Does Parking Matter? A Vintage 3-Bedroom Duplex Down: 1927 N. Hudson in Lincoln Park
This 3-bedroom duplex down at 1927 N. Hudson in Lincoln Park recently came on the market.
If you’re wondering why it is listed for $64,000 over the 2005 purchase price- the listing says it was completely renovated since 2005.
Built in 1884, the unit was a 2-bedroom until the large lower level bedroom was converted into 2 bedrooms making it a 3-bedroom unit.
The master bedroom is on the main floor.
The unit has retained some of its vintage features including built-ins in the dining room, 10 foot ceilings and crown molding.
The listing says there is a new cook’s kitchen with white cabinets, stainless steel appliances and granite counter tops.
It has central air and in-unit washer/dryer but the one thing it is missing is parking.
There is no deeded parking with the unit- just rental parking nearby.
Does parking matter in this location?
Megan Brown at Coldwell Banker has the listing. See the pictures and a virtual tour here.
Unit #1: 3 bedrooms, 2 baths, 1915 square feet
- Sold in August 1998 for $255,000
- Sold in November 2005 for $455,000
- Currently listed for $519,000
- Assessments of $125 a month
- Taxes of $8540
- Central Air
- In-unit washer/dryer
- No parking
- Bedroom #1: 18×12 (main level)
- Bedroom #2: 12×9 (lower level)
- Bedroom #3: 12×8 (lower level)
- Family room: 19×16 (lower level)
Nice enough place, especially the LR, obviously. Don’t believe it can overcome the cramped kitchen and, most importantly, the 2 BR’s down, with the master up. That cuts out, what, 99% of potential (family) buyers? Who is gonna buy this? Retirees?
Extremely cramped unit overall. How can this one go for over $500K?
I give the homeowners here alot of credit, they made the place as lovely as it could get.
If it weren’t a dup-down, even without parking, would go at $500kish. If it weren’t a dup-down, and had garage parking for one car, it might go for $600kish. But because it’s a dup-down, I cannot even speculate what it should go for.
Those bedrooms look like dungeons to me.
“Extremely cramped unit overall. How can this one go for over $500K?”
according to Clio people want to live here and will pay a premium for it.
I was pretty much indifferent to duplex down units… until I joined the Cribbchatter.
“# of Bedrooms (Above Grade): 3 ”
How can they claim that?
Is that a fireplace in the lower bedroom? Does the baby’s room have a window?
Seems like it would be a *very* nice place for a couple with frequent guests, but it’s tough living space for a family (at the price, of course–would be *wonderful* for a family for $1500/month).
I agree with the dungen comment.
“according to Clio people want to live here and will pay a premium for it.”
Uhhh – I never said that people want to live here. I have never seen this unit before. That being said, it ABSOLUTELY worth the asking price. You guys are crazy when you think that 500k is going to buy you an SFH in some great area. If you only have 500k to spend you get this in this location. If you want to move to the suburbs, you can get a lot more – but you are NOT going to get a mansion or very nice place in lincoln park for 500k – you just arent and the sooner you guys realize this, the sooner we can have more meaningful discussions on real estate
“Seems like it would be a *very* nice place for a couple with frequent guests”
Except for the parking part. And if they lived close enough to take public transportation, they would probably not being staying over.
“Except for the parking part. And if they lived close enough to take public transportation, they would probably not being staying over.”
Which airline flies your guests’ car in for them?
Seriously, tho, you know people who give up their garage space for their out-of-town guests? Whenever we have company, they park on the street.
““# of Bedrooms (Above Grade): 3 ”
How can they claim that?”
Well, they also claim to have a garage space — “Garage: 1” Not sure how they can justify claiming a rental space as your own. Wouldn’t that be like claiming an indoor pool, since you can use one at the health club down the street?
“Seriously, tho, you know people who give up their garage space for their out-of-town guests? Whenever we have company, they park on the street.”
Caught myself extrapolating my position onto potential buyers. I don’t even have a car now (I do, but it’s a classic musclecar that I don’t bring into the city very often) but would not buy a place that didn’t have parking. So I guess I was thinking from the perspective that my guests would have my space to park in because I wasn’t using it. You make a good point. Although, this area is very difficult to find street parking in regardless. I live in the Gold Coast and could buy street guest passes for my neighborhood, but I don’t because my guests can’t find places to park even if they do have passes.
Considering that those W Grant places went for over $400, and they were much smaller (and uglier?), I think this has a shot. Perhaps not at full ask but we’ll see. That basement family room is a huge plus, as well as being in Lincoln Elementary boundaries.
“Although, this area is very difficult to find street parking in regardless. I live in the Gold Coast and could buy street guest passes for my neighborhood, but I don’t because my guests can’t find places to park even if they do have passes.”
No question, but if your driving-in guests could arrive after 9 and before 4 (and, of course, you’d advise that), they’d be much more able to stake out a spot around here and they aren’t likely to move the car ’til they leave. So, not as convenient as a 8 car driveway in Barrington, but not totally unacceptable.
Which, btw, is pretty much how I feel about those dinky, lower-level bedrooms–totally unacceptable for kids, but, combined back together, a *great* guest room.
“Although, this area is very difficult to find street parking in regardless.”
Typical ignorance from this website. I live a couple blocks from this listing and anything between north ave and armitage is some of the easiest street parking in the city. Seems like a very fair price considering that 1749 Fern Court (3br/1.5b/1300 sq feet/no parking) sold for $660k a couple weeks ago.
“Uhhh – I never said that people want to live here. I have never seen this unit before. That being said, it ABSOLUTELY worth the asking price. You guys are crazy when you think that 500k is going to buy you an SFH in some great area. If you only have 500k to spend you get this in this location. If you want to move to the suburbs, you can get a lot more – but you are NOT going to get a mansion or very nice place in lincoln park for 500k – you just arent and the sooner you guys realize this, the sooner we can have more meaningful discussions on real estate”
OK don’t jump down my throat because I’ll admit that I’m no real estate expert — But, are there really that many people (for whom this place would be appropriate) who want to live in Lincoln Park that badly? Maybe I’m just not a Lincoln Park (or Old Town or East Lakeview) fan (I’m in Andersonville). If I have two or three kids, the space and a workable floorplan would far outweigh the cache of having a Lincoln Park address.
Btw — I think this place is very nice, but not with kids. (Apparently the sellers agree).
I live in the neighborhood and I have to say that street parking is not an issue, because of permit parking and so many of the larger homes/townhomes have garages. There seems to be a prejudice by many on this site for duplex downs, as if DD stood for dark & damp. The pix of the lower level look very open and light. Also it’s Lincoln School district and not new construction. The vintage duplex-down a block away at 1849 Cleveland (featured in January) is “under contract” now.
“If I have two or three kids, the space and a workable floorplan would far outweigh the cache of having a Lincoln Park address. ”
Also outweigh the right to send the kids to Lincoln Elem and, if you’re in for the long haul, LPHS (if/when they don’t get into a S-E HS)? Because for *parents* buying into compromise-type* housing in LP, the school is a more significant issue than the “address”.
*yeah, $500k for a “compromise”; I’ll shoot myself when I get home.
“Seriously, tho, you know people who give up their garage space for their out-of-town guests? Whenever we have company, they park on the street.”
Well, parking is not that difficult around where I am, or I would guess around you. If it were difficult, I’d give my garage spot or offer to go park the car for *certain* visitors, such as my in-laws (who are not out-of-town, well they are but not in the way you’re using the term, but I’m not sure that matters, though I realize that was the initial context).
parking is usually a non issue around here, esp when compared to other parts of the green zone. Not sure exactly why but seems like you can always get a spot close by on the street. Like I said before the only time that it was an issue was when the air and water show was going on, that day sucked.
“If it were difficult, I’d give my garage spot or offer to go park the car for *certain* visitors, such as my in-laws”
Oh, I’d certainly do the park and walk back thing, too, if necessary, and do/have done the “park in front of the house to save the space then move back to the garage” thing for ease of loading/unloading.
I doubt that having two kids is why these sellers want out. Likely motivating factors: (i) they are about to have a third kid; (ii) they are being re-located out of Chicago for work; (iii) one of the earners just became a partner, etc., and they’re looking to move up to the $1.2ish million range; (iv) they are sick of not having a garage, or at least a parking space, on-site; or (iv) they’re fed up with having half of their home, however nice it may be, located in the basement.
Raising a family at this location is not about the “cache” of having a Lincoln Park address. It’s about Lincoln elementary, Oz Park, and being a short walk to the zoo/park/lakefront.
p.s. I like Andersonville very much. And I know some folks there with young kids. But while they enjoy quicker access to Foster Beach (i.e., quicker than me), it’s generally a bit of a to-do for them to take the kids to the zoo/conservatory/nature musuem/south pond nature board walk, and the distance to the children’s museum/shedd/field/science and industry/art institute/millenium park is that much farther as well. It’s just a lot easier to pop in and out of all of the foregoing places for an hour or two when you live (approximately) south of Diversey and (roughly) east of Halsted, in my decidedly less than humble and not at all unbiased opinion.
I live in this area too, and I’d echo that it’s not about the cache of having a Lincoln Park address, but it’s about the public schools, walkability, proximity to green space, bike lanes and paths, zoo, beach, retail, the Loop, as well as the beauty of the neighborhood. People, especially those with children, do pay a premium for all that.
Fancy condo in Lincoln Park and their two kids sleep in the basement? This is not healthy; I wonder if kids’ pediatrician knows about the sleeping arrangements.
LOL, I’m pretty sure I could rent a better 3BR in LP and continue waiting this madness out. Sorry Clio, owning is not the only option.
O.K., tipster, if not G, then perhaps you can point me to some listings that meet the Unicorn Criteria (to rent for under $3k/mo)…
To aid in your search, the original Unicorn Criteria are as follows:
* No more than $3,000/month rent
* ELP (east of Halsted)
* Lincoln attendance area (an exception would be made for an extraordinary opportunity between Lakeview Ave and Clark and Fullerton and Diversey)
* Two bedrooms
* Two bathrooms, including a master bathroom
* Garage (deeded or permanently designated)
* W/D in unit
* Central A/C
* Wood floors
* Kitchen cannot be open to the living room (it can be open to the dining area, but not to the living room; an exception would be if there is a separate family/television room)
* Unit cannot be on ground or lower first floor (unless it’s a townhome or rowhouse)
The following are criteria that I don’t think I included in the original Unicorn Criteria, but would include them now, as they are highly preferred:
* A powder room/half bath (this one really is a must)
* Some kind of private outdoor space (even if very small)
* While Halsted is (according to many people, rightly or wrongly) the western “ELP” boundary, the western side of Oz Park (i.e., Larrabee/Geneva) is the preferred western boundary (east of Clark is optimal, but I’m realistic)
* Regardless of building type, there should either be no units above, or the construction must be such that no sounds can be heard from the unit above
having a LP address + kids(plural) + no car or a car without on-site parking = fail
“LOL, I’m pretty sure I could rent a better 3BR in LP and continue waiting this madness out. Sorry Clio, owning is not the only option.”
“O.K., tipster, if not G, then perhaps you can point me to some listings that meet the Unicorn Criteria (to rent for under $3k/mo)…”
anonny, the subject property, that Tipster finds unappealing to purchase for $500k, is *FAR* sort of the UC:
-only 50% hardwood
-no garage and, indeed, no parking
-it’s ground and below ground floor
-no powder room
-no (? deck off master?) private outdoor space
-units above
Nor was it suggested that this could be done for less on a monthly basis, but at $3k/month (before tax benefit) with $100k down, this isn’t really under $3k, either.
“I doubt that having two kids is why these sellers want out”
I think they’re moving because raising young adults in two basement bedrooms with no windows is not an option. They can get away with it now while the kids are little.
Agree with anon on all fronts. The bedrooms are not that bad. The baby room looks pretty small and doesn’t appear to have a window, but it’s probably all staged anyway. How much time does your kid really spend in the bedroom? I would rather have the nicer room in the common areas, as here. I would say that it’s a nice starter home for a young couple trying to get into this area, if I didn’t make myself more than a little sick to say something costing half a million is a starter home. Regardless, for this location and school district, and the fact that it has some charm, I think it’s a good price.
Can someone explain why the kitchen can’t open into the living room?
“Can someone explain why the kitchen can’t open into the living room?”
Because anonny doesn’t like it. Wants to have the kitchen as a separate space. **Might** tolerate a kitchen open to a living space, if there is a second living room on the same floor, and a defined, sufficiently large, dining room.
A preference for more “formal” (defined, if you rather) spaces.
Thanks.. had heard UC standards before but never saw them listed before or where they came from. Personally, sans restrictions I personally prefer a kitchen opening into a big breakfast area and a separate family and living room, but if restricted to a 2/2 I would “hugely” prefer a kitchen opening into the living room. I am always cooking stuff and this way I wouldn’t feel separated from others.
Same here and I love to finish my clean up while people are still hanging out so once the guest leave, I can get back to my work.
“I am always cooking stuff and this way I wouldn’t feel separated from others.”
“I live in this area too, and I’d echo that it’s not about the cache of having a Lincoln Park address, but it’s about the public schools, walkability, proximity to green space, bike lanes and paths, zoo, beach, retail, the Loop, as well as the beauty of the neighborhood. People, especially those with children, do pay a premium for all that.”
Isn’t this true of Lakeview too? Better restaurants, movie theater, Wrigley Field, bike paths, retail, green space etc. etc.
Not everyone is looking to buy in a 10 block by 4 block radius- believe it or not. Plenty of people don’t like Lincoln Park (gasp.) Imagine that?
That’s why there are $1 million houses that sell in Lakeview, Andersonville, Edgewater, Sauganash, Edgebrook, the South Loop, Hyde Park, Kenwood, Beverly and on and on and on…
Did anyone else read the Crain’s article about where all the famous people live? I can’t remember if they mentioned any of them living in LP (though several lived in the Gold Coast.) A bunch lived up in Ravenswood/Lincoln Square.
@anony and @michelle–
I guess time will tell if this place will sell at asking. I hope it does.
But, while I do really like the condo, I have 3 kids and there would be no way I’d live here with them (at least at a half million price tag). You may know this already, but as kids get older, they accumulate A TON OF CRAP, and it’s a fricking drag to haul up and down, up and down, up and down stairs when the kids are sick, teething, or beating the crap out of each other. Plus, having the kids on the same level as the rec. room? Say goodbye to having any sort of nice entertainment system because it will be history.
And yeah, Lincoln Park is nice and all, but IMO there are plenty of other great neighborhoods in the city if you have kids (plus Lincoln and Alcott are hardly the only decent neighborhood CPS options in town, see e.g. Audubon, Coonley, Blaine, Burley etc.)
“(plus Lincoln and Alcott are hardly the only decent neighborhood CPS options in town, see e.g. Audubon, Coonley, Blaine, Burley etc.)”
That’s true, those are good schools. However, for me, personally, I simply cannot imagine paying much to live in any of those areas. I have limited non-working, waking hours, and it’s a short life. What little time I do have, I intend to spend it in the nicest possible outdoor environment I can.
I have been following this site for over a year and just recently posted a reply. I find it fascinating to read about the real estate Sabrina highlights, and she has included all areas of the city and with quite good accuracy. The responses tho’ range from the totally un-informed to knowledgeable consumers who have experienced buying/selling in various neighborhoods in Chicago. This could be a tremendously valuable site for potential buyers if only the comments were constructive for the area in discussion. I would not attempt to weigh in on the values in North Center/Andersonville etc….areas that I’m not familiar with. Having lived in a specific area gives much more credence to one’s comments. Susan, Flo,Michelle,mariposa’s comments are objective and constructive..anonny (except for his distaste for DD’s) and Clio seem to understand the market in this area. I applaud Sabrina for bringing this site to the consumers. I only hope that future comments will be constructive, insightful, informative and interesting and without the F bomb if possible!! 🙂
“anonny (except for his distaste for DD’s) and Clio seem to understand the market in this area.”
No Clio is hell bent on trying to do everything he can to hold as much value as he can on his condo in the Gold Coast. He hates the unit, layout, view, and is hoping like hell that the market turns soon so that he can pawn off his condo to the next sucker who has to live in a premier building, not for liking the actually unit, but just to feel better about their ego.
“Isn’t this true of Lakeview too? Better restaurants, movie theater, Wrigley Field, bike paths, retail, green space etc. etc.
Not everyone is looking to buy in a 10 block by 4 block radius- believe it or not. Plenty of people don’t like Lincoln Park (gasp.) Imagine that?”
“And yeah, Lincoln Park is nice and all, but IMO there are plenty of other great neighborhoods in the city if you have kids (plus Lincoln and Alcott are hardly the only decent neighborhood CPS options in town, see e.g. Audubon, Coonley, Blaine, Burley etc.)”
@sabrina and @aob — I completely agree with you. I love many neighborhoods, and people will of course also pay a premium to live in places like Lake View as well, which also has walkability, proximity to the lake, etc. I was just responding to AOB’s comment that people gave up so much just “for the cache of a LP address”. Yes, people make compromises, but it’s for all the amenities that come with this kind of lcoation. And yes, there are absolutely a dozen other neighborhood schools that I’d enroll my child in. I didn’t mean to sound smug — I’m just so glad that we found a spot in the city that works so well for us on so many fronts.
Having said that, I would not make the compromise of giving my child a subterranean bedroom, so I don’t love this property, although the upper level is really nice.
“Considering that those W Grant places went for over $400”
I’m not so sure that they did.
Oh yes $388 for unit c at 429, I am surprised. Wasn’t it listed at $439? Still I think this place is worth more than they were.
It’s been a while since my last French lesson, but I believe the correct word is “cachet” (status, image, that certain je-ne-sais-quoi) with an acute accent over the E, not “cache” (storage locker).
Someone mentioned the problem of having your “young adult” children sleeping on the lower level.
Actually, as I mentioned elsewhere earlier, “young adult” children (generously stretching from mid-teens to college age) often LIKE having basement bedrooms and the ‘rents LIKE putting them down there, along with their noisy stereos, TVs, video game consoles, musical instruments etc.
BTW it’s nice to see that people in LP are supportive of the local public schools, but I suspect that a lot of them send their kids to Parker as well. And what about Catholic schools? I know St. Clement’s has a grade school – does St. Teresa’s as well?
“Oh yes $388 for unit c at 429, I am surprised. Wasn’t it listed at $439?”
I think that one was listed at 400. There was another unit in 437 listed for 360k (!) but it went under contract quickly.
“Oh yes $388 for unit c at 429, I am surprised. Wasn’t it listed at $439? Still I think this place is worth more than they were.”
We chattered about Unit C in 419 W. Grant. But there was another one that sold in 429 recently.
419 was listed for $359,900. It didn’t go under contract “quickly” – unless you call 6 weeks “quick.”
It’s still pending.
http://cribchatter.com/?p=9994
“BTW it’s nice to see that people in LP are supportive of the local public schools, but I suspect that a lot of them send their kids to Parker as well. And what about Catholic schools? I know St. Clement’s has a grade school – does St. Teresa’s as well?”
Most kids we know go to Lincoln, but we know others in the neighborhood who go to LaSalle (also public but a magnet that draws citywide), Catherine Cook, Immaculate Conception, British School, Lycee Francais and Anshe Emet. There are so many public and private options nowadays that Parker and Latin no longer have the monopoly they once did, nor the cachet. That was one thing I noticed when we moved here, that there were tons of elementary-, middle- and high-school-aged kids around the neighborhood, unlike newly gentrified areas, in which we would only see babies and toddlers.
@michelle
” I was just responding to AOB’s comment that people gave up so much just “for the cache of a LP address”.
I actually never said that. In fact, that’s exactly what I questioned in light of Clio’s previous comments. I’m not looking to start a flame war, I’m just trying to understand what kind of buyers would buy this place at 500K.
@JUM, don’t know if your comment was directed to me, but I in fact have lived in LP (although admittedly years ago) and have spent a lot of time in the area. And while I don’t profess to have the experience or knowledge of an investor like Clio, I have bought and sold several properties in my time, so I’m not completely uninformed.
Ok sorry a person should not have to pay half a mil to sleep in a basement.
i dont get this idea, and am shocked that smart people fell for the scam of duplex downs. yes yes a certain price point it can be acceptable but dang it a 1/2mil is not, cannot, and should not be acceptable.
itw a beautiful home and well appointed, but dang it sheeple/lemmings please for the love of whatever please close your check book and stop creating a market for these types of dwellings
“and am shocked that smart people fell for the scam of duplex downs.”
People, on the whole, aren’t as smart or independent minded as you think they are.
“Immaculate Conception?” Isn’t that all the way up on Harlem near the Park Ridge border? St. Clement’s is a lot closer!
““Immaculate Conception?” Isn’t that all the way up on Harlem near the Park Ridge border? St. Clement’s is a lot closer!”
suspect it’s this one:
http://www.icsnorthpark.com/
I lived next door to this place for a year (the building to the right), and rented 4 houses down for two years. Halsted to the Lake, North of North, South of Armitsge could be the most desirable place to live in Chicago-proper. You aren’t going to find any new construction really, aside from the occasional three-flat built in the early to mid 2000’s (and of course SFH). Get used to small bedrooms/weird kitchen layouts and of course, no parking.
I think it’s a fantastic deal. No Parking? Clearly the people who own all of the Cayenne Turbos living on that street don’t mind parking it on Hudson. Parking isn’t a problem at all, aside from the occasional digout in the winter (which actually was a great networking opportunity for me).
It’s an incredible area of a mix of young professionals (renting), young families (owning) and some of Chicago’s wealthiest in SFH. Unlike the Gold Coast’s Dearborn/State Parkway or Astor Street area, people are younger, more approachable and down to earth (IMHO).
Owning a home isn’t necessarily about the ‘deal’. If you have the means to put 20% down, (which I think should be a requirement for household incomes under a certain level) fits most of your criteria, and puts you in a great re-sale area – I think it’s pretty hard to lose in today’s buyers market, in this location. It’s listed at $270/SF. Seems pretty reasonable.
“people gave up so much just for the cache of a LP address”
annony can attest as we have gone back and forth (friendly) about the compromises and premium of a LP address that i cannot fathom.
I love LP its beautiful, and location is darn prime, but to me what you have to give-up and still have to pay extra doesnt exactly sit right with me. IN MY EYES its a rip off to pay those prices for what you really get. (still not as bad or even close of a rip off as wicker/bucktown)
when a person is asked to pay half a mill entrance fee to live in a basement and nobody says “hey that doesnt seem right” then something is f’d up in our society
@JUM, don’t know if your comment was directed to me, but I in fact have lived in LP (although admittedly years ago) and have spent a lot of time in the area. And while I don’t profess to have the experience or knowledge of an investor like Clio, I have bought and sold several properties in my time, so I’m not completely uninformed.
AOB…it was not directed at you…on the contrary I think you do understand LP. But I don’t think people live here for the cache/catchet 🙂 as much as everything Michelle described. I’ve lived in this area for 30+ years and I love being a few blocks to the lake, farm and zoo, Second City and the Brown line amongst lots of other conveniences. If I had lived in Lakeview for the same amount of time, I’m sure I would feel the same way. There’s no question that you get more for your money out of this area, but some people believe it’s worth the compromise.
The majority of commenters here are obviously not willing to pay a premium for location. If you want to be near the lake, this unit is well worth the price. Why? because that is what similar units have recently sold for in this area. If that is not a primary concern, then you can obviously get way more space living anywhere west of halsted or north of fullerton. As far as the duplex down goes, to each his own. There are thousands of such units in the city (mine included), so there are obviously thousands people who find such living desirable. Comparing Gold Coast parking to LP parking is also lunacy. I agree with JUM, a little perspective is needed for different neighborhoods. If you like LP, you would be living there; if you don’t, you obviously don’t live there and wouldnt be willing to pay the premium that most people do.
I think it’s a beautiful home and a very nice block… but the comment about the bedrooms being on seperate levels is a very good. And, well, I have to say — parking does matter! It would be tough to buy a home for half a million and have to rent a spot for my car. Street parking — especially if you have little ones — isn’t something I’d like to deal with in LP. But I really like everything else about the home (even the seperate kitchen).
RiverNorthGuy…You said it all and quite eloquently…for a moment I thought you might have been the owner…seriously tho’ you experienced living on the street and in the neighborhood, and therefore have a lot more credibility than someone just looking at a pix and balking at a half million!
this is one of the best areas in the city. Def a fair price. Street parking is very easy in this area and is never a problem. Why all the hatred for Duplex Downs? They are great and provide 2 living areas instead of 1. RiverNorthGuy nailed it with his comments