; it ain’t personal. Honestly.
That said, your summary of where you think the market is going from last Friday afternoon was cogent and made a lot of good points that anyone would be foolish to disregard; don’t totally agree with it, but also don’t disagree–seemed like a really reasonable scenario.
Whoa, whoa, whoa…the Groovester is contemplating a move to the burbs? I never thought I’d see the day! But, you know what they say: “Happy wife, happy life.”
I’m just kidding, my friend. If you do go to the burbs, I’ll be interested to hear which one you choose.
Food for thought: LaGrange, Riverside, Brookfield as contenders? Although you’re still in that pesky Cook Co.
HD — that’s the only point that needs to get made.
ELP is a ripoff.
With that, the thread is done.
No, no, no…
NOW, it’s done:
GO BLUE!
“GO BLUE!”
The one weekend a year when almost everyone agrees with the sentiment.
HD, “These people have been drinking the LP kool-aid for years”
i will admit i am a kool-aid drinker, red to be exact, and will always believe a premium should be paid for LP. so many reasons to list. example, 3 dude go smacked around in LP and the mayor, girly wiess, and media is all over it and cracking down. the wild hundreds have kids dropping like flies nobody cares.
mrsB, “Whoa, whoa, whoa…the Groovester is contemplating a move to the burbs? I never thought I’d see the day! But, you know what they say: “Happy wife, happy life.”
i was still hurt by our last meeting i ignored you but now have met kimo, and well just read above. glad we are homies again mrsB 🙂
“LaGrange, Riverside, Brookfield as contenders” all great areas have a friend in riverside. but if i have to lose part of my soul i will do it for the BEST school districts. love the happy wife, happy life phrase. its so true!
KIMO,
“Something in New Trier, LOL. Make sure you find a 2/2 condo in Winnetka… That’s all you will be able to afford.”
and the basis of your assumption of what i could afford is…….? the groove lives a good life, very comfortable, and way more liquid than you my friend.
Kimo the offer is extended still, and will hope you take me up on it. dont let your ignorance, prejudice, keep you in your bubble.
🙂
I hear you re: the schools.
I’m not intimately familiar with many burbs; like I said, I’ll be very interested to see where you do end up.
Corus, he dead.
“the basis of your assumption of what i could afford is”
Dude, your father only gave you three large. You *clearly* can’t afford to live anywhere in New Trier–>everyone knows that the price of admission includes at least $100k gift from your parents.
ps–check out the 7brs of awesomeness at 728 LAPORTE Ave in Wilmette (for $599,888). Love the round beds.
“and where you at in life?
thats what i thought!”
At the Moo & Oink!
hehehehee, did you see the awesomeness that is the green flower, what is the frosted white bubble?
anon, love the green round bed to match the round house and the round frosted bubble, they are consitant they stuck with a theme.
mrsB,
the grooves moving is all talk right now, i will probably stay in the hood either build an addition or buy the house a few houses down (if they will put it up for sale again) i dont like being the second best house on the block. grooves only settle for number one. (i know its bad to have the best house on the block or the worst).
[Edited by Sabrina]
IS a Wilmette address with $600k even if it’s on 90/94? west of green bay road AND west of 41? What the bubble giveth the bubble shall take away.
“IS a Wilmette address with $600k even if it’s on 90/94? west of green bay road AND west of 41?”
Dude, it’s in New Trier, it has 7(!! SEVEN!) bedrooms, and it’s on a culdesac, not 90/94. It’s sure as hell *more* “worth” $600k that the 2/2 condo in this post was “worth” $415k.
The assessor sez it’s 4015 SF, so it’s at least that big–>call it $400k for the house (replacement cost, ignoring redecorating) and $200k for the lot. Seems about right, to me.
“(i know its bad to have the best house on the block or the worst)”
No its actually good to have the worst house on the block. Appraisers are little more than monkeys who look at comps. If you have the worst house on the block your neighbors comps are going to inflate your appraisal.
I always use the example of in my parents subdivision of 66 homes only one is single story. Not sure how that even happened but they are likely sitting pretty.
I’ve always “heard” that it’s best to have the worst house on the best block, rather than the best house on the worst block. Your neighbors might look at you funny, but you’re re-sale value is outstanding 😛
Groovester- I think the variables of your particular sitch are much like ours: the schools, space, and what you’re willing to put up with living in the city. Cook County taxes, Cook Co. gov’t, and CPS aren’t really ringing my bell, BUT if you (the “general” you – not necessarily YOU) don’t need the space and you can afford (or luck into) a great school, then I think living in the city is probably great for a lot of kids. One of my dearest friends was born and raised in the Gold Coast; went away to college and is now back, refusing to part with her city. I say, good for her! Different strokes, you know? The bottom line: do what’s best for your family. That’s all anyone can ask.
*your
Groove, don’t do it… I actually consider Lemont and its quiet way- out- there feel and small downtown everytime I visit the in-laws, which is often… then my wife puts a stop to that craziness.
“Kimo”, I’ll waste my time here to address a couple concerns with your behavior. I’m not sure why you spend so much of your time here as an anonymous commentator just to insult people as idiots and try to “one up” me in particular. I actually addressed your point about 2/2s in agreement and also pointed out this had some features above and beyond a “typical” 2/2, like an extra room etc…
What’s the problem with that?
As well, I stated I live in Ravenswood, not Roscoe Village if you read the comments of which you draw some conclusion. What was your point there? I never defended Lincoln Park, but did suggest people pay for different locations for different personal reasons. Again what’s the problem with that? Where are we all to live and is everywhere “overpriced” despite people actually paying to live there? The price is what people pay. That’s it. Did you get priced out of LP?
My concern is with working with families and their goals. I live in Ravenswood for lots of reasons I discuss on my blog from time to time. Other people want to live in LP, Old Town… whatever.
I regret addressing “you” here at all, but maybe you’ll find religion or whatever it takes to end your suffering. And maybe the author of this blog, which has much value, could deter personal and general insults by censoring them so more people will take this site seriously.
“I regret addressing “you” here at all, but maybe you’ll find religion or whatever it takes to end your suffering. And maybe the author of this blog, which has much value, could deter personal and general insults by censoring them so more people will take this site seriously.”
I hear you Eric and I DO edit quite strenuously.
I don’t understand the need for people to insult each other. We’re here to talk about real estate but for some reason, just talking about whether or not someone can “afford” LP sets off a lot of people.
I saw there was some talk here about a house in Wilmette. Househunters should really check out the north shore. Everything THINKS it’s out of their price range when, in fact, it’s more affordable than most of the north side of the city.
There are darling smaller starter homes in Highland Park near the Lake for under $500,000.
I’ll be really interested to see what happens on the north shore next spring. There will be even better deals then.
Sabrina, sorry to use the “censor” word… the “Kimos” out there might ad something, like actaully pointing out FACTs once-in-awhile when refraining from calling people idiots and and trying to put people down. I just don’t get why people think eveyone else is stupid, foolish etc… for doing what they want and living where they want. The market speaks for itself.
One last point, a lot of Realtors don’t like this site and don’t want their listings discussed here. But if they just understood the authour is simply consistent in provding facts and provoking converstaion… and exposure… for thier listings, they might change their minds and understand what’s going on here. However, too many Realtos are afraid of the internet. Seriously.
Aside from some people’s personal anger issues and obvious need for attention, I learn a lot from some comments here about different areas of the city.
Eric,
“a lot of Realtors don’t like this site and don’t want their listings discussed here” hmmm wonder why 🙂
there is so much useful information on this site i have learned a lot from it (plus it very entertaining too!!!!!). Because of crib chatter i am a well informed consumer and on my next home purchase will have a better knowledge of the ins and outs of the biz and hopefully will come out with a better deal than i did for my first purchase. I can see how Cribchatter can cut the commisions for the agent on the posted property.
“then my wife puts a stop to that craziness” i know i was out by st charles a few weekends ago. nice town with A SHYT LOAD OF PLACE TO SHOP and a very quiet, a very peaceful place with good amenities and schools. then at the BBQ i was at the wife and i talked to the people that live there, well ummm well……..dont know how to explain the conversations but i will just say i coulndt live there having to interact with those people on a daily basis.
mrsB,
“I think the variables of your particular sitch are much like ours: the schools, space, and what you’re willing to put up with living in the city” The space we have is good its the school that we are afraid of that we wont be able to change. Also the effort we put into making the blocks around us better has not spread out any further in the past two years. was hoping it would grow by example as the years went by but hasnt yet. time will tell and we have until the first one is in 2 grade. We have money set aside for private school if need be, but wanting a second little one private school will be expensive for two 🙁
mrsb have you guys deciced to go back to, i think you said east coast, or stay in the chicago area?
Sabrina,
glad you edited the kimo and groove rants, sorry about that 🙁
i hear you about “Highland Park” its lake county there are some really good prices in the ravina school district and even better prices closer to 94. taxes there are still high. (at lest the taxes go to good stuff).
for the north shore i still dont see Winnetka’s prices dropping like willmete and glencoe have. and am supprised that west of greenbay in kenilworth are priced pretty sweet.
eric,
you seem like an ethical reasonable Realtor, could you provide some insight for me.
lets say you have a potential client who would like to list there home at 600k when the bought it for 500k in 2007. (no upgrades since purchase except maybe a new bathroom it cost 10k and the planted flowers) what does a realtor do, talk the owners down from the ledge explain to them the market, provide comps to show the market. then if they will only budge to 550k would you still take their business?
Many realtors are afraid of the light of day…
“Many realtors are afraid of the light of day”
there are some good realtors out there, but also there are some snake oil salesmen too.
St. Charles is nice but very far from the city. Moving there is a lifestyle choice that excludes the city. As far as the people go, different people are everywhere, I’m sure you’ll eventually meet friends and fit in. Boring is the price you pay for safe, quiet, low crime.
We found and chose our Realtor when we attended the OH of a very wisely priced property (being sold, with her help, by people who were not in foreclosure). Turns out, this agent signs on only with sellers who have their eyes open on the market realities. This makes her a shrewd buyer’s agent as well.
Groove77,
Did you consider or apply to Magnet schools? There is an elementary schools fair held by CPS on October 3rd so you can get more info on Magnet schools and different programs CPS has.
Magnet schools…hhahhaahhaha. 434 applications for 34 spots in the kindergarten class.
LOL good luck getting into a magnet school unless your kid is child einstein or a native american
My son got into pre-K program in Magnet school. Lots of reserach, paperwork and phone calls but it worked! And I think it’s easier at elementary school level than HS.
“Did you consider or apply to Magnet schools?”
312 the wifey talked to the VP at the magent/academey that i went to they said “come in after the first month of school we will talk”. We are 4 years before he starts school, so we have time. It would be awesome if i can get him into the school i went to even if he doesnt “test in”. maybe they will hook up an alum 🙂
sonies,
“LOL good luck getting into a magnet school unless your kid is child einstein or a native american”
When its gets close to the wire i am going to do what my mom did for me annoy the alderman and principal.
short,
If we do move i will be asking sabrina to get us in contact to get your realtor or use Eric Rojas 🙂
HD,
“Magnet schools…hhahhaahhaha. 434 applications for 34 spots in the kindergarten class”
it is a corrupt insane system. its sucks and is another hassle of family life in the city. but 312forever learned that persistence and patients does win out most of the time.
Give it some years HD you will be battling the CPS too 🙂
shoot i am four years away and already battling the CPS (as you can tell a plan too far ahead)
“Boring is the price you pay for safe, quiet, low crime.”
C’mon.
“LOL good luck getting into a magnet school unless your kid is child einstein or a native american”
Dude, do you believe everything you read in the Tribune? Groovester bigger issue is the lack of magnet school remotely near his house, no?
“I think it’s easier at elementary school level than HS.”
Yes, b/c (1) more options of magnet programs, (2) more acceptable alternatives, (3) no ‘burbanites trying to lie their way in (as there are at HS level), among other things.
“Give it some years HD you will be battling the CPS too”
Dude, HD’s the great defender of the NW burbs. If he has kids, he’s jettin’.
Which, btw, is a fine choice, but isn’t (and wouldn’t, under all likely scenarios, at least as to NW ‘burbs) be mine.
312, with odds of less than 1 in 10 to get into disney ii, I don’t think annoying the alderman or principal is going to get you very far. Or if by ‘annoy’ you really mean ‘give think white envelopes stuffed full of cash’ then maybe you’ve got a shot.
Groove, I will not be battling the CPS – I will be supporting our parochial school system even if that means I have to cut back in other areas of life.
anon(tfo), the nw burbs is nice because it’s familiar, but I also have considered some of the sw burbs by the palos forest preserves, the La Grange area, OP/RF, Evanston, St. Charles/Batavia/Geneva, and a hand of others. The problem as discussed before is that most housing in these upper-middle to upper income ‘hoods is still priced as if it’s 2006 when it needs to be priced like it’s 1999 (to reference the Prince song). In 1999 my household income would have bought me at least an average house on an average block in anyone of the places above, but today, the tear downs aren’t even in my price range. The staff I work with and the older lawyers I know bought pre-bubble and with the crazy appreciation most wouldn’t be able to afford their homes today!
p.s. was up and down the beautiful north shore this weekend and I saw tons and tons of ‘for sale signs’, they were about as common as the squirrels and sparrows. However, the redfin showed that prices are way out of whack and inventory is languishing on the market for months and month….even the ‘rich’ don’t have income to buy $600,000 starter homes these days.
“odds of less than 1 in 10 to get into disney ii”
Yeah, b/c basically every parent w/o serious issues (i.e., borderline DCFS-material; or total non-english speakers) has their kids taking the test and close to half get below-average (not among the test-takers, bell-curve below-average) scores.
The gifted schools aren’t for average-ish kids with pushy parents, they’re for very-much-above average kids. Like 2.5+ sigma. It’s a grade-plus level ahead. Should high school failures get into Harvard, just b/c their parents are pushy?
“I also have considered some of the sw burbs by the palos forest preserves, the La Grange area, OP/RF, Evanston, St. Charles/Batavia/Geneva”
I know the lefty-ishness (I just call it corruption) of Chicago politics bugs you, so I *strongly* suggest you knock OPRF off your list.
If we could deal with the commute, we’d seriously consider St Chux/Geneva. But you may as well move to Des Moines, cuz it’s about the same.
There’s a handful of righties in OP/RF; they won’t tell you their little secret until you get a few beers in them, but they’re out there, and I know a handful. RF is less left than OP.
“There’s a handful of righties in OP/RF”
Oh, so you just like to complain. Fair enough.
“RF is less left than OP.”
And Stalin was less of a Marxist than Lenin. So?
I was in the exurbs this weekend (yorkville… ugh don’t ask)… and its basically Iowa with higher taxes and cost of living.
Sonies brings up a good point. For some reason suburbs and exurbs here still command premium pricing to places they represent, like Iowa, for no real reason than the RE monkeys think they are x miles from Chicago and a house costs y in Chicago.
They’re delusional. I don’t think anyone here can make a reasonable case that because Yorkville is an hour or more from Chicago by train that its properties should be priced anywhere near city properties. Yet for some reason they believe in a premium.
Lets see how long the premium lasts once the government interventionist measures are removed.
Yorkville has a slight premium over BFE Iowa because you can drive to Chicago to work a decent salaried job. And most of them do and often devote 20-25% of their income just to gas and car payments. In BFE Iowa there are no jobs within an hour commute that pay anything near the Chicago jobs. Furthermore, exurbs like Yorkville have been taking a real beating this housing boom and prices have been falling like a rock. The only reason places like Yorkville even exist is because it became too expensive to live in Aurora or Plainfield, which in and of itself sounds crazy.
all this talk about RF got me hungry for jonnies beef! guess what the grooves will be eating tonight???
anon,
“Groovester bigger issue is the lack of magnet school remotely near his house”
i havent checked lately and probably should but it thought Magnets bus kids in from all other hoods?
“If we could deal with the commute, we’d seriously consider St Chux/Geneva”
i almost fell out of my chair, anon in st charles!!!!!!!!!! say it anit so, say it aint so.
Aurora, Plainfield, montgomery, osweego all brought to you courtesy of the bubble. Especially Montgomery and plainfield.
What about non-BFE Iowa, then, HD? What about a burb of Davenport?
Why should exurbs of Chicagoland cost 2x what a house does in Davenport, Iowa? I can guarantee you the daily living is quite similar. Its called riding the coattails of the city. And its not going to last at all.
Also most jobs in Davenport pay similar to professional jobs in Chicago. Sure there may be no management consultants, i-bankers or big law partners, but these represent such a small segment of earners in Chicago its laughable.
“I don’t think anyone here can make a reasonable case that because Yorkville is an hour or more from Chicago by train that its properties should be priced anywhere near city properties. Yet for some reason they believe in a premium.”
Is this actually true? I haven’t done an exurb comparison … well, ever, b/c it’s just not interesting to me personally in any way. Are houses on the far side of nowhere (but within 5-10 miles of a metra station) priced “anywhere near city properties”?
Just a FYI, Yorkville is 50+ miles (as the crow flies) from the loop. Which translates to a 2+ hour commute each way! Yeah totally worth it…. not.
We had to take the metra out to Rt. 59 (1 hr.) and then drive in a car for 40 minutes from route 59 to get to this person’s house!
Bob, I will agree with your theory IF jobs in Davenport pay similar wages to Chicago jobs then housnig prices should be the same. I’m guessing a mechanic in the chicago area probably makes a bit more than a similar mechanic in davenport but I may be wrong. However, by near chicago no one means just Chicago proper but the chicagoland area including chicago. I had a client who lived in Yorkville on a small estate but flipped properties on the southside for a living. I have another laborer client who lives in Lockport but commutes daily to rosemont. I have another client who lives in Ottawa! – but commutes throughout the entire area to work .. he spends hours and hours a week driving. There is decent paying work all over the metro area not just downtown chicago. I’m not saying it’s a great idea to live in Plainfield but you can get a house, decent schools and a yard for your wife and two kids for $200k whereas buys a 1 bedroom condo conversion in a decent area in the city. I’d consider commuting an hour each way to give my family a ‘better’ life. Hell I commuted an hour each way to my part-time job on the red line from roger’s park to downtown nearly everyday for 5 years during college. It’s no biggie.
“Also most jobs in Davenport pay similar to professional jobs in Chicago. Sure there may be no management consultants, i-bankers or big law partners, but these represent such a small segment of earners in Chicago its laughable.”
“priced “anywhere near city properties”?”
Maybe they are at a discount to city properties. But I’d prefer to compare exurb properties in Chicagoland to exurb properties in other cities with similar weather.
And basically from my observations the Chicagoland exurbs are the only ones that have a huge premium to others where the weather gets freakin’ cold.
Goto the exurbs of Cincinnati/Indy and you can get a mansion for 450k. Here its a so-so house. Doesn’t add up. Lots of coattails riding from city properties is my hypothesis. And in this correction theres going to be a lot of coattail trimming.
No reason a nice house in Harvey should go for 500k whereas same house in West Chester, OH goes for 240k. Wages aren’t that much different.
“priced “anywhere near city properties”?”
Maybe they are at a discount to city properties. But I’d prefer to compare exurb properties in Chicagoland to exurb properties in other cities with similar weather.
And basically from my observations the Chicagoland exurbs are the only ones that have a huge premium to others where the weather gets freakin’ cold.
Goto the exurbs of Cincinnati/Indy and you can get a mansion for 450k. Here its a so-so house. Doesn’t add up. Lots of coattails riding from city properties is my hypothesis. And in this correction theres going to be a lot of coattail trimming.
No reason a nice house in Huntley should go for 500k whereas same house in West Chester, OH goes for 240k. Wages aren’t that much different.
bob,
your from ohio right?
to me there is a big difference in the exurbs in chicago than say a yorkville plainfield.
i have family over in dayton OH. every years i go visit and want to tear out my liver and eat it thinkingi have to go back next year.
forgot the meds sorry
to me there is a big difference in the exurbs in chicago than say a burb of indy or cleveland
“No reason a nice house in Harvey should go for 500k whereas same house in West Chester, OH goes for 240k.”
You can leave off the second clause. There is no reason a house in Harvey should go for $500k.
And, indeed, there isn’t a house in harvey currently listed for more than $299k, and that one is 2900 SF, has 7 BRs and is totally overpriced (listed since 10-08, orig list = $339k). The 2d most expensive current listing is $198k. That’s probably overpriced, too.
Move a little west ot Orland Park, and one can get a 3 or 4 BR/2 Ba ranch-y house (dated, but okay looking) for the mid to upper-200s. Sure, there are a *lot* of $750k+ houses in Orland, but they are mainly (1) v. large–4000+ SF, (2) on golf courses, on (3) 1/4 acre+ lots (i.e., 4 City lots) and (4) still under $200 SF.
Moving out to the described Yorkville, along with the corn fields, there are houses staring on the $140s (mostly THs and REO, looking quickly) and a lot of houses over $400k (tho the over $500k segment is dominated by houses on over 2.5 acres), there are a number of mid-200s houses that are less than 5 years old and over 2500SF, including a $249k 4/2.5 with 3000+ SF.
So, A brief tour of the south ‘burbs.
Bob:
Sorry, you cannot compare an armpit like Ohio to living anywhere within reasonable commuting distance to Chicago. Personally, I can’t stand the suburbs, but I get why people pay a bit more to live in them here than say the suburbs/exburbs of much smaller cities.
What you have to realize is that there is substantially more career options here than an exburb in Ohio.
One of my favorite cities is Kansas City and my wife and I often dream about moving there and all the house we can get for the money. However, the reality is that the career options are pretty limited, particularly if you don’t want to stay at the same company for ever. That isn’t the case in the metro Chicago area…
Groove,
Yes there are people who one burb or another isn’t a perfect substitute merely because of where they grew up. But for those moving to or from (transplants), they’re basically the same.
Even if you agree a burb of Dayton isn’t comparable to Huntley, a similar percentage of people from those burbs in Dayton would agree, I suspect, and be unwilling to move for the same price.
So assuming equilibrium in terms of demand why should a house in Huntley cost over twice what a house in a Dayton burb costs?
Because Ohio sucks at least 10x worse than the chicagoland area!
“to me there is a big difference in the exurbs in chicago than say a burb of indy or cleveland”
And, Bob, there’s your answer: There are many more people around Chicago who think like Groove than there are who think like you.
Oh, and Groovo, we couldn’t bear up under the commute, so there’s no St Chux for us unless the little tfos have no City HS option aside from Lakeview (or turn into/start hangin with miscreants like you were) and we *have* to find a non-terrible open enrollment HS. But that shouldn’t be an issue until after the Rio Olympics*, so there’s not much to worry ’bout for now.
*BRA-SIL! BRA-SIL! BRA-SIL!
oops. Misread Huntley as Harvey.
Huntley: Out of 225 MLS + FSBO listed houses (may include some THs, but excludes ID’ed Foreclosures), there are 10 (TEN) at $499,900 or more. There are a ton (95, to be exact) of small-ish but nice-ish houses listed for under $250k.
So, yeah, there’s no reason to pay $500k in Huntley, either.
“And, Bob, there’s your answer: There are many more people around Chicago who think like Groove than there are who think like you.”
Well my first post mistakenly put Harvey down, which I’m not familiar with. But in terms of comparing exurbs: Groove is from here so he’s biased. Similarly people from Dayton/Cincy/Cleveland burbs would be similarly biased with regard to where they’re from.
I picked Huntley because I saw some new SFHs advertised there but apparently those are the exception not the norm. Lets compare regular burbs then.
The only real reason(s) the city of Chicago should have a premium pricing to other midwest cities (in my view) are: incomes and transplants driving up the real cost of housing (breaking the equilibrium). So it makes sense to a degree in the city “green zone” hoods, and walkability factors not found elsewhere in the midwest.
But when we’re talking about burbs/exurbs–transplants don’t typically move to Schaumburg from West Chester, Ohio for a commensurately better quality of life. Because they are almost exactly similar. Yet a nice house in West Chester is 200-275k, double that for Schaumburg. Somehow I doubt incomes are double for Schaumburg. I suspect its just increased debt fueling this ‘premium’.
“Yet a nice house in West Chester is 200-275k, double that for Schaumburg.”
Okay, just to be apple:apples, what are the fundamental elements of the “nice house” in West Chester? Bed/Bath, approx SF, new construction or older. I’ll find a few comps in a couple different “average” ‘burbs, so we can be talking ’bout the same thing.
Bob:
Schaumburg has Motorola and tons of other large companies in the surrounding area. Yeah, the QOL sucks imho in Schaumburg, but the difference is that Schaumburg and other burbs are where a lot of people who want larger houses and that crappy suburban lifestyle choose to live and they have the incomes to support the house prices.
Other than the houses being tract homes, I don’t think you can reasonably compare Schaumburg to an Ohio suburb…
Bob,
I see your point and agree with ya “transplants driving up the real cost of housing”. and your huntley to west cheater OH was a good valid comparison even if anon disagree’s (schaumburg should never be compared to anything, schaumburg is a shythole).
i would however take a house on west cheaster ohio before a house in bucktown/wicker park
anon,
“Oh, and Groovo, we couldn’t bear up under the commute, so there’s no St Chux for us unless the little tfos have no City HS option aside from Lakeview (or turn into/start hangin with miscreants like you were) and we *have* to find a non-terrible open enrollment HS”
you may get lucky with the HS if not have the back up plan like us. We have a parochial school fund just-in-case and if we get luck for CPS it will roll into the college fund unless charlie schwab doesent “Fee” my account to death.
I agree with Bob. I’ll say there should be a slight premium for the Chicago burbs for various reasons listed above. I also think that people are just used to higher prices in Chicago so they don’t think twice about it when they move from the city.
But the day that I eventually head to the suburbs will also be the day I go back to Detroit. I work in Highland Park and I can tell you it’s very similar to Rochester Hills, MI or a number of cities in Oakland County. I haven’t done a lot of comparisons but I’d guess prices are 30-40% lower in OC than the north shore with very similar standard of living.
Bob,
That is where you are wrong. I’m rather sure that incomes in Schaumburg are much higher than what they are in West Chester, Ohio.
HQs of tons of business (and regional HQs for many more), are all located in Schaumburg and the surrounding areas.
People need to realize that every high paying white collar job in the Chicagoland isn’t in the Loop.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Corridor
I mean you’ve got the global HQ of Motorola in Schaumburg proper. What exactly does West Chester, OH have again?
kp, russ:
I completely disagree. West Chester has high paying jobs as well. General Electric has multiple offices there for different business units. Also a bunch of healthcare companies. There are tons of office parks that sprung up along the highway over the past 15 years and companies love the area because its unincorporated and not subject to Ohio’s ridiculous city taxes and its in between Cincy & Dayton.
I can compare it because I’ve lived in both, worked for Fortune500 companies in both. The differences you are imagining don’t exist in actuality. Are other incomes lower aside from the corporate sector? Undoubtedly. But noting on the magnitude of the differential in housing costs, maybe 20% on the whole.
And yes the QOL sucks, just as it does in Schaumburg. The difference is probably mortgagors in other midwest burbs probably aren’t levered up their arse on their mortgage because people assume there should be some inherent premium because Schaumburg is more ‘cosmopolitan’.
The crux of your arguments rests in the fact that “its different here” and I can absolutely tell you no, in the Chicago burbs it definitely is not different at all.
anon(tfo): the houses I am thinking about are two level, built within the past 30 years, ~2500sf and two car garages with a yard.
So West Chester is really more like Lisle/Warrenville
Bob, wealthier areas like Chicago cost more money because there is more money chasing fewer goods, sort of like inflation. Compare that with Detroit, where there is less money chasing more goods, and prices are depressed. West Chester Ohio may have a better equilibrium than Detroit or Chicago. However, the degree to which it should cost more is relative to wages, which I presume are more in Chicago than West Chester. The bubble threw things out of whack entirely; it would almost be better to use housing prices/wages from pre-bubble, like 1997, to compare income to housing differences.
“your huntley to west cheater OH was a good valid comparison even if anon disagree’s ”
Hell, I know nothing about West Chester beyond what Bob tells me. The only two-word West Chester I knew existed (before today) in suburban Philly. And Huntley is a blip on the Tollway headed west.
“i would however take a house on west cheaster ohio before a house in bucktown/wicker park”
But Groovo, BT/WP is groovy and, as noted above, “Ohio sucks at least 10x worse than Chicagoland” and Gary is in Chicagoland and (as we all know) Gary is the a$$hole of the universe, ergo, Ohio must be something very, very bad. They might even call you name outside a Burger King in Ohio.
Bob:
There are high paying jobs everywhere. However, the number of them and the desire of workers to live in a certain area are the difference; that is what your comparison is failing to take into account imho.
Yes, the homes are equally as putrid. The commute sucks. BUT the demographics are different.
For instance, NJ suburbs an hour outside of NY are very expensive, yet the homes are no different than the ones in West Chester I bet. Yet, I assure you the NJ suburbs go at a significant premium as there are enough people who want to live within 1 hour of NY and the employers in the surrounding area to raise the prices of the homes.
The inner ring burbs always are going to command a premium. However, when you start getting way the f*ck out, I think the prices are more in line with what you think they should be. However, at that point, it is an ENTIRELY different market. Plaifield ain’t Schaumburg…
Inner ring burbs aren’t commanding a premium nowadays in fact they’re turning kind of crappy. Berwyn, Cicero, melrose park, skokie, niles, des plaines, all the way south, are kind of crappy.
It’s a pretty interesting point bob is making. Is it that much better to be 1+ drive from chicago than an hour plus drive from whatever city west chester is near? Is that what people are paying the premium for?
“Gary is the a$$hole of the universe”
classic 🙂
“Plaifield ain’t Schaumburg”
yeah cause schaumburg is everything that is wrong with the burbs and everything wrong with society.
“They might even call your name outside a Burger King in Ohio.”
heheeheheeh, i just had burger, king first time in a long time, this weekned WTF happend to there fries?
I suppose I could see two legitimate stances here, one being along the lines of there are more well-paying jobs in schaumburg (for example) than other midwestern suburbs, and different demographics, etc., thus increasing demand and prices.
The other argument is from the individual’s perspective and based on the assumption that they can get similar jobs in two different areas and that they would make a similar salary. In that scenario they can get the same QOL for a much lower price in the suburbs of Detroit, Indy, Ohio, etc. Or a higher QOL for the same price.
But the truth is most of us have a connection to a city and we want to stay there, regardless of prices. I’ll happily go back to Detroit when the time comes but I wouldn’t randomly move to West Chester just because I can afford a better home. Someone who has a personal attachment to the Chicago area is going to pay extra to live in s’burg because they just don’t want to live outside Indy or Detroit, even if it’s a better investment.
HD:
Probably should have been more specific. Those areas are “inner” but not really the same type of suburb. I am thinking Naperville, Schaumburg, et al.
Groove:
Both suck in their own way. One is a step or two above a trailer park and the militia while the other is a bastion of McMansions, shopping malls, and blandness.
CH: The premium is there due to the demographics. The number of high paying jobs, commuters, and proximity to a world class city are the factors. It is like this outside of any major city. The suburbs are relatively expensive – NY, Boston, LA, SF, Chicago, DC. Much less so in smaller cities – Atlanta, Charlotte, Indianapolis, KC, St. Louis.
“Gary is in Chicagoland and (as we all know) Gary is the a$$hole of the universe”
“We?” Gary has Miller Beach, which is still nice and very unique.
Ford Heights, on the other hand….
Ford Heights is very very bad. Very bad. This is an old story but but it gives you the general feeling of the place.
http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19951104&slug=2150599
“This is an old story but but it gives you the general feeling of the place.”
Since then, much/most of the referenced public housing has been torn down and about 30% of the residents have moved or died.
It’s not that much different that a huge swath of rural america; it just happens to be in Cook County.
Which isn’t to say Ford Heights is anything other than an unfortunate little burg that would be better lost to memory. But that won’t happen, becuase the dozen or two people who run the place would have to give up their easy jobs and petty fiefdoms.
never been to ford heights is it like bellwood?
Ford Heights is way worse than Bellwood. Only place I’ve been that’s worse than Ford Heights is Roseland or Gary.
Gary is like the twilight zone just strange vibes there. i have only been there once……once. not going back (anyone get the johnny dangerously reference)
eric you never answered my question 🙁
you seem like an ethical reasonable Realtor, could you provide some insight for me.
lets say you have a potential client who would like to list there home at 600k when the bought it for 500k in 2007. (no upgrades since purchase except maybe a new bathroom it cost 10k and the planted flowers) what does a realtor do, talk the owners down from the ledge explain to them the market, provide comps to show the market. then if they will only budge to 550k would you still take their business?
also another question too,
why are realtor afraid of floorplans with there listings?
“why are realtor afraid of floorplans with there listings?”
I don’t think most are “afraid”; it’s just that, in most cases, it would cost $$ to generate one (or to pay the developer for theirs–>developers don’t generally give anything away), and no one is interested in fronting the cost.
There is a wide range of software (some of it shareware/freeware) that can easily produce a workable floorplan. I can’t see any reasonable excuse for not doing one.
They cant do it themselves?
all it takes is $100 for a laser tape measure, $1.50 for a note book, $1 for a pack of pencils and about 30 minutes.
“They cant do it themselves?”
Dude, you actually asked that question?
90% of them can’t do anything with numbers except multiply by 3%.
anon
thank you for the morning laugh 🙂
hey you wanna start a side business we can charge $100 per floor flat fee and add on for travel, “Groove and Anon (tfo)’s floor plan emporium”
“hey you wanna start a side business we can charge $100 per floor flat fee and add on for travel, “Groove and Anon (tfo)’s floor plan emporium””
Sounds like a plan (ha). And it would make WL hella happy (and the rest of us, too, as it would be one less item in the “NYC is soooo much better than your cowtown” list).
There’s laser tape measurers? Wow, what an age we live in!
Groove and Anon (tfo)’s floor plan emporium
ok so we will go halfsies on the laser and i will get the paper and pencil and we will use your computer. we can get west loops conections for referrals!
sonies,
hey we also have the phonograph and abacus too 🙂
anon
we also can use my car for the travel! i can use it for the tax write off.
eric will you be our first client?
Like Chicagoland realtors would ever be okay with including floorplans with their listings?
Remember a floorplan presents the space in an upfront, detailed fashion. Given how overpriced most listings are in Chicagoland, the realtors would prefer to sell via omitting information and sometimes outright disinformation. Let the potential buyers waste a trip to come see the place, that way they have already invested something in it (their time).
Think about it: if you’re a potential buyer and interested in thirty properties, you can get a pretty good idea of their layout with floorplans at a computer screen in a few hours. If you have to tour them it will take days and you’ll be exhausted and perhaps closer to capitulation.
bob has now shot down our business plan (all valid points too)
is this the longest thread in CC that has nothing to do with the property?
ok this thread is now dead,
i will miss you “Let groove talk all about his egocentric self” thread.
it was fun but all good things must end.
my last chance to keep this thread alive before sabrina boots me from posting irrelevant chatter 🙂